politics forum update ?

Agreed, but I don’t miss the contention either.

Agreed, but I don’t miss the contention either.

Amen.

I think the political board had the potential to be very instructive and enlightening if posters could have left personalities out of the issues, but that seemed impossible.

Susan

Oh sure, Susan, there you go with your pissed-off in Utah attitude.
Nyuk.


To Dub: whatever it is that keeps ya here, I’m for. You are without a doubt, one of the most interesting posters aboard… Do tell us more about the other kinds of music you play. I always figgered you for a pub player who wrote poetry or something for your other non-day job.

Wanderer, mind if I quote you on that? Wait a sec, I just did…nevermind

Couldn’t have said it better myself.

Well, the simple fact of the matter is that the politico/confrontational forum is gone and its all your faults.

And you’re a bunch of poopy heads, to boot.

So there!

Nyah!

:stuck_out_tongue:

djm

Something about leopards and their spots.

Folks, what really does NOT need to happen is for the vitriol from that board to spill over into the rest of C&F.

Let’s all resolve not to do that.

–James

See, an insult about insults. You can’t get that on the other forums. :cry:

BRING IT BAAAACK. :angry:

Actually scratch that. I am quite enjoying all the leisure time that as been freed up. :slight_smile:

I’m going to have to have a chat with the other mods to see if the phrase “poopy heads” is really apropriate for C&F. :stuck_out_tongue: :wink:

The last time I checked, folks who went to pubs for music did exactly that, go for the music. Those who became agitated and boisterous and loud in their arguments were told to shut the feck up, because they were ruining the enjoyment of the music.

Jungle Jimmy here, uncloaking for a moment.

I think one reason for the devolution of the poli board into
something less good is the new policy banning posting
whole entries by another author. This is in place to
prevent us from harming said author, though what the
harm is has never been explained–to my knowledge.
There was a lengthy thread partly appealing to Dale to
give us something solid in that direction–it’s gone with the Rubber Room.

Good discussions of political, etc issues
require info, more than most of us have. People who wish
to go on posting, but may not have the info, are more
inclined to bash whatever, if necessary each other.
Bashing isn’t labor or info intensive–it requires only
a gift for sarcasm and a fixed idea.

Posting whole pieces, within reasonable limits, put up on the
public blackboard–as it were–info that focused discussions
and made them better informed. There’s nothing like
slapping a relevant document up there for all to see
and discuss. It made things a good deal more ‘educational,’
to use that awful word.

The problem with posting just links is that people are much less
likely to read them; they’re much easier to ignore, they’re
offscreen, not part of our public cognitive space. Anyhow
I don’t think links were being read anywhere near as much.

There was a kind of delicate ecology on that board–it depended on
the ratio of info to bashing. The two tend to exclude
each other. Reducing markedly our ability to inform
discussions helped to shift the balance in a less good
direction.

Given what the poli board had become at the time it
went away, I think we are better
off without it. If it returns I hope the posting policy will
be revisited, because I do think the quality of discussion
had often become poorer on account of it.

Back to lurking.

Actually, I am mostly struck how this thread sounds like a bunch of ex-junkies desparately trying to come up with a massive rationalization as to how its such a good thing that they are off their fixation. Unfortunately, the more strident and forcefully goodwilled the reasoning, the more pitiful the underlying plea sounds, begging for their rubber room back. :stuck_out_tongue: :laughing:

djm

Perhaps, rather than a Rubber Room, we could have a Romper Room, where we could play games, sing songs, take naps, and learn how to be nice to others. Oh, and don’t forget the Magic Mirror. :slight_smile:

Any person who becomes “agitated and boisterous and loud in their arguments” wouldn’t be tolerated in music pubs regardless of the subject matter. Talking about political subjects doesn’t have to become as you describe any more than other topics do. I’ve never been to Florida, and maybe things are different there, but I’ve been to a lot of sessions around the world and people don’t have to become “agitated and boisterous and loud in their arguments” just because they bring up political subjects.

I believe the main problem in the political forum was the ad hominem. I don’t envy the moderators, and I realize it’s time consuming, but keeping the lid on the ad hominem is possible. The most important thing about it would be to make sure it’s even-handed. If a universal policy that everyone had to abide by was established I think the ad hominem could be controlled. As it was, people on the favorable side of the political spectrum could in effect shut down any discussion they didn’t like. If they didn’t succeed in getting the discussions locked the threads would deteriorate to a point where the subject was obscured by the insults anyway. Either way it was easy to derail a decent discussion if they didn’t like where the evidence was leading it.

(((((group hug))))))

I think an investigation of “fair use” will provide answers to this. I put “fair use” (including the quotation marks) into a Google search and the consensus seems to be that posting an entire article is allowed provided you aren’t gaining anything financially by doing so or diverting possible revenue from the copyright holder. As long as credit is given along with a link to where it originated, no one is likely to protest the use. “Fair use” allows the reproduction of copyright material for the purpose of commentary, discussion or instruction.

I sort of miss the Poli board but, I guess, given that I could bring it back with a click of the mouse, that’s kind of ironic.

I don’t miss what happened to the general tone of the board. I do miss having a place to occasionally discuss politics and other controversial things with friends. I know I can be stubborn about the civility thing and it’s impossible to moderate it with complete even-handedness, but, as I’ve said, I know it is possible to talk about politics without personal heat.

Jim, nothing more forthcoming from me about the cut & paste of copyrighted articles thing. I stated clearly why I established the policy, but I know it wasn’t to your satisfaction.

And, the moderators WERE lopsided! I think we are almost all liberal-moderate Democrats!

… yes, absolutely, notice the word moderate in that sentence?

The truth is, it’s hard to have any OT section (such as the pub) and not have politics come into play. For example: I started a thread about a possible cure for cancer that is taking a turn into politics as I write this. If the ‘pharmaceutical industry vs. people with cancer’ debate remains free of any ad hominem it will be very interesting, informative and thought provoking. If anyone begins to give other posters stereotypical labels and dismiss what they’re saying with insults – you know what will happen. That’s what I’m talking about; those people would have to be taken to task immediately no matter what side of the political spectrum they’re on, or how long they’ve been a member of this site, or how much they’ve been posting in the music oriented sections. Ad hominem has to be dealt with evenly and immediately to be stopped or it boils over and quickly gets way out of control. Before you know it the whole place stinks of scorched milk.