GBP 1920
Do we know yet who the successful bidder is?
I would suppose if they were American, with the recent slippage in the pound that they got a deal.
Bob
Certainly weren’t me. I saw the condition report, more photos, and “restoration” letter, and it looked like it could still use a little work.
I think this is the guy who worked on it:
http://sitebuilder.yell.com/sb/show.do?id=SB0001906379000010
I might be able to help. The buyer has contacted me to make an evaluation and assessment, so it’s likely that it will be coming my way for a little side trip soon. My initial take is that she’s planning to sell it, but who knows.
I saw the same detail report of its restoration and it didn’t seem like very much done to it, Kevin. Perhaps just polish and pads. I know a head crack was taken care of.
Looking forward to seeing it. Very interesting flute from the serial numbers that Chris Wilkes has coveted most.
stay tuned
hmmm
just did the math
at today’s rate, that’s just about $2,840 
not bad; not bad
okay…line forms to the left 
at least i’ll get to play it ( i hope)
Sitting on this side of the water, that seems ridiculously cheap to me. Is there something we don’t know about this one? I know you’ve said you may be able to report more later, David, but I don’t get why the bidding has ended so low for this particular flute.
I can think of possible reasons:
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Some people don’t like the weight of the Patent Head, and might want to factor in the cost of a replacement headjoint.
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The Patent Head crack through the embouchure was only filled, rather than pulling the liner, and closing it completely. Besides any possible distortion from that, the embouchure hole seems as if it may have been modified. The accompanying letter says there is play in the Patent Head adjuster, although that might not be unusual. Sure hope nobody yanked on the slide at the auction house.
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The barrel was cracked as well, and probably repaired the same way.
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The joints have been corked, rather than re-threaded. The repairer indicates this is for better air-tightness, but I’d be suspicious that since he took that approach that the tenons or sockets might have unattended cracks.
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Re-padding was with modern bladder pads (not necessarily a fault).
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The repairer describes the flute as not very responsive acoustically.
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He identifies the wood as blackwood, but I suspect it’s really cocus.
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I think the price (which includes a buyers premium of 20%, plus VAT on the premium) may reflect the buyer keeping something in reserve for possible further repairs to improve the condition and playability. Any non-local bidders would also be responsible for packing and shipping costs.
It may well turn out to be quite playable, perhaps outside the experience of an instructor/woodwind repairing clarinet and guitar instructor. It will be interesting to get David Migoya’s assessment. What work was performed does appear to be mostly cleaning and patchwork, and all seems reversible if desired. Looks to be a lovely flute of good quality.
OK. Thanks for that, Kevin. Repairs to a patent head are, I know, a nightmare. Better to have them done first. Having said which, even in that state, I’m surprised it wasn’t at least a grand (sterling) more than that. The buyer can factor in all they want, but this result seems to indicate that there weren’t too many (any?) other buyers out there. Has everyone who wants one now got one? (In which case, mine has just plummeted in value 
)
Even if one allowed say £4-500 for repairs (and I doubt it would be that much) and added that to one’s purchase price, this would still be a very cheap acquisition, IMO. But I don’t think we R&R owners need to worry too much about the “real” values of our treasures:-
a) I doubt many of us are proposing to part with them once acquired - the market tends to be in newly unearthed flutes or in ones moving on when someone dies/can no-longer play; not many change hands otherwise.
b) We can easily find examples that sold much more expensively in the last 2-3 years - so an average of general market values (ignoring any special features of individual flutes) would be higher than this one achieved - and in any case when insuring (rather than selling) one needs to value on a basis of needing to replace at peak market conditions.
c) Auctions (real flesh ones rather than eBay) tend to achieve lower prices in general in any class of goods than private sales, let alone retail ones. So much depends on who (if anyone) has spotted the item and actually bids - all true on eBay too, but that reaches a much bigger audience. But of course, live auctions that happen to attract several deep-pocketed and determined bidders can achieve inflated prices too… this one did not. I’m guessing not that many of “us” knew about the flute at Bonhams.
i’m not really sure I’d agree with several of Kevin’s assessments on why the value was so low, though there is some merit here.
frankly, what the flute gets one day is likely quite different the next. That said…
…from what I see, the head crack repair is probably the only way to handle this one, unless the Patent Head experts of McGee and whomever decide to take it one. it’s one thing to remove a slide to reglue the wood, quite another the remove the PH mechanism and double tube of the slide.
The embouchure seems original. I have a PH and the hole is definitely round instead of oval. That type of split doesn’t necessarily hurt the flute since it has all to do with the amount of tube (if any) exposed at the chimney, impeding the airflow. That said, as i recall, one of the tubes in the mechanism is cut away so much that i don’t believe either is at the blowhole edge. I’d have to look again.
And my own PH head crack is filled, too…and has played nicely for the 15 years I’ve owned it.
I would agree on the weight issue…but then again, players such as Frank Claudy don’t mind it a bit. who knows.
I think the corking was done because as a clarinet repairman, Mr. Hill is more accustomed to redoing tenons in this manner instead of rethreading. I’d be surprised if he left any tenon cracks, which are actually not all all common on these flutes. Several “experts” have said corked tenons actually dull the sound of the flute. I’m not sure I’d agree, especially since Monzani flutes are vitually all lapped in cork.
The fact it is not a large-holed Rudall might have a small part in this, but we’re all thinking it’s a personal buyer for this flute, not a dealer/collector. They tend to look at these things much differently. Don’t forget, until we all came along, Tony Bingham, Patsy Maloney and Paul Davies were about the only ones buying flutes at these auctions for years and years and they acquired them for unheard of low prices when compared to today’s market.
Now that one person purportedly has acquired the entire Rudall collection from Davies’ estate, and the other two only trickle out a Rudall once in a while for sale, the only place to find them are on eBay on occassion, these auction houses – and even those are drying up compared to what it once was – and the occassional private sale.
I mean, currently i can purchase two boxwood Rudalls if I so chose. But each is priced at near $7,000. No thank you.
Anyway, I’ll be very interested to see this flute when it comes in for evaluation. We’ll see.
dm
Good to get your comments, David. My list was just being a harsh devil’s advocate of different things that may or may not have been off-putting to potential bidders.
I was concerned about that round embouchure, as I’m so used to seeing oval ones. Not having looked recently at Terry McGee’s dis-assembly of a Patent Head ( http://mcgee-flutes.com/patent.html ) I hadn’t realized that crack repair would be more difficult. The head liner seems to be a close match to the embouchure, while the inner slide is definitely well cut away.
I agree that this flute was still a bargain, and unfortunately I didn’t have the funds to participate. It actually looks little used, with clear stamping, good edges of the blocks, etc. And silver, not GS.
Maybe this will restore Ben’s faith in the value of R&Rs… or something! Someone’s being a trifle optimistic, IMO!
That flute looks familiar - at least parts of it do. “no cracks” (now, maybe - doesn’t that look like a repair on the headjoint and not a cocus stripe)?
Oh, here it was mentioned: https://forums.chiffandfipple.com/t/rudall-rose-alert/38857/1
supposedly sold in 2006 by David Levine, and in David Migoya’s R&R catalog (still not on-line, is it, David?)
Ah, since it’s come up for inspection…
Yes - I bought the flute from David in 2006, for the price I’ve listed it for, and no - there ain’t no cracks on she. It’s a great flute, but things being what they are, is more than I can afford at present. It was either that or the car… and I need the latter to get to work.
Best - Ed
Thanks for coming out of the woodwork on it, Ed! I was keeping quiet (as I always do with all listings in the catalogue regarding private ownership).
And to be clear, the “David” that Ed noted is not I.
this too, should be noted, Kevin…it is not a Patent Head, though it does have the crown (and the nice matching milled foot cap).
I remember when Ed bought this flute. it’s a dandy.
Rudalls are, thankfully, holding value despite the economy. 
“Rudalls are, thankfully, holding value despite the economy” David M
Are they really? I get the impression that the ones that have turned up on Houlgate & Gardiner, Bonhams, E-bay, etc. have sold for “modest” amounts, 2.500-3000 sterling, about the same amount you’d expect to pay for a modern keyed flute. Looking at H&G’s auctions 2008 to the present a number of Wylde, Rudall flutes, have hammer prices of between 1100- 1800 sterling. I’d be surprised if Ed’s flute goes for 3.400 sterling, although I hope he does get a good price, looks like a lovely instrument. I see though that the Australian Rudall on ebay went for a decent amount 4.381 Sterling = 6499 USD
3000 sterling is $4500 US
that’s not modest
that’s about where a Rudall has been through this bad economy…and where it was before the downturn.
as i said, they’ve held value.
some higher, mind you…i mean, a boxwood rudall in playing condition should fetch a good price
it’s not as if the bottom has fallen out on them…as it has with “anonymous” flutes…
Well, Ed got a good ball-park price for his flute - congrats, Ed. Only two bidders, but someone wanted it! US $5,211.00 (+$70 P&P so actual cost c$5280) Approximately £3,460.85 (c£3510 incl P&P). I wonder if the buyer is a C&F-er? In this case it would seem that the excellent condition and provenance, well-vouched for by a knowledgeable player stood this flute up into the sort of value we’ve been discussing and would like to see/think these flutes should be worth, although quite a few decent examples sold recently have failed to reach these heights.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Rudall-and-Rose-8-key-cocus-flute-exc-/120585691325
it looks wonderful, compliments to the highest bidder…I’m sure he just made a very good deal!
Looks like a nice Rudall.
It is interesting that the screws were never put in the crown, they usually are located where the two cross marks are.