R&R #2041 on Ebay

Irish Flute
21

Really all the shipping companies will insure is that they’ll deliver the package. I’ve had the best luck with the post office, and a delivery confirmation is all that’s needed, the insurance isn’t. One advantage of indicating it’s an antique if it’s crossing borders is that customs is not supposed to apply to antiques over 100 years old, I’ve been told. Not absolutely sure on this.

What I thought was interesting about this collection of 3 flutes which apparently all came from the same estate is that they probably belonged to the same player, so maybe a professional orchestral musician of the era. The R&R from circa 1835 (with lots of signs of use), the Pratten from 1862, then the 1867 probably about 10 years later, both with fairly light wear. Interesting progression and choice of instruments for the time. Loyal to the London makers too.

22

Looks like another good fixer upper!
This type of couswood, seems to fail a lot in the lower section, I had the same repairs on my RR&C. Looks like it would be a long weekend to repair this one… :smiley:

23

bidding has ended.
i am suprised that the rudall did so well considering it’s condition.
the boosey seems in better shape and fetched a decent price. wish i won. whaaa.
good luck to the winners.

24

Not terrible condition but still not good enough to explain such amount of money.
Possibly the original case and being “part of an original collection from a 1900 flute player”
has increased the value. Btw strange for a small holes flute.
The boosey went as expected.

25

??? Guys, guys! :poke: :poke: :poke:

It went for just under £2k - the (all fairly routine) repairs it would need to bring it to playing fettle might cost say £600 or so - and the “small holes” thing is a shibboleth, IMO. Someone got a very fair deal. I would have expected it to go a little higher, perhaps. It certainly didn’t go “dear”. In many respects I’d consider it a more desirable flute than the “barzaz” RC&Co later one which isn’t attracting any interest at the excessive starting price the man keeps persisting with.

I agree the Boosey Pratten (also) went about right, and the indubitably HP 1867 System got rather more than it ought to have…

BTW, I’m pretty sure the cleaning rod/screwdriver the vendor listed with the Boosey would have belonged to the RC&Co. 1867. A pity for it to get dissociated!

26

mmmmm, mmmmmm, Dunno!
the general condition of the wood (#2041) looks a bit strange to me.
my Camp has been in an attic for sooo long, but the wood is still looking great.
I’m pretty sure that the case and authenticity sheet boost the sale.

Still… selling flutes on ebay is not worthy (Ebay-paypal aslo get almost 10% on final price!).

27

Hello, I bought this flute. I had the advice from Geert Lejeune (flute maker and R&R collector) that it is a good instrument that can be made playable fairly easily. I think the original box and the signatures of Rudall and Rose are something nice to have, but I wouldn’t be prepared to pay more for it. My purpose is to have that flute played again. Reaction from Geert Lejeune after the selling is that I got a very fair price and that he would have bought it if it was not me bidding.

28

Well done, Peter, and congratulations! I hope it arrives safely from Oz. I’m sure Geert will do a grand job of restoring it. Please say “Hi” to him from me - I enjoyed meeting him (and trying some of his flutes!) last October. As it ought to be worth c £3k once renovated, I think you did very well. I hope it proves as good a player as it should.

29

Hi Jem, I’m sure you’ll have the opportunity of meeting the flute in person a day or another.

30

But what a flute is worth seems to be a very subjective idea. I thought my R&R1364 was worth at least £2k, but it turns out it wasn’t. That is if we define “worth” as what a buyer is prepared to pay (in my case, £1750). But I would rather have the flute than £1750, so its subjective worth was more than its real worth, it seems.

But like the beer (was it Guinness?), I’m not bitter. :slight_smile:

31

Subjective, sure, Mike, at least in some (including some practical) senses. But from the pictures I think yours too should be worth c £3k once fully properly repaired (don’t like those crack fillings or the foot block replacement!). One would certainly need to insure it for at least that. A single failed eBay auction sale does not mean it is only worth the top bid. If you sold it through someone like Tony Bingham or Arthur Haswell, they’d certainly pitch the price rather higher! On one level it might be supposed to be more valuable (“collectable” - regardless of whether in use or not) as it is unusual in R&R’s production for the Nicholsonian features - but those may have put some potential player buyers off. As we’ve seen before, it is partly a matter of luck and timing (amongst other things, at the same time as a somewhat comparable flute), and certainly the market is depressed just now. Next week or next month there may be different buyers looking and no competition. Also, while you were properly honest in your listing, I think some of the ways you phrased things and the (IMO unnecessary) comments about the risks of cracking in the post may not have helped.

I wouldn’t relist immediately, but I reckon if you did so in a month or so there’s every chance your reserve would be met.

Mind you, having someone like Goretti (I have met her - lovely player and person) to act as an informal agent should get you a sensible sale in due course.

32

Buying flutes is one thing.
Investing in them quite another.
You very much need to distinguish between the two.

If buying a flute for your own use, you’d like a fair price – one in which it is subjectively decided you didn’t pay too much. Define “too much.” That amount that you cannot recover in any manner from a future sale.

Define “fair price.” That amount you should be able to recover – though not guaranteed – in a reasonable amount of time from a future sale.
Or it can be what you are willing to pay in order to acquire something. For instance, what you’re willing to pay for a boxwood Rudall as opposed to a basic one. Or, what you’re willing for a flute today that would normally take years to acquire from a waiting list.

Once you’ve had the flute, played it and enjoyed it, you’ve acquired the value of what you paid into it. That value is your judgment.

Investing is quite another matter, and that includes not only those who buy with the specific intent of reselling at a profit, but those who buy with the intent of being able to make a profit because they felt they got a “low” price rather than a “fair” one.

To that end, selling is a process that can take time – no different than the stock market. Buy low, sell high. Yet that can mean having to hold onto the flute for a very long time – one that would require you to tie up a large sum of cash.

Typically when someone is selling a flute it is because they have a financial need that requires attention. There is little opportunity to hold the flute for the desired price, something that can take months or years.

So then you deal with the opposing forces of “want” and “need” as it relates to the sale of a flute. Wanting to sell it leaves much room for the above-mentioned commodity of time. Needing to sell leave no room, and puts you in a lesser position.

All this is moot, of course, when it comes to some makers. A boxwood keyed Olwell recently sold for a very large amount of money compared to what you’d pay having waited for one. Would a boxwood Rudall have met the same fate? Perhaps, but not guaranteed that it would have.

Want a good flute? Then you go to the people you know sell good flutes.
Want a deal on a flute? Then you go to the places (eBay, etc) where you think you’ll acquire a deal on a flute…and know there’s no guarantee it’s a good one.

If you sell by one of those outlets, your expectations are to be tempered with the outlet you’ve chosen.

33

..and I’d have to say that from the list of available flutes that David gave me recently, you’d have every chance of picking up a good Rudall there at a fair price.

34

lol
i’ve got a couple, yes (including the above-referenced boxwood Rudall)