One time Patrick Olwell played an antique French flute for me. I was quite impressed by that particular flute even if he can make just about any flute sound great. Anyway, I eventually bought a Thibouville which was not all that great. I’m still curious though, is there one 19th century flute maker that is considered to be something like the French equivalent to Rudall and Rose in terms of stature? I was hoping some of the more historically minded members could provide me with an answer. Thanks
Louis Lot I think.
I remember of a lady that played a French flute that was reworked by mr. Olwell. Maybe the one he played at that time was also reworked (…or the same flute!)
I was privileged to know a technician who apprenticed with Louis Lot. Lot was a giant in the French instrument world, but I think his early adoption of the Boehm mechanism and research into various refinements to the ‘parabolic’ head prescribed by Boehm make his efforts with simple system instruments fall into the shade. I think there are other French makers who might have greater stature in the world of simple system wooden flutes. I am sure Lot could have taken a broom handle and make it sing, but I really think his reputation rests more with his work on ‘modern’ flutes.
Bob
Much depends on your desiderata. There were many very high quality French simple system flutes made right through the C19th. Names such as Thibouville (-Lamy), Couesnon, Lot and others were highly rated. It is quite easy and relatively inexpensive to find on eBay etc. decent 5 or (less commonly) 6-key French flutes, though not so many 8-keyers as they tended to eschew the C foot. The problem is that most (like many German nach Meyers) were built for diapason normal, A=432-5 Hz, and won’t play as sharp as modern pitch. Even if you can find a CP example, they also tend to have very flat F#s, even with the key vented. However, even anonymous or obscure maker ones tend to be very well made, often to a higher standard than most contemporaneous English flutes, from high quality materials, often with extremely well cut embouchures, and they usually play very well within the limitations of their class. They are by no means quiet, despite relatively narrow bores and small tone-holes, but are less inclined to give an ITM/English School type reedy buzz. that said, much depends on the player. I have one YT clip demonstrating a just-about-playable-at-CP anonymous example.
Thanks for the replies. Maybe that was a Lott flute–it was nice. My Thibouville is not really a bad flute and it sure is a looker in cocus and silver with a lovely flowing shape. Actually, I’m glad I have it even if I overpaid by current market standards. I did have Dave Copley make me a new headjoint out of mopane which he stained to match quite cleverly and think it made a significant improvement as well as ensuring that I wouldn’t have cocus touching my face as I have sensitive skin. I’d be curious to hear a really good player compare the original and Copley head joints.
Here’s an interesting French flute by Guichard, reworked for traditional music.
http://www.antiqueflutes.com/product.php?id=919
I’ve been staring at that Guichard everytime I check that site. Lovely subtle features!
I once played a Martin Freres (I think) flute that really did it for me in a way the other French flutes did not. though I have limited experience with this type of flute ( maybe played four for short periods of time).
What a lovely flute! And finely detailed! By opening up the embouchure from the typical dainty French oval, you could really push this flute. I have a French flute, not nearly as grand, but with many similar characteristics, to which I have mated a fully lined head with a similar lozenge shaped embouchure which can be driven quite nicely. The sharpening of the F# was quite well done with fine detailing.
Well beyond my means, but I’m drooling anyway. Thank you for the link!
Bob
I thought my Thibouville which is easily as good looking was kind of expensive at $1400. That’s a big price isn’t it? I mean 3/4s of what the R and R listed here with the Wilkes head is going for? Don’t know about that. But it is still nice.
Yes that is a challenging price. In some ways the Guichard may be like a certain celebrated Anonymous German flute recently discussed in a recent thread. One hopes the individual flute is uniquely worth the price. But I find part of the charm in some French flutes is that they can also be seriously under priced for their value. The problem is getting a good one playable at A=440, AND at a good price.
Bob
I play ITM on a Martin Freres 8 key. I’ve that and an anon 5 key which is also CP; I’ve also got a Noblet piccolo which is CP as well. Like jem says most German or Germanesque flutes made in America/Czechoslovakia seem to be A=435.
My Freres has that flattish F#, you need to open the Eb key for quiet tunes. It’s not so big a deal in dance music. And it really plays itself, it’s easily the easiest flute I’ve ever tooted on. You can crossfinger an Fnat in the 2nd octave too - so you have three ways of playing that note.
When it arrived it required some serious reconstruction, though - Freres socketed the female parts of the tenons, which split the wood quite horrendously; the sockets were made from copper too, and liberally soaked in verdigris, which required some imaginative scrubbing/polishing from my repair guy. So there’s another factor when considering buying one of these oldies, if that’s a common part of the design. Mine was ca. $200, about as much as I’ve ever paid for a simple system. I’ve always heard that these French simple system flutes were hot properties with charanga players - they play old flutes in the upper octaves for that music. But mine were pretty typically priced for eBay non-English stuff, so go figure.
BTW the other day I bought an old Martin Freres clarinet on Craig’s List - they were in business until the 1980s. Don’t know when they gave up on simple sys stuff.
This one looks exceptionally fine
Looks left-handed (yes, I’ve messaged the seller)!