why so low cost?

I bought a blackwood, probably 19th century, 8 key, probably made in Germany, from ebay for $81. It has a cracked headjoint but is playable. Must have been fully lined. (item # 375974796). If it is what they say it is, it is worth more. What is going on here? Let me know if you have any ideas, please.

Nelson

Supply and demand Nelson.

Most people won’t buy a flute with a cracked head. Their loss is your gain if its any good. :slight_smile:

Doc

This sort of flute is very common, and the quality is spotty. Some of the are great players, others have bland sound and crappy tuning, so it’s always a crapshoot when you’re bidding on one you’ve never played. Hope you got a diamond in the rough.

It’s not just that it might be out of tune with itself. It is very unlikely to be tuned to the current A=440 standard which means you have an instrument with limited potential for playing with others. Also, what state is the keywork in? There are several ways you can get unlucky.

Thanks for the input guys, it has been shiped and will be here in a few days and I’ll send you a picture and let you know.

Nelson

I bought a similar flute a couple years back. I lucked out in that its intonation was well tempered though not as powerful as one might like for ITM.
Here are sound samples: Gwerz ar Marc’hadourig Bihan
The Fisherman’s

If you are dedicated to the flute you could get more out of it. After repairs it may be worth sending to get reworked by a flutemaker. They can touch up the embouchure, fingerholes, and bore or even make a new head to optimize the tone. Makers like Rod Cameron can turn Pakistani flutes from marginal to excellent. I’m sure likewise could be achieved with a 19th C. German flute. When all is said and done the time and money will be about as much as a new keyless flute.

I probably would have done as much with my own flute but I had a bagpipe to finance so I sold it.

Cheers,
Aaron

Also, re supply and demand, there is a higher demand for large hole Rudall-Rose and Pratten style old flutes for use in Irish music.

There is far less demand for the smaller holed flutes of the Meyer style (which I think you are describing - item no longer listed on ebay), which are not as loud and have a different timbre. These can be much harder to get a good hard, honking low D out of, as well. They were designed to play orchestral music in the upper two octaves, and the lower octave can be less robust.

That said, I bought an 8 keyed “Sears & Roebuck” (no-name) flute off ebay for around $120, superglued a crack in the head joint and in the barrel, thoroughly oiled the wood from the outside-in with almond oil and coated the bore (after cleaning and polishing) with linseed oil (two coats, thourough drying of each), cleaned up and lubricated the keys.

I expected it to be at best marginal, but guess what? Its a marvelous flute, gorgeous tone and well in tune with itself, plays well at 440, loud enough, and easy to drive.

So don’t get discouraged until you’ve given yours a go.

This past summer at East Durham I noted that Mike McHale was playing an old Meyer style flute and making it sing! Check out the clip of Josie McDermott playing a slow air on one of these flutes on the RTE archives video “Come West Along The Road”. If that kind of flute is good enough for those two gentlemen, who’s to argue?

Thanks Larry, I’ll put a picture on the porn thread when it comes. Was the Sears & Robuck fully lined in the head? I like the name Sears & Robuck. As a boy I got a new pair of hightop boots for the winter with a knife pocket on the side.

Nelson.

I tried to find the ebay site listed on your thread but it comes up as not an item number in the search. Could you check the number? I’d love to see it! Then I could give you some restoration ideas.

I just purchased a “Meyer” type, Kohler “Endorsed”, Zimmerman design German flute:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=47102&item=3756436170&rd=1

If you click on this link it will lead you to some great sites featuring german flute types so you can identify which maker influenced your particular design and help you determine the true age.

I did my homework here: thanks to all who contributed!

http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=23238

My flute is wonderful. It has the biggest embouchure hole I have ever seen, like blowing down into a wastebasket! The flute has the reverse conical bore and takes a very light breath to blow. If you get it right, it can be quite loud, but it’s your embouchure and breath control that makes it, not blowing harder. It has a cylinder vibration like a small tornado that travels from top to bottom when you get it right.

I was plain lucky with condition on mine, for the price it was well worth it, the cracks were easily dealt with with super glue, after curing the reasons it split in the first place, I cork greased and rethreaded the tenons, (the reason it split), wrapped the pads in saran wrap smeared with Mink Oil overnight to soften them up, and oiled the bore and exterior with almond oil while the keys were wrapped.

I let it dry for a day and am currently breaking it in by playing five minutes a day and thoughly swabbing and drying after each use. I put a water hydrator tube in the wood case to hydrate the wood of the flute and case at the same time.

It is doing very well, the wood is so dense it seems to feel like cool, smooth stone. I was lucky in that all my keys function also. All 11 of them.

I have experience in clarinet restoration so I had some experience to tackle this. It was well worth it.

As long as your crack isn’t accross the embouchure hole itself, and your your pads and keys are in reasonable shape, you should have a great sounding instrument. A split across the emouchiure hole is disasterous. You have to find a new head, which leads to OFAD, (Old Flute Aquisition Disorder), in which you buy a bunch of old flutes for parts. I have this disorder, which I am currently trying to hold in check. If it needs even repadding it’s going to cost you, or you are going to have to remove the keys and attempt making new leather pads yourself. Try to get one that doesn’t have missing keys and such in the first place.

I differ with some on the quality of these instruments, I think if someone thought enough of it’s sound at one time to keep it around for a hundred or more years, it may be worth salvaging. Whether you can get it to sound that way again is anyones guess, minimize you chances of despair by picking a flute that’s MLTP, (Most Likely To Play).

I love to just hold this flute and think about it’s history, and that I saved it from a storage room somewhare in Germany to be played again. (Too bad it couldn’t have found it’s way to a better player).

Terri

If you fix your link to your flute I can have a better idea of what you are up against. Good Luck

I edited this post to meantion that the second octave is natural to this flute and has a more natural quality than some that sound as if the second octave is a strain, and even though I am a rank beginner, I have travelled to the third octave with minimal air effort. You do not “overblow” these flutes. True the Low D does not soud as loud nor truly honk like an Irish/Engish design, but it has a tremoulous timber that vibrates and sounds it’s own note of solidity. So there.

OK I got the flute. I put each section in a plastic bag with almond oil, after removing the cork. How long do I leave it soaking in almond oil. I have lots of time because I am not going to do anything with it yet.

It beats me why Mr Tipple should be quite so negative about a crack through the mouthhole. A clean crack should, if correctly treated go back to where it came from, and give a strong repair.
I have come across a number of useable flutes so treated.
Of course, if one is going to botch a repair it is not a good place to do it !

In a certain country I once lived in, such flutes were so common in junk shops that I often wondered what was the matter with them.

Now I know.

BTW if you acquire a used ‘blackwood’ flute be sure to sterilise it before you suck air over it!