Now that’s something that I want to strive for! To the listener it may be mainly about the ‘input’ they receive from the musician, but from the musician’s perspective, it’s the whole experience that counts.
A gifted musician is a wonderful thing. But I feel that sometimes we make it too hard to be an ordinary musician. It’s a shameful thing in fact. Greatness or else don’t bother seems to rule the thinking.
We set almost everyone up for failure in music because there’s a tendency to think that unless you are really really excellent you shouldn’t even do it.
Unfortunately, quite true.
I don’t like the word ‘great’ in relation to describing musicians solo or band based. Mary Bergin may be a ‘great’ whistle player to many, but she is not my cup of tea, must I say she is great because others say she is? - Ceili_whistle_man
Would anyone here really have any problem saying Mary Bergin is a great musician? Even if she’s not your cup of tea? Come on…
“Critics are like eunuchs in a harem; they know how it’s done, they’ve seen it done every day, but they’re unable to do it themselves.” - Breandán Ó Beacháin
(By the way, I’m not saying anyone here is a eunuch. I just want to be clear about my goals as a not-so-great musician. I want to make sure I’m putting my energy into being a PLAYER of ITM and not into being a critic. I’m actually wondering if I should put more time into playing than reading all these forums. I’m in trouble now…)
LOL!
Love the “eunuch” analogy !
trill
Some of the great musicians I have met, or had the good fortune to observe at close quarters, had a humility so refined that I could not discern it. But, then, I am hardly an expert on humility.
Of course, if just appreciating the greatness of the tune were enough, wouldn’t we all be satisfied just listening to the ABC player blip out the notes in sequence? I, for one, am very interested in the human part of the equation, the voice of the player, great or small. Was Micho Russell a great player? No flashy technique, no all-Irelands, but have you ever heard anyone who could successfully imitate him? The problem is that greatness takes on a different meaning for everyone. I’d call Micho great, one of the greatest, and completely leave off another player whom someone else would pick as number one. Maybe you’d even start out with one definition of great, and over time change your mind entirely. Greatness to me? It’s great personality, great humanity, which can take so many different forms. Cheers,
Rob
But that’s not a tune… the tune’s the tune as it’s played, not some hypothetical tune you get on sheet music and computer players. The player’s a big part there, but the player’s there to play the tune, not himself.
I think a great player has great soul, and feels the instrument. Also great ornamentation, and creating your own style. I think that Sylvain Barou is a great flute player, he is my definition of one of the best.
(EDITED MARCH 10)
Look. The Skelton quote is completely true. If someone can play any dumb tune and make you love it, that player is great. No exceptions. He’s not talking about what particular tune it is. His point is this:
A. You can give two musicians the same tune.
B. Musician 1 makes you think he/she is incredible.
C. Musician 2 makes you think the tune is incredible.
D. Musician 2 wins. Period.
If an ABC program made me marvel at all the tunes it played, then it would be a great player. Fact is, it doesn’t. So it isn’t.
Now, MY two cents? I always say that great musicians make it sound like the TUNE is playing THEM. And I think that’s a good way to look at it.
Somehow your interpretation of Mr. Skelton’s statement seems to be the opposite of mine. I get the impression that he means the player should endeavor to make the tune shine, rather than themselves. Then they would indeed be incredible.
You see? We can’t even agree about what we’re talking about. This is a rather pointless exercise. As for this little gem:
"But that’s not a tune… the tune’s the tune as it’s played, not some hypothetical tune you get on sheet music and computer players. The player’s a big part there, but the player’s there to play the tune, not himself."
That’s my whole bloody point, innit? Just made for me arsy-versy by someone who didn’t grok my post. A tune, by definition, is only a sequence of notes, nothing more. The player makes it human, breathes all of the life into it. That turns it into a capital-T Tune, as we really understand it, into music. Furthermore, it’s still a tune even if the player abandons all humility and puts on an exhibition; even that departure from Skelton’s dictum may not preclude that player’s being great. But it doesn’t guarantee it, either. Cheers,
Rob
[quote=“King_Toe”]Look. The Skelton quote is completely true. If someone can play any dumb tune and make you love it, that player is great. No exceptions. He’s not talking about what particular tune it is. His point is this:
A. You can give two musicians the same tune.
B. Musician 1 makes you think he/she is incredible.
C. Musician 2 makes you think the tune is incredible.
D. Musician 1 wins. Period.
quote]
SHOOT… 
Holy cow, did I seriously type it like that? Sorry; that should read “Musician 2 wins. Period”
Sheesh, there’s a typo that kind of blew my whole point… 
Sorry.
You’re right, of course, and we all agree, I think.
Oh no, we aren’t getting into Plato are we 
That’s simple.
Caoimhín Ó Raghallaigh is a truly great Irish musician.
…He’s also a lifelong vegetarian…Not sure if that has anything to do with it…
Great thread here 
.
When I think about “what’s make a great ITM player”, if I break it down into a particular part of making music, rhythm (aside–cool word, rhythm: one semi-syllable, 5 consonants–back to topic) has to be #1, and maybe #2 and #3. Playing in the groove (lift?) makes ITM playing great. Great tone and mastery over the instrument are important, but without phenomenal rhythm and sense of timing, it’s all fluff and no substance, no foundation. Actually, I’m sure we all can think of a wide range of technical abilities and tonal qualities in great players, but the one constant would have to be rock solid, swinging rhythm.
Great reminder for myself of where I need to concentrate my practicing.
Jason
That’s better! 
Ah…quick question.
Does the “Irish Traditional” in the thread title make any difference? Is this not true of any musician in any genre?
Yeah, yeah…they’re really the same question, ain’t they.