Tomorrow is the big day, and lest ye be caught without a suitable St. Patrick’s Day greeting at hand, I thought I’d link to IGTF’s St. Patrick’s Day translation FAQ:
http://www.irishgaelictranslator.com/translation/viewtopic.67327.html
Bainigí sult as, agus Lá fhéile Pádraig sona daoibh go léir!
Redwolf
My not being an Irish speaker, I went to the translation site, and although there was some assurance that the English pronunciations were likely good enough for the occasion, I wonder about some of those consonant combinations, their being unfamiliar to me.
For instance, I once spent some armchair time with a Czech language grammar, where in Czech it’s entirely possible to write whole sentences WITHOUT the use of a single vowel, yes, all consonants, and since then I’ve never been altogether comfortable with consonant combinations in languages that I’m not familiar with. BTW, although Czech vowels are fairly easy for English speakers, in addition to more familiar consonants Czech also has a few jaw-breaker consonants, in particular the letter ř (an “r” having a tiny little “v” over it), which apparently is enough of a challenge to pronounce that even some Czechs could have difficulty with it!
However, I’d be interested in learning some of the basics of the Irish language, but I know I’d have some questions, too.
So, Redwolf, could you be interested in getting an Irish language thread going, maybe right here? Nothing fancy, just something of the basics, but it could be useful to have some things explained by someone who is already familiar with North American English, please.
Sure. The pronunciations look intimidating at first, but Irish is amazingly regular in that regard (especially compared to English), and once you’ve got the basics down, the phonics of the language are pretty simple. There are dialect differences, but they’re no worse than, say, the English spoken in New York vs. the English spoken in Texas. There are sounds in Irish that don’t exist in English (and vice versa), but they’re not unapproachable.
Any ideas as to what you’d want to see in such a thread?
Redwolf
Ok, it seems there could be some regional language differences within all of Ireland, but nothing major. Now, other nations have had a similar experience, and have sometimes then established a “standard” language. For instance, in Germany there are several regional languages, but many years ago Germany developed a standard language, which today is the common German language used in government, media, higher education, and so on. Finland did something similar. And, I’m wondering if Ireland could have done something similar, such as a “standard” Irish language. That might annoy traditionalists, BTW, but it could make my life so much easier!
Beyond that, and seeing as we are now using a powerful tool, the Internet, perhaps you could recommend maybe one or two Irish language sites good for English speaking beginners, which could then give us a common point of reference, please, and which just might make life that much the easier for the both of us!
Thank you, I appreciate your efforts.
And, Happy Saint Patrick’s Day!
In Hebrew, you can write an entire language without vowels.
Apparently that’s true, according to my Jewish friends, but it also seems that much understanding of the ancient Hebrew language has been lost over time, such that the modern understanding of Hebrew could be but a shadow of what it once was, apparently, although Hebrew scholars remain hard at work on the matter, today.
BTW, I am not Jewish, but through my Jewish friends I have had something of an education, shalom.
Arabic too, although you have to pretend that Aleph/Alif Vav/Waw and Ayin and similar are consonants.
Actually, I’ve had some green beer that was very nice indeed, but it wasn’t brewed especially for St. Patrick’s Day.
Arabs and Jews, in the same conversation? Well, let me say that I’ve had some wonderful exchanges, with both groups.
Yes, I know about meat, milk, and pareve, of the proper kosher kitchen.
And, I have also worked closely with Arabs, too.
Shyly cry? why?
The sad thing about Japanese is how it can all be written without spaces between words.
One more thing to confound you when you already are familiar with neither the words nor the characters.
I’m wearing cranberry and merlot today, with jeans. I hope I won’t get in trouble with the leprechauns.
I don’t own any green garments.
Spoken Finnish is like that, without spaces. As a fixed rule, the grammar of the language provides that the first syllable of a word always gets the stress, so that no matter how run together words get (and they sure do!), the stress always delineates the beginning of a word.
Come to think of it, I don’t have much in the way of green clothing, either, but today I’ll be riding around on a bright, lime green motorcycle.
Does that count?
Well, sometimes threads around here tend to wander just a bit, apparently.
So, could it be possible to put together an Irish language thread that doesn’t wander too much?
Given the complexity of a language, for instance, that might help to keep the subject on track.
Irish for ITM players? What an idea!
I’d spill on myself, too, if I was drinking merlot at 5 AM. 
Maybe someone can convince Dale to make a new subforum for it. 
Yes, there is a standardised version of Irish set out by the natl govt, there. It is what is used officially, and what is taught in schools. Some of the regional variations of Irish are quite different from each other, making conversation almost impossible.
Rather than try to turn C&F into a language centre, why not direct queries to one of the many existing sites that are dedicated to learning the Irish language, such as:
http://www.irishgaelictranslator.com/
http://www.bnag.ie/default1.asp?lang=en
Also, there is an on-line forum that Redwolf uses, but I can’t find the link …
djm
The one she uses is http://www.irishgaelictranslator.com/translation/ but it appears to be down at the moment. However, it’s primarily for translation queries and not for conversation/chat.
It will be a long one for your’s truly… I have a few greetings in mind already, but don’t have the courage nor the indecency to repete them here.
Actually, you’ve linked to it. www.irishgaelictranslator.com.
The regional differences in Irish are much less marked than they used to be, thanks to Ráidió na Gaeltachta and TG4. My Irish is Ulster, primarily, but I have little difficulty understanding people with Connacht or Munster Irish. It’s really just a matter of being aware of the differences and, sometimes, asking people to slow down or speak more clearly.
The Caighdeán Oifigiúil (the official standard) only applies to grammar and spelling, unfortunately. There’s no standardized pronunciation, which makes it difficult for kids learning Irish in Ireland, as they might have a teacher from Cork one year and from Connemara the next (and the regional differences are much more of a challenge to a beginner than they are to someone who has been learning the language for a while).
Redwolf
Oh, we chat there all all the time! We also have special learning threads, games for beginners and for more advanced learners, a weekly chat on Skype, and reviews of self-teaching products and dictionaries. I learned most of my Irish by hanging out on IGTF.
The site administrator says the site is unusually slow today, and he’s not sure why. He always upgrades just before St. Patrick’s Day, as site traffic is incredible on “the big day”…we go overnight from being an Irish motorway to being I5 in L.A. during rush hour. He won’t be able to do much about it until he gets home from work, though.
Redwolf
Since IGTF is down at the moment, here’s the St. Patrick’s Day edition of my “Cúpla Focal” column from a few years back. The pronunciations are Ulster-based, but I can help with other dialects if necessary:
CÚPLA FOCAL AS GAEILGE
It’s that time of year again…St. Patrick’s Day is upon us! Skip the green beer (yecch!), and show your Irish pride by saying a few words in Ireland’s beautiful, ancient and living language! In the phrases below, the singular form is given before the slash and the plural form comes after.
Lá Fhéile Pádraig Sona Duit/Daoibh> : (Law leh PAW-rig SUN-uh ditch/DEE-uv): Happy St. Patrick’s Day.
Beannachtaí na Féile Pádraig Ort/Oraibh> : (BAN-ukh-tee nuh FAY-leh PAW-rig Ort/OR-iv): St. Patrick’s Day Blessings to you.
Tabhair póg domh, is Éireannach mé > (tor pohg doo, iss AY-run-ukh may): Kiss me, I’m Irish.
Or, if you’re Irish by descent, but not by nationality:
Tabhair póg domh, is Gael mé> : (tor pohg doo, iss G(w)ayl may)
Ádh na n-Éireannach > (Ow nuh NAY-run-ukh): The luck of the Irish.
Bród Éireannach > (Brohd AY-run-ukh): Irish Pride.
Fad saol chugat/chugaibh, gob fliuch agus bás in Éirinn> . (Fad seel HUG-ut/HUG-iv, gub flyukh, OG-uss bawss in AY-rin). Long life to you, a wet mouth and death in Ireland (a toast).
Or, for an easier toast…
Sláinte! > (SLAHN-cheh): Health!
Or if you’re really in a toasting mood:
Sláinte is Táinte > (SLAHN-cheh iss TAHN-cheh): Health and Wealth.
And don’t forget…
Éire go Brách! > (AY-ruh guh brawkh): Ireland forever!