(In the used instruments subcategory it says to not post questions so I guess this is the right place?)
Hello,
apart from getting a keyless Delrin flute I was also thinking of getting a used keyed one as new keyed ones are really expensive and at the moment I cannot afford one.
Also someone told me that as a beginner who eventually wants to play a keyed flute it might be smart to start with a keyed one as the grip on those is slightly different, e.g. piper’s grip won’t work.
So I found this apparently very good deal on a used 8 key flute but as a beginner I am obviously relatively clueless In whether or not this is a good deal or not worth it:
Transverse flute, flute with 8 keys D. The instrument was reworked three years ago in a woodwind instrument workshop.
Since then the flute has been played occasionally. The wood is grenadilla. Private sale, return, guarantee is excluded. The instrument will of course be sent insured by DHL. Shipping is included in the price.
Also the price is negotiable.
Best regards,
Aki
EDIT: sorry I should have mentioned what the owner told me:
“Hi Aki, thank you very much for your enquiry. I play the flute perfectly. I play it occasionally. As I wrote, the flute was in a specialist workshop three years ago. The pads were replaced and everything was checked. Allegedly a mini crack was glued. I could not recognise any such cracks before the flute was returned to the workshop, nor could I recognise any after it was returned from the workshop. For me, it is crack-free. The sections close.
If it has been lying unplayed for longer, around three months, then it needs an hour or two to get back into shape. There is no tuning slide at the upper end of the headjoint and this flute is not intended to have one. The metal connection from the lower edge of the head joint to the upper centre joint can be pulled out accordingly.
The workshop told me that the flute was built around 1980. I bought the flute myself from a friend of mine. I would like to sell it because I want to focus exclusively on my keyless flute.”
There really is no way of telling what the flute is like without knowing who made it, when it was made
and most importantly, without a hands on inspection/assessment.
Did he really say made in 1980? 1880 I’d think myself…that’s a classic Nach Meyer style flute. Nothing wrong with them, some played quite well, others were so-so, but it sounds like the sellers believes it to be a good one. These are common in the USA, too, as they were mass produced and sold via the Sears Catalogue back in the 1800s and early 1900s. The price is excellent, though, so it’s probably worth the risk and a good way to try out a keyed flute.
Agree with other responders. One curious thing is that the flute in the photos clearly does have a tuning slide (between the barrel and head joint) as is common for all the Nach-Meyers that I have seen. I don’t know why the seller indicated that it didn’t, then proceeded to describe how you would use the one that is included. Perhaps they meant that it didn’t have a patent R&R style head?
One caveat: there were, and still are, a large number of flutes produced in Pakistan that were modeled after the German Nach-Meyer flutes. These are often sub-par instruments and would not be worth the asking price. However from the photos it doesn’t appear that this one of them. Still, Caveat Emptor.
I bought a bag of bits that eventually made 2.5 of these flutes 35 or so years ago. For what translates now to less than 15 euro. Was it worth if? Well, it was exciting for a little while to have found a cheap keyed junkshop flute (I gave 1.5 flute worth of bits away) but that wore off quickly, after the realisation set in the flute was an unsatisfactory instrument. The flute I is still here but it has never really been played.
I think many people here have had similar experiences, and the flutes to prove it Perhaps it’s part of the process or a shared experience. Was it worth it? With hindsight, probably not.
Think I might have some questions – the first would be has the seller typed 1980 instead of 1890? It’s easily done.
If it is a copy made in the 80s, would a workshop producing quality flutes have copied every detail of the keying like that? It’s possible they would, but most makers seem to develop their own style for the details.
If that doesn’t seem likely, it could have been made by a company like Hakim Din. They currently sell a repro of this style, and there are obvious differences to this flute. But if they were making repros of that model in 1980, what did they look like then?
Finally, regardless of whether it’s an original, a copy by a craftsperson, or a factory-made one by Hakim Din: is less than €300 a realistic price for a fully keyed flute in good condition that doesn’t have leaky keys or intonation or tuning issues?
I might be an old cynic, of course. It could be a genuinely good buy.
Oh thank you very much everybody, I feel a lot less clueless now!
I will ask him whether it was a typo and keep you updated.
@Moof: I understand what you mean but here in Germany (at least I have that impression) those kinds of flutes are totally uncommon.
If there is someone playing the flute it’s most likely the Böhmflute. There seem to be even more Baroque or Renaissance traverso players than those of these classical flutes. Our (south german) folk music uses the Schwegel which is pretty similar to a renaissance traverso.
Only those who specifically play Irish folk would use classical flutes I suppose.
So the low price might just be a result of supply and demand.
Is it worth it? Well, I’d say, at this stage, probably not. This is not a judgement about this particular flute, but more a recommendation on how to streamline your learning at this early stage. You’ll be able to learn a lot and progress for years with a keyless Irish flute, and by the time you are ready to move on to a keyed flute (which may never happen) you will know a lot more about what specifically you want from a flute.
I don’t think you will set yourself back or get into any detrimental habits by starting on a keyless flute. In fact, you may well progress faster simply by keeping the instrument side of things simpler. If you do eventually decide to spend money on a keyed flute it would be nice to already know what keys you want, and what kind of bore profile and other characteristics you prefer. You can’t really know this with any accuracy until you’ve been playing for a while.
With the relatively high availability nowadays of high quality keyed Irish flutes, it is rare for experienced players to opt for a mass-produced 19th Century German flute when they decided to get a new keyed flute. There are some reasonably good ones out there, among many mediocre ones, and historically some good Irish players from the past have made great music on them, but with the quality and availability of good keyed Irish flutes today, purchasing a mass-produced 19th Century German flute is generally a gamble based on trying to get something really inexpensive rather than a shot at getting a great flute. You’ll be gambling a lot less if you put your money into a keyless flute from a reputable maker.
By the way, the seller told me that it was indeed not a typo
On the other hand it still might have been a misunderstanding or his memory might be deceptive.
But yeah, then I’ll probably pass on that one, thank you all for your help!
Being that new is a big red flag to me (that makes me think it is Pakistani made and not an antique, and I would trust an antique more than 99% of the Pakistan made flutes I’ve tried)…you could always ask them to zoom with you and play it for you so you could hear it. That said, for about double that cost you can get an M&E 6 key polymer flute and know for sure it will play well and be a good instrument to learn on.
I sure wouldn’t go for that. Best to go with something you know is good or you can get stuck with something unplayable and unsellable. With keyed flutes it’s best to spend more money cause the alternatives are unpleasant. And the keyed flute you buy should be like able to carry you happily into the future for a decade or two.
Oh thank you very much everybody, I feel a lot less clueless now!