… folks post along the lines, “I bought this high-end whistle for several hundred dollars two weeks ago. I’ve only played it once, so now I want to sell it.”
I mean, if the whistle is any good, then they’d keep it, right?
And if it’s any bad, then they’d send it back to the manufacturer/shop?
*dazed and confused (as usual) 
They’re discovering that you can’t become a better musician by buying a better instrument.
People are foolish, they buy every instrument they can get their hands on, blow some air into it and decide ‘it’s not for me’. Totally ignoring the fact any musician will need at least some time to get used to a new instrument. And as Simon says, they expect a quick fix by throwing money at the fact they actually need to learn how to play.
I was actually planning on posting a whole thread on what I think of beginners doing that and I may yet.
Is it just beginners?
Anyway, perhaps I shouldn’t have started an open rant thread, but I’m curious as to why folks do this.
Here we go again…
if some people have the money and wish to try a few more expensive whistles then don’t make them feel stupid for doing so. I think they probably know it’s not going to make them a better musician. However, a reallly cheap and nasty whistle just may put them off for good. Some people also like to collect. The world is full of different people and some respect is required here I think. I have not sold any whistles I have bought as yet - not really planning to either unless I need the money or come across something I really don’t like. But, if I bought a whistle and the minute I held it in my hand, before I even put my lips to it, and it really didn’t feel right then I would probably sell it. In fact, thinking about it, I have a whistle I should sell which I have only had for two months - it’s a great whistle to learn low D on (very easy reach and easy breath requirements) but having mastered the basics I don’t want to go back to it. I want to keep stretching the fingers a bit and learning to play an instrument with much more presence etc. It was cheap, even for whistles, and it will be even cheaper for somebody who wants to start to learn the low whistle.
‘Stickys’ on ‘how to get used to your whistle’, or ‘don’t get rid of it too soon’ would be great. But please think of the tone when you are suggesting that certain silly newbies have more money than sense.
And it’s a lovely morning here - have a good one 
No, don’t, Peter. You’ll just make me feel bad. Although I never went over £50, that’s exactly what I did - bought loads of whistles, tried them and then thought “No, that one isn’t quite right”.
In fact, the first whistle I ever bought was a Feadog and, after all the meandering, I just went back to Feadogs and stuck.
If you were going to post that thread then you could have done it before I wasted my time and money! 
Oh, I don’t know that Peter, Simon and me old mate Hoops have said anything upsetting, Makar. I was one of them beginners that bought a high end Low D thinking that it would be good to learn as it had a nice tone. I almost didn’t bother to pick it up again after the first day of trying. I’m glad I persisted though, as it is a fantastic instrument. I think the only problem with anything anyone has said, is that the assumtion has been made that only beginners do this. Yes, there are collectors out there, you, yourself said you were one, and that is fine, but I would think that in general the comments made have been fair and correct. No offence intended to you, just wanting to state my own opinion on the matter.
Mick
No worries Mick - I just don’t know how terms like ‘people are foolish’ squares with all of that.
Practice is of course key to learning any instrument - if that is the message then fine. I think most folks probably know that, if they do at times fail to carry it out. Let’s have some good tutorial advice on how to ‘persevere’. If it’s about being foolish and/or throwing away your money cos you have no sense then I personally feel that undermines the supportive nature of this forum.
And no offence taken in the least Mick
It’s not about stupidity, it’s about acquiring information.
A beginning player will often buy an inexpensive first whistle - a Feadog or Gen, for example - and will find that it squawks, and that it is impossible to get a stable bell note… or indeed a stable any note. The beginner will understandably assume that the whistle is a cheap POS and that one gets what one pays for. They may then move on to a procession of whistles, wondering why they always have the bad luck to get the dud examples.
I was that beginner.
Even with the benefit of the experience here at ChiFi, there is a temptation to trust one’s ears rather than the testimony of people with many years more experience.
The information that perseverance renders most whistles perfectly playable, therefore, is often gained through stubborn trial and error rather than through advice.
As one who spent time and money that I didn’t need to, when I could have made more progress by getting stuck in with the first whistle I bought, I get that feeling we all get when we see someone covering our old ground. It doesn’t mean they are stupid, but we know they could be saved some trouble.
The case of a more experienced player wishing to explore the characteristics on offer from a range of instruments is an entirely different thing.
Is it just beginners?
I probably should have said especially beginners because I meant to say it is especially foolish when beginners buy every whistle available and sell it on after playing it a few minutes because they can’t make it work. Or complain the high notes won’t play for them, as if it’s the whistle’s fault and not their own inadequate playing.
There are a number of levels to my objection to this attitude of ‘buy them all and flog them again if they don’t immediately suit’
First of all there’s an air of consumerism I don’t particularly care for. It’s not a particularly nice attitude from a maker’s point of view, the buyer doesn’t seem to put much value on his instruments, they’re treated as just a commodity that’s easily flogged again without putting a serious effort into making it work. Maybe that doesn’t weigh so heavy on whistles but I surely know flute and pipe makers who put an awful lot of effort into making instruments, some of them referring to them as their ‘babies’. It’s extremely galling to them to get people knocking on the door who can’t play very well, want all the attention of the maker have all their whims seen to and then turn out to have a truckload of instruments they barely play and flog at will. And the argument ‘it’s my money and I can do what I like’ adds weight to how I feel about it all.
In my experience it takes some time to get used to an instrument and some intensive playing to get to the details of it. Maybe less so for whistles again but for flutes and pipes it’s a different story (I see the same thing happening on both the flute and pipes forums so I include these instruments here). People who sell a flute after a week, two weeks, having decided ‘it doesn’t suit’, people who put a chanter up for sale on the day of it’s arrival just seem plain lazy. They don’t want to make the effort the instrument deserves. Beginners who sell a whistle ‘played only a few minutes’ are entering a futile exercise, wasting time and money.
It’s very popular on the forums to go on about the beauty of handmade instruments, I think it would be fair to expect a bit of courtesy towards makers by not treating their handiwork as a disposable commodity. If it doesn’t suit, fine but at least take the time to find out if it really doesn’t.
There’s probably more to be said but I’ll leave it at that for now. And note I had promised Dale only to post a thread before I had thought the issue through a bit further, which I haven’t now.
I don’t intend to attack anyone, least of all someone buying a few mass produced whistles to see which will work. There’s sense in finding what suits and what doesn’t. But once you have maybe a handful of instruments it’s really time to commit yourself and learn, play and reach a stage where you can assess what you have in a bit more informed way.
The old ‘we don’t have access to many makers so we can’t try before we buy’ is universal and as true for me as for anybody else. I still feel better off not buying a whistle before I’ve tried it and I accept that may cut me off from the odd whistle I could potentially really like. But as it is, I already have more whistle than I need so there’s no real harm done.
there are collectors out there, you, yourself said you were one,
Actually I didn’t and I am not. I do have a bunch of old whistles I bought out of historical interest but I have no use for ‘a collection’.
I can understand that, because there are lots of cheapies to try. (Note, I “understand” rather than “condone” that approach.) But I’m refering to high-end whistles here (see a couple of recent threads offering rarely played high-end whistles for sale “like new”). There’s not much of a market for second-hand cheapies, so I think most people would keep a range of cheapies, even ones they don’t like, usually in a vase full of water for fifteen years
That I don’t understand. Well, ok, I understand the wishing to explore bit, but why only for a few days? Maybe it’s the whistling equivalent of twitching - drive several hundred miles to see a rare bird, take one photo, tick it off on the list and then drive back home rather than spending time bird watching.
Yes, but buying a whistle only to sell it immediately isn’t collecting.
Me neither. I’ve only ever sold one musical instrument - a banjolin. That was after playing it for six years. I decided that I wasn’t going to use it as much as a proper mandolin, so we parted company.
Or take it back to the shop? It seems to me that most places are pretty happy to take high-end whistles back, particularly if you want to exchange for one you like better. Private sales are different though.
That’s fine, but I’m talking about high-end whistles here.
Yes, I agree. And maybe some other “I’ve just started playing the whistle” or “Which whistle should I buy” links. There’s plenty of info available…
You too. Hope this isn’t too much of a can of worms.
Thanks Mike - that’s what I call being dissected 
Peter even managed to find a quote from another thread (no reference, tut tut) 
Don’t know where this thread will end but if it creates a bit more of a newbies guide to ‘a few good routes to whistledom, by those of us who have trod it before you’ then great. I’m sure the chapter on ‘good ways to stay on track with practice’ would be very useful. I’m sure that’s just what forums are all about. We all have various reasons for doing/selling/buying things and they are not always as simple as being about the object in hand. Maybe some of you guys need to go on a motivators course or training skills weekend before launching the ‘way it is’ week. 
Who’s got the training budget?
No can of worms - could be quite useful I suppose
i’ve already admitted and acknowledged my complete and utter lack of knowledge… so…
the original post said “I don’t get it when…”
may i suggest that you “don’t need to get it.” you just need to accept it. it is what it is.
just a thought. feel free to ignore me.
be well,
jim
I’m not a beginner, but I have done my share of buying and selling whistles in short order. I’m primarily a guitar player and can walk into music and pawn shops here and in any town I visit and play to my hearts content. Most go back onto the wall after a few minutes. If a guitar really grabs me, it has been known to come home with me. If it no longer speaks to me, I may sell it.
I can’t do that with whistles. Most shops may carry a few low end models if anything. If I want to try out the growing list of whistles available, the only real option is to buy them. For the price of a very cheap guitar, I can buy a whistle and, if it doesn’t’ suit my taste at the moment, sell it again. It is partially about finding a voice that suits me and mostly about exploring what’s out there.
I also am a luthier and build guitars and bouzoukis. Sure I put myself into my builds and am very proud and protective of them. I have built them for players who will never be able to appreciate the potential of their instrument. I started, and continue to build because I love it. But in the end, I am not giving these instruments away out of my sheer joy of building them. Once money crosses the table, it is a business transaction like any other. If you are so sensitive, as many are, that you can’t let go, then believe me, you are in the wrong business unless your desire in life is to be miserable.
Thanks. That’s so Zen.
Peace.
I’ve never bought a whistle and then immediately sold it.
But I’ve bought and sold and traded both new and used whistles over the years.
I play and buy and sell and trade whistles as my own thoughts and feelings dictate.
And…I wouldn’t dream of telling someone else how to run their “whistle life.”
Sheesh…How would I know YOUR personal needs ???
Interesting thread-
I think that a number of different factors may be at work here- and they differ for the people involved, thus a number of people may accumulate a lot of whistles but the reasons for this vary among them. I think that this holds true for many instruments but it is easier with a whistle than say a piano, as the whistle is small and tends to cost less. So whistles may lend themselves to this more than many other instruments.
I know a number of people who own many, many guitars, fiddles, etc- and their reasons vary- some are “collectors”, some can’t pass up “a deal”, some just accumulate “stuff”- they have shopaholic tendencies. Some people likely do figure that buying “a better one” will help their sound- and it can of course-but they are always on the hunt for the elusive instrument that will make them sound like their personal musician idols…
As for me, I have one fiddle- it is my second- I outgrew my first one shortly after I began playing and sold it at the behest of my fiddle teacher to buy the one I still own now. I have two high D whistles- but despise the first one I bought(a Clark traditional)- had to order it without trying it out- but I kept it just to have it around if a friend wants to play it or something. I like my Dixon which is what I then bought. I might eventually, if I get good enough, want to play something else- really like the idea of those Overtons with the low C hole- but have plenty of room for improvement on the one I’ve got. I will eventually own a set of border pipes- and those should last a lifetime so no need to have more than that- other than a second chanter. I’m not personally a collector type- and have no money to do that if I were- but will be happy to benefit occasionally by buying the castoffs of those who are. So I figure we are all individuals and have different things that drive us to do what we do…
I think there’s a degree of defensiveness in some of the reaction, although not as much as I feared : some years ago this thread would probably have turned into a battlefield.
Nobody is telling anybody here what to do and what not to do, at the end of the day it’s your own choice to make. My point, and as far as I can read also Mike’s, is the wholesale buying of whistles (flutes, pipes) and the immediate re-selling of them.
If you receive an instrument which is defective, talk to the maker. Personally I am not too fond of whistles that arrive in less than perfect condition and while I appreciate makers who are willing to replace them, it’s a lot of hassle and I strongly feel that care should be taken not to send off out of tune whistles, but that is maybe a different story.
Other than that: give yourself time to assess an instrument, nobody can decide within a few minutes a particular instrument is not for them. Unless ofcourse the instruments is completely contrary to your musical taste but in that case you didn’t think your purchase through very well and you may need to engage in some pre-buying research for your next purchase.
Give it at least a bit of time and make sure your abilities match your instrument. It seems a lot of people want a ‘top-range’ instrument. Fair enough but realise that in general a top range instrument is not necessarily and instrument made for a beginner, the ‘top-range’ label may point to capabilities, tone colours and details that are not attainable for a beginner, or needed, struggling through The Kerry Polka and Mo Ghile Mear.