Jem Klein can make a 7 hole shakuhachi instead of the standard 5 hole (for natural minor scale).
This seems to be a great possibility for interpreting Irish repert with low whistle range but with the rasp and whoosh of shaku on proviso that
its not just the addition of two more to the minor pentatonic 5 to give a full natural minor scale, but rather
a fresh 7 for the D major.
I think you would need to get a 1.8 whatsimacallit for to = D scale.
In principle, I am surprised at no input.
Hasn’t anyone ever thought about a diatonic holed shakuhachi
for that gutsy haunting sound as an altern. to low whistle?
And think of the note bending potential
with meri-kari techniques which you can’t do on whistle.
I think it sounds like a great idea. It should be fairly easy to make a PVC shak using hole placement figures from Guido Gonzato’s instructions. In my spare time…
not that I am ordering one right now but
how would you personally make one.
would you add the advantage of a tuning slide as on your whistles?
with a PVC body and a wooden head and the top embouchure edges of metal
as the tips of your current fipples are?
I’m not considering making these for sale, but I might make myself a one off completely of PVC to play around with. I did make a PVC shak once. It doubled the wall thickness for the mouthpiece by using a PVC tubing joint. No metal edge required: the PVC takes a perfectly good edge using just a simple file and elbow grease.
Slightly off topic, I admit, but how does a Shakuhachi compare with a flute for difficulty? I tried a (keyless)flute but got nothing musical out of it. Not even a hint. And it wasn’t the flute - it plays well in other folks hands. If a Shakuhachi is easier and not too expensive, I might try one. Maybe even try making one.
I am guessing, however, that a Shakuhachi is at least as difficult as a (keyless) flute, and I am being way too optimistic.
It’s worth persevering with the flute. Practice half an hour a day in front of a mirror for a week and you are almost guaranteed to get a reasonably good tone from a flute. Many budding flutists find it helpful to start with just the headjoint when learning to produce a good tone. I think you might find a flute easier to learn to play than a shak.
Thanks, Adrian. So if I can’t do the flute thing I wont do the Shak either. I still have the flute - maybe I will try again one of these days. I still have a lot to learn on the whistle so maybe my motivation for the flute will grow when (if?) my confidence (competence?) grows on the whistle.
In front of a mirror? Why? And should I take this to the flute forum instead?
I think the flute embouchure is easier, but the Shak mouthpiece allows you to produce that really great reedy sound. It’s definitely worth trying to make one.
yes I know thats been done but I can’t find any links on the net for any makers that do it.
my question in the OP, “Anyone tried something like this?” is more about is there anyone who is into Irish low whistle for traditional Celtic (read Irish, Scottish, Breton) stuff done it with a diatonic shakuhachi instead?.
What about the Kything Quenas made by Mark Hoza? Hasn’t he offered low D quena? And I know that quena and Shak are different instruments. Still if you are really looking to go the way you suggest, Mark Hoza may be a good maker to start discussions about making one. At least he has demonstrated a willingness to make end/edge blown flutes in a diatonic scale.
Otherwise, I would go the route suggested by Paul - buy some PVC and start filing and drilling. You may be on to something. It would be interesting to see what you could do with such a synthesis of instrument and style!
Yes mate, times do change but that isn’t salient to this situation.
Your research merely indicates that a thing may be considered relevant or not relevant to a forum
depending on CONTEXT.
In the case of this topic it is about a thing slightly altered so as to be an alternative to a LOW WHISTLE
for Celtic repertoire. Hence the considered relevance.
Having a discussion with Mark Hoza about making an shakuhachi (which has a different end embouchure to quenas) and which two different instruments attract different traditions of note bending/accidentals has little relevance to a question about whether anyone HERE has got into playing an “ITM shakuhachi” as an alternative to LOW WHISTLE.
Your comments go towards someone needing something to be made
whereas mine go towards a CONVERSATION involving those who have played
it as an alternative to low whistle. See my operating post.
The Shak, although requiring more discipline to play, has rewards in expressional dynamic.
I have heard performances on ney and kaval that are truly mind-blowing .. the shak has another dimension to explore.
Only a short few years ago, there was no such thing as a bazouki in ITM .. not much longer ago, there were no Generation whistles ..
It all moves .. and players are still trying to equal what was done on pipes by Seamus Ennis.
The whistle itself is a very exacting instrument .. there is more for anyone with the oportunity to take it further.
I asked my teacher a similar question when I was studying traditional shakuhachi.
He just smiled and played me a chromatic scale on his regular shak and asked why that would be needed.
On a related note, though my formal shakuhachi studies are on hold for the moment, I still play to keep the chops up and have found quite a few Airs that sound lovely on the shakuhachi. Some fit the Pentatonic scale, others have some Meri notes but usually aren’t too bad.
Some of them came from tunes in my head, others came from here : Irish Melodies for Shakuhachi.
Tom
Consider though .. One can play ITM on a kaval. Last year, I made a series of whistles pitched to Hijaz and Hijazkah tuned to the original Indic intervals. The experience of playing them leads to more places than pure mastery. The technique of the possible. We walk where feet find comfort .. and wear paths.
The adventurous find walking where feet can go. Life is an adventure
yes, the idea (for discussion) is that very expressional dynamic availbale to those
who are already expert in 6 hole diatonic fingering in the playing of Celtic repertoire.
Elements of two traditions embracing, one from islands at the very West of Western Europe and another from islands at the very East of Eastern Asia.
An unkeyed, chromatic (and microtonal) vertical low flute.
yes, the traditional shakuhachi gives a minor pentatonic scale from its bell note with natural fingering applied. Therefore major pentatonic from bellnote+one, major pentatonic’s mode 2 from bellnote+2 etc.
and it doesn’t take much, if you know how to play that with traditional training, to obtain a range of heptatonic scales.
But that training comes with much traditional training baggage and most ITM players may not have the time and inclination for that
just as most lute players may not be inclined to learn a fretless lute just because the first lute was an oud from the Middle East.
The teacher who smiled has dedicated his lifetime to obtain his smiling vantage point.
That is how it needs to be for a custodian of a tradition
but not all who enjoy eating honey serve the Queen Bee.
