Also, how do you suppose that affects the waiting time for those who have done their homework and are waiting to recieve from the maker an instrument that they will keep and respect? You “collectors” and impulsive buyers out there do have an impact on others. It’s not just a matter of “it’s my money and I’ll do as I please with it”. Would Joe Pipemaker’s waiting period be 6 years out if everyone who ordered a set from him knew what to expect upon completion? Do you think Joe feels respected when someone receives his package after 6 years of production and hocks it on C&F for more than the purchase price, insisting that you are buying out of the wait time?
Oh- interesting point Straycat- hadn’t really thought of that. Although as I noted I personally don’t engage in" instrument accumulation mania", I was trying to be somewhat charitable to those who do. I suppose that it would only be ok if they then sold their instruments to others if they weren’t actually going to use it- although eventually that will be the case I’d guess; when they are dead and gone the survivors may very well not care to store and care for a zillion whistles or guitars or whatever and so will sell them. But in the meantime, those lovely Copeland whistles or Hamish bagpipes or whatever are just stored someplace… and not really being played as they were designed to be…
Actually, I have to confess to a wee bit of resentment when people DO accumulate large numbers of instuments, especially if they are nice ones AND they can’t play them well. I don’t earn a great deal of money doing the work I do, and yes, it’s a choice I suppose to do what I do so I’m ok with it- but buying an instrument entails a lot of sacrifice on my part if it’s beyond a cheap whistle or something. So I do know people who own lots of neat instruments and in some cases they can barely play them. Others play well, but how many guitars or fiddles or keyboards can one play ?
Yup- I can see where this thread could get dicey… 
Above I referred to makers who put a lot of effort into their work. People like that do it for the love of it as well as for a job and some of them I know are all smiles if they hear their instruments played well. The other side of it is they don’t suffer fools gladly and would rather (and do sometimes do ) keep certain customers off their waiting lists (or permanently down the list). I know at least a few people who find it very frustrating to make fine instruments for people who will never use them to their potential. And in some cases makers (especially of the pipes) have given up altogether because they could no longer deal with a certain type of customer.
Seeing that I am one of the threads that has a whistle for sale I’m going to add my two cents worth.
Why did I buy the Copeland low D?, well back in 2003 when I bought mine, I got online and did as much research about whistles as possible. The idea of collectibility did not cross my mind, having said that I felt that if I was going to do this I should buy the best that I could afford. Two reasons: if I did well in learning to play it I would never regret buying it, and second if things changed down the road for me, then I hoped that at the very least if I had to sell I should be able to recoup most or all of my cash outlay.
I believe that a person should buy what’s best for them, be it a 10.00 whistle or a high-end whistle. As long as your happy thats what matters the most.
Will I regret selling it, possibly… because it would be hard to obtain another, right now for me something else in my family is more important. The whistle can be replaced, the other can not.
just my two cents worth…
Mikev
Is this common practice?
I think we’re in danger of going ‘off-topic’ here. I thought we were on about a £200 (ish) whistle, not a £2000 set of UPs. I sold a £100+ whistle for half-price after I’d had it for about two months. Not because it was a ‘bad’ whistle, or I couldn’t play it, but because it was a wee bit quiet for the sessions I play in. My inexperience lay in judging volume levels in an ‘unplugged’ environment. I’ll probably be selling a soprano D, which is proving to be too loud in the second octave. What else can I do? Ask a shop to lend me a handful of high end whistles, so I can 'road-test 'em against several demented squeezebox players at 2:00am, in a 17th Century pub? I’ve now got both a high and low D that totally fit my requirements. However, they maybe completely wrong for someone else’s needs, so you can’t absolutely tell by the advice on a forum. You pays your money, you ultimately take responsibility for your choice.
My choice, my learning curve, but I’m not demeaning or devaluing any makers in the process. I’m actually helping their sales figures go up, not down.
BS.
Again: read what’s actually being said and see there’s no need for being defensive and apologetic. Nobody is questioning the sale of whistles as such. It’s about buying and immediately selling, as in after 'minutes’ of playing, within days, that sort of thing.
If a maker makes and sells by customer orders then it is up to the maker to establish a proper customer relationship, and if he finds a prospective customer wanting or lacking in certain qualities, he should drop such a customer. No need to get frustrated. The maker does not have to make the instrument for someone he does not regard fit for his instrument. Putting customers permanently down the waiting list in order for them to never receive the instrument they asked for (and perhaps paid a deposit on) I find a rather unethical attitude. Just tell them to look elsewhere.
~Hans
Just a few thoughts to add…
Few of us can buy a whistle before we’ve actually ordered it.
Sometimes you CAN know within days or hours if a whistle won’t fit you.
I recently returned a custom whistle that was excellent in sound and looks, but after two days playing I realized that the backpressure was much more than I wanted (it might not have bothered another player at all). I could have made it work for me, in time, but to me it always would have been WORK.
I have recently replaced it with another custom whistle which is a much better companion for me. We talk each other’s language!
I freely admit that I have spent too much on whistles. I have shame.
(…but not TOO much shame!!)
I agree. And I see no harm if such unwanted whistles get sold on. Sometimes it may work better to return the whistle to the maker or shop, but for instance if you bought it from overseas, it may be less hassle to not return it, and rather sell it in your own country. At least I am glad for whistles from other countries being resold within the UK, because I would not need to worry about import tax and VAT etc., and have less to pay on postage and nothing on foreign exchange fees.
I think it is good to have a lively second hand whistle market. Just think of all the people looking for their perfect whistle. One buys one from this maker, one from that maker, etc, then looking further and reselling to each other. By reselling we are helping each other on our own quest. Makers probably make more whistles and more money out of this too, rather than having a very high rate of returned whistles, which they then have to resell.
~Hans
riverman makes good points.
The whistle-selection process is a very individual affair.
Aside. I currently have a “higher-end, hand-made” Low Eb whistle, that is quite peculiar for me to play. Different, in many ways, from others I play.
I’ve had it for several months…and, really, have learned quite a lot from “wrestling” with it. Mainly a new level of breath-control. Wow. Old Dog/New Tricks Dept.
I DID have thoughts of returning it to the maker, after only a few days.
Now, however, I’m coming to like it, appreciate it, and welcome it into my little herd.
Sorry, if I seemed defensive, earlier. Grumpy old guy, y’know…
yup- and if I get to the point that I really feel the need for another whistle- well hopefully someone will be offering it for sale and I’ll have saved up the money to buy it! I agree with some of the other posters here though that it is really hard if you don’t get to try out a whistle in advance to really know if it will work for you or not. So in that case it is best to resell it and it might work well for others. I feel so lucky that I was able to try out lots of fiddles and bows prior to buying one as we have some really good stores here that sell those, but not whistles for sure…
A lot of people may be reluctant to splash the cash on a ‘more expensive’ whistle in case they don’t get on with it, for “whatever” reason. However, they may decide its worth getting it at say, half price. Its the same with loads of instruments. I’ve bought numerous second-hand guitars over the years. Basic market place economy. That’s why ebay works.
BS.
Which is exactly my point.
You’re right, Peter, this can also happen. I got a Generation Bb once, but really didn’t like it. I thought it sounded too forced and buzzy in the low octave. Over time, I learned that it liked to be played really softly in the lower octave, and pushed harder in the higher octave. Then I liked it. I took it on a mission trip, and everybody was telling me how wonderful my whistle sounded.
Interesting thread this.
There are all types of whistles and all types of whistlers. Getting the right whistle to meet the right whistler is not so easy.
In the absence of hyper whistle-markets on every street corner, we have a major problem getting to try-out an instrument that is notorious for variation. Ordered sight unseen, often from another country and often at the end of a waiting list can be a very imprecise way of making a good match.
There are may variables at work that can affect how long you hang on to your high end whistle when (and if) it finally arrives:
- Your expectations can become amplified while waiting. The reality does not match the dream.
- Your playing style might have changed. The instrument no longer suits your current playing.
- Your financial circumstances might have changed. What you could afford when you ordered might not be what you can afford now.
- Your research was flawed. The demonstration tune was played by someone who got something out of the whistle that impressed you - the whistle might be capable - is the player?
- You only ordered the whistle as an “investment”. By selling now you will make a handsome profit.
- The whistle changed in transit - it is known to happen. Some sell the instrument rather than contact the maker. Silly but true.
- The whistle was for a collection but arrived just in time to get that “other” trade you have been working on.
- The color of the wood does not quite match this year’s fashion accessories.
- Your goat refused to cooperate.
- After a week you realize that you will never take such an expensive instrument to a session.
- After taking your high-ender to a session, you realize that it attracts too much attention to your playing.
I gotta admit, I’m a little influenced by #10 and #11 
As for what a maker thinks about quick divestment? … Yeah, it is a bit of a roller-coaster that one. (Assuming the maker has honestly put in the required effort ) … At first one feels de-valued: “after all that effort, the whistle was not good enough .. therefore the maker is not good enough?? Was there something more to learn ???” … but after a little thought and meditation .. and medication, one realizes that the whistle was made so that the whistle could get made - it goes into the world and often undertakes a journey. I have learned to respect the journey.
As for how the maker treats customers that lose his/her respect … There’s another tricky one. Once again, it comes back to getting whistles on their journey - many whistles will have a sad story to tell, but at least they got the chance and might eventually find the hands of an apreciative player. It is true that one does not feel inspired to add that special spark to an instrument ordered by someone you regard as your enemy. But the attention returns to the instrument - your enemy is likely to divest quickly and the instrument will find kinder hands beyond.
How to lose a maker’s respect:
- Demand preferential treatment. That dishonors the other customers on the list.
- Ask for a discount. The maker has set the price - it is already at a heavy discount and asking for more is like asking for a pint of blood as well.
- Compare his/her work to other makers. Heh - best way to cancel an order.
- Bitch about the waiting time. It takes as long as it takes.
- Demand concessions. Remember - it’s not about you, it’s about the whistle.
- Create any kind of conflict with the transaction. People identify themselves as trouble makers by the trouble they surround themselves with. Best not to consort with poisoners.
For myself, I honor each confirmed order equally. At the conclusion of the transaction I anotate the order history according to the experience. There is no need to accept every order.
Well, if Starbucks can do it with poor quality coffee, then there’s hope for all of us…
I play acoustic guitar and a few months ago, fascinated by the world of Irish whistles and Irish flutes, decided to try. I bought, tried, and sold many whistles in a few months, mainly low Ds which is my main interest, and kept only a couple of them.
I sold perfect instruments at very good prices for the buyers and I lost some money.
At the end: the buyers made very good deals. and I had a lot of fun and satisfied my curiosity about “which are the best whistles around”. Perhaps all this is a bit childish for a 56 years old man like me, but ..hey…life is also made of crazy things that you have the right to do as long as you don’t hurt anybody !
Hope indeed.
Unfortunately, a starbucks coffee can cost as much as a whistle and is gone within minutes, A whistle can persist for many years and tends to glut its own market. Perhaps whistles should be made of tobaco or chocolate = something with a legal drug in it that is consumed along with the drug. Or maybe whistles should be licensed with each licence expiring daily, but automatically renewed with each whistle purchased.
I think schools are the answer to bringing the market into line with the objectives of whistlers. Most teachers i have met are quite keen to add whistles to their curriculum. There is certainly potential with govenment educational arts and cultural grants. Getting representation for such grants requires some talents beyond the usual skilset of whistlers - such undertaking would be costly, but possible with the right determination and oportunity. A start would be to loby the idea with any teachers you might know.
Agreed, But perhaps not so simple. Each morning I walk a mile into town - it is a joy, the walking improves my health and the journey is joyous - the gardens along the way are a feast of color, the air is crisp and delicious, my “soul” is uplifted. But, beyond my normal perception, the blades of grass under my feat are bruised, the ants and beetles crushed. My righteous march does some harm and hurt, but is no less righteous for it .. unless my purpose was to bruise grass and crush insects. Grass and insects have not the power to hurt me. My rightousness is simple pragmatism. The decision to keep or sell a whislte is entirely the domain of the owner who’s purpose is known only to themselves. The question was asked and some were gracious enough to reveal some of their purpose in this thread - many thanks to them.
Well… I’m a beginner too. I’m suprised that a fellow beginner can decide which low whistle is best on the basis of playing so many whistles for so little time, but maybe you have some magic that the rest of only find after a lot of practice. But now that you’ve found which whistle is the best, I’m suprised that you’re asking about whistlesmith whistles now in another thread, since clearly the only way that you’ll know if they are any good is to buy one, or preferably a whole bunch of them. But yes, it’s your money.
The whistlesmith post is dated Sept. 14, three months ago…right when I started to have an interest in whistles.
You see it again today because someone resurrected the post.
I do not pretend to tell anybody which is the best whistle after having played it very little. I just tried, for my own curiosity, several whistles, kept what I like based on my very personal taste, and sold what I liked less.
Why this makes you so angry ? 
There are people who buy one guitar and keep it all their life, and other people who like to change their guitar often. Everybody is different and that’s why the world is interesting.