Goo d point about relative tempatures.
Something else novice or amateur makers
should consider when making whistles
with a tuning slide is to make the
instrument just a little (5 to 10 cents)
sharp with the slide all the way in.
You can always focus the instrument
exactly to A=440 by pulling out the
slide just a little and making it
flatter but you can’t make the instrument
any sharper. It’s a great option to
have if and only if you play with
piano’s, accordions, or other instruments
which can’t be easily tuned. Or the
string players just don’t want to play in
tune which happens more than you
might think.
Hmmm… Y’know, my shop is about 70F, and I keep it there year-round. However, if you’re tuning your whistles by blowing into them (especially directly, rather than through a tube), You’re throwing in another variable - the temperature of your own breath! Not only that, but if you’re handling them, your skin temperature has an effect, as well.
I’m not being facetious. Both my breath and my skin temp are within 1/2 degree of 92F by a pretty good mercury lab thermometer. Yours probably is, too. How is that going to affect your tuning?
The air I blow into the whistles while tuning, is at room temp probably minus a fraction of a degree due to expansion when exiting the tank. I use strips of tape to close the tone holes, and the whistles are tuned while being held in a carrier locked in a room-temperature machine vise. It’s all very much standardized.
I didn’t set out to do that, but it’s how things shake out when you improve your processes, sometimes. Now, the Big Question: Should I be heating my carrier, vise, and air, to 92F before adjusting tuning? Before answering, bear in mind that I strive to make my whistles just a touch on the sharp side of perfect. That’s purely subjective, listening for about a 0.5Hz beat against the tuner.
If youre making tunable whistles that would be ok, but for untunable I’d think you’d need to leave it a little flat. Don’t whistles sharpen as they warm up? I’m not totally sure, but it would be easy to find out with a tuner.
Take care, Johnz
(quote)Something else novice or amateur makers
should consider when making whistles
with a tuning slide is to make the
instrument just a little (5 to 10 cents)
sharp with the slide all the way in.
You can always focus the instrument
exactly to A=440 by pulling out the
slide just a little and making it
flatter but you can’t make the instrument
any sharper (quote)
Good point! I do this on my own whistles. I usually play them pushed all the way in if I’m playing by myself, but to play at a session, I pull out about 1/8" or so,
It seems to me that the main concern here is the ambient temperature of the air that is the transmission medium from the instrument to the tuning device. Most of us humans are registering about the same temperature (98.6 degrees) so that should be a constant as is our skin temp. and our breath. Since the speed of sound is mainly affected by temperature its this ambient temperature that needs to be calibrated for.
I have heard statements like “this whistle is perfectly in tune with itself, but plays a bit sharp” I think this is a result of the instrument being tuned (when made) and played at a different temperature. So if we makers can offer instruments made at a standard 70 degrees (or calibration corrected for 70 degrees) it will facilitate tuning the instrument for most rooms. Playing outside in a cold environment or in a hot room is another thing!!!
Bill that set up you are using sounds interesting but it seem to me that it doesn’t allow for the gradual increase in pressure required to reach the octave note and the second octave. There is a system using a device called a “manometer” that you can easily make using a metric ruler mounted on an angle with a small (1/4") neoprene tube attached to it with a loop in it with one end in your mouth. One fills the tube with colored water and as you are blowing the instrument to tune it, the water in the tube registers a level and as you ascend the scale there should be a steady increase in the level all the way to the top of the second octave. This will give the player the most steady breath requirement. If you care to use this system and need further info on the manometer let me know.
Ronaldo
[ This Message was edited by: Reyburnwhistles on 2002-10-30 11:35 ]
[ This Message was edited by: Reyburnwhistles on 2002-10-30 11:38 ]
Hey, Ronaldo, thanks for the observations! Since I work on my own furnaces, kilns, etc., I do have a calibrated water manometer - highly effective in keeping me from blowing myself to smithereens! However, the HVLP regulator and valve assembly does allow me to increase the airflow sufficient to reach second, and even third octaves (and to blow the fipple out the end, if I crank it! ) I didn’t detail the entire process, but I do check the lower and upper registers. Constant pressure also allows me to see how “evenly” the thing blows!
Thanks for the idea, however! I’ll hook up the water manometer tonight and see where I am WRT my instrumentation! This should be fun!
Cheers,
Bill Whedon
You wouldn’t happen to know the actual air volumetric air flow rate would you (not the pressure, but the flow)? I’d like to check that Strouhal number theory with some actual air flow measurements.
I don’t have a flow meter (?) to measure that - it’s a High Pressure reg, followed by an FRL, followed by the HVLP reg, then a petcock, then a piece of aquarium tube. I’ll look into the cost of a flow meter tomorrow. Could be interesting!
Cheers,
Bill Whedon
Since this topic is tuning, I’d like to direct a question regarding tuning in a different direction. Do you guys tune the scale of your whistles to a equal temperment, or a just temperment? I ask this because most uilleann pipes (maybe all) are tuned to just temperment. With button boxes, and harps, I have no idea what they use, and (mud and *&#@$@ guards at the ready ) I have no idea what fiddle players use. If you use a equal temperment, the pipers will sound off on most notes (no cheap shots please, if you heard my pipe playing, your local piper would probably sound like Rowsome himself). But, to throw another wrench in to the equation, guitars (and mandolins I think) are equal temperment. I hope that we can keep this from turning into a &^&-slinging thread over which temperment is better.
Best Regards,
dave boling
edited for punctuation and creative speling
[ This Message was edited by: daveboling on 2002-10-31 09:42 ]
However, the HVLP regulator and valve assembly does allow me to increase the airflow sufficient to reach second, and even third octaves (and to blow the fipple out the end, if I crank it! 
) I didn’t detail the entire process, but I do check the lower and upper registers. Constant pressure also allows me to see how “evenly” the thing blows!