http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2541832945&category=16226
" BIN "
Now now now - the last thing we need is another flaming thread session.
If you have nothing good to say, then try saying nothing.
I would think the lack of commentary would speak volumes.
Stew,
If I didn’t think it would get the board shut down, I’d report that post to Dale. Can it.
JD
J dasinger,
I am getting sick and tired of people defending people
selling pipes that are not up to scratch, we have heard a sound sample of
a chanter made by this same maker, this practice set is not in my
opinion going to be able to be made up to a half set, has every one
forgot someone is going to pay hard earned money for this set probably
some young person with no experience so don’t come preaching to me,
how much were they exspecting to get for this set anyway? is there a warranty with this set?. 
~ 
“this practice set is not in my opinion going to be able to be made up to a half set…”
…
I think that’s the point that Dasinger makes - that it’s your opinion.
edit
Sean, I agree. In the GHB world, adding “might be Henderson” is enough to whack another couple of hundred or more on any EBay sale. Grr.
However, it’s important that people provide decent critiques of bad instruments, not just one-word rejections:
“These chanters are made of balsa wood, which is notoriously unstable, and easily broken. It uses a plastic reed cut from a bin-bag, and is weak in the upper octave. Many of these sets cannot go above a high G, and so on and so forth…”
If it’s too much trouble to type that out, put it on a web page and post a link to your rant every time the subject comes up.
To a rank newbie, one-word rejections are not helpful. Does Stew mean that he, a magically excellent player, wouldn’t be seen dead with this set, though it might do a beginner? I sure most excellent musicians have said something similar about such an instrument at some point (I know I have (apart from the excellent musician bit)). Or is he an idiot, just posting nonsense? Perhaps he knows something about this particular set, though the make itself is generally OK.
Do you see my point? I agree wholeheartedly that crap pipes are crap pipes, but a wee bit of analysis makes all the difference.
Cheers,
Calum
edit
Dear Calum,
How can a set with a chanter thats plays out of tune!
"might be O.K for a beginner?"as a player I’m still learning as do all pipers, even the pro’s never stop learning,I still practice two or three
hours each day, we know who the “Idiot” is if he thinks this make is
Generally O.K, but then again, you might be hearing something I’ve mist? I’ll have to have another listen, or buy it! give it the once over
and palm it off on some beginner that should be O.K shouldn’t it. ~
O,bye the way. why waste time on describeing something when one word will do. 
Let me repeat a prior post and then I’ll comment further:
Acceptable post: “I had difficulties with Maker X. He promised delivery in two months and, when I did not receive the product in four months, he did not respond to three emails…(etc.). When I got the product, I felt it was not suitable for me. The doo-hickey key was out of alignment and the walls were too thin, etc.”
Perfectly acceptable. It give details. It is not second hand. It is not vague. And, this is critical: it allows a discerning reader to decide for herself whether she would consider these to be things SHE would regard as a problem. She might not be bothered by late shipments. She might like her doo-hickey key out of line. She might like thin walls, etc.
Unacceptable post: “I’ve heard bad things about Maker X.”
It is vague, 2nd hand, and useless to the reader. It might lead people, unnecessarily and unfairly, to avoid Maker X. In the absence of information, people tend to assume the worse.
Unacceptable post: “I’ve had problems with this maker and I’m not prepared to go into details.”
Then, respectfully, don’t post. It’s unfair. It creates a negative impression which is wholly without support.
Acceptable post: “McFadden’s whistles require too much air for my taste, and the materials are a bit too inexpensive.”
It’s an opinion. It’s free speech. It gives the reader some information.
Unacceptable post: “McFadden’s whistles are crap.”
Ill-mannered, unfounded, unsupported, provocative and useless to the reader.
Under this guideline, a one-word post is not helpful and is to be encouraged. As members of this board, I would encourage all of you to consider condemning this kind of post.
Q: Why elaborate when one word will do?
It’s won’t do, for the reasons explained above. My own instrument of choice is the whistle. Virtually any whistle on the market might well be described by someone, somewhere as “crap” or whatever. A reader has no way of knowing that for every person who would dismiss a product, there are many who approve of the same product. It is only basic fairness that one make it clear it is one’s own opinion and that one offers some kind of description. To not to do is disrespectful, hostile, unhelpful and lazy.
I mean this as a sincere offer and not an insult: If you lack the basic writing skills to elaborate, or if your writing embarrasses you, feel free to get in touch with me and I’ll help. I’m not a great writer (for example, I’m not sure that’s the correct spelling of “embarrasses”) but I’d be happy to help you craft a more useful post.
Regarding the comment that my role on this board is oppressive I would respectfully suggest that you are being silly. This board runs itself, largely stays out of trouble, and I rarely come visit and then only when someone complains. Even then I just come in to bitch and moan and make threats. I haven’t really DONE anything. Give me a break.
Dale
Sorry Stew, miscommunication - I wasn’t saying anything about the set in question. At this point in time I really don’t want to know anything about that particular set.
As for “good enough for a beginner”, well, of course that’s subjective.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable to suggest that there are sets out there that an expert player that makes high demands on the instrument wouldn’t be happy using, but a beginner could get some valuable mileage out of. This is without question the case in the GHB world; I’m setting up an old set of Hardies at the moment for a beginner. I wouldn’t take them out in public anywhere where it might affect my reputatation. But for this beginner, they’re going to be perfect. The reed is nice and stable, the drones are tuning consistently, in short, she’ll be able to manage it. At the other end of the scale (and I’ve mentioned this before) the chanter of choice for the professional is the Naill; however, this is a poor choice for beginners, as it is very tricky to reed well. Beginners have enough problems as it is.
I won’t even mention things like Andreas Rogge’s plastic chanters, as we’re now getting way OT, but I hope you see my point. It’s not about palming beginners off with inferior pipes, it’s matching the instrument to the player. Beginners don’t need pipes from a maker with a thirteen year waiting list.
Cheers,
Calum
Cheers,
Calum
Calum I take your point, but? if its out of tune what good is it to a
beginner? one thing that could help beginners is if any body knows
of a practice set being sold and is reasonaly O.K could maybe
speak up if they know something about a set, I’m sure there’s
sets doing nothing in peoples cupboards that with a little work
could be put to good.
There certainly has been some interesting points made so far and i would like to make a few of my own.
I do make every bit of my own pipes including the outer bag covers. But not the cases. I would never dream of using imported parts from Pakistan and then stamping my name on it.
I do offer a one year guarantee on my pipes
I do offer a returns policy
I do offer cane reeds if requested.
I am registered with square trades and guarantee my customers satisfaction
I do agree with Calum that the pipes should match player
I do sincerely believe the sets I make achieve this. I make it clear in my adverts These practice sets are built for beginners ( not professionals). It is not then fair to judge it as if it were. For example there is no point in moaning that the cheap car you just bought is not as good as a rolls royce. These sets are consequently cheaper and this is reflected in the choice of materials used in their construction and their price. I use synthetic where ever because it is more durable and maintainenance free. This benifits the player as they do not have to worry about adjusting ,servicing or damaging reeds etc., They can then concentrate on playing rather than fiddling. It is not without good reason that you will pay neary £1000 for a professional chanter or the £850 or so for a normal practice set.
If you were to stick a synthetic reed in a Williams chanter and it played out of tune would you then say that Williams is a crap maker . ??? I would imagine that most people would accept that it is not the chanter or the maker at fault, but the reed.
When I made the particular sound file in question I did it in a hurry and did not check it afterwards until it was pointed out. Neither did I attach any importance to it then or now. My sole purpose was to demonstrate that the pipes would fire up. I assumed that the purchaser of this set would reed it up to his own tastes . I have accepted that this sound file is not up to scratch. but so what?? People are bidding on these pipes regardless. They may not be happy with the reed but they know there is nothing wrong with the pipes. Likewise I do not believe that there is anything wrong with the chanter I make as it is acurately made. I have based in on a Williams chanter with the same bore and finger hole configuration. I accept that the reed could do with tweaking etc and I should have made a better effort to tune in, but would consider this a minor task.
I do think that it is a bit over the top that a simple sound file was going to act as my right of passage. Or by the suggestion of another member that it should have been made in a recording studio.
I could understand the level of critisim I have received to be valid if my pipes were in the £850 or above bracket fitted with cane reeds. I sell my pipes off ebay for £350. With all the guarantees and after sales service I think that it represents good value for money. My customers seem to think so as well.
I do not believe that my pipes or other instruments are rubbish as has been suggested although I accept that people have the right to believe what they want. Just about every maker has been rubbished on this forum and i do not think I will escape my share.
If you check out my feedback on ebay you will find I have a good reputation there. Currently (278) I also enjoy good feedback on the flute forum. Strangely enough i do not receive any flack there . I can only assume that flute players have come to accept synthetic in their construction. Or perhaps because there are other makers offering the same service. I dont really know??? My beginners flutes are recommended by Colin Goldie the maker of Overton whistles. He was kind enough to pay me a vist at my home and personally try my instruments out for himself. (This is not name dropping it is a fact check the forum and check with him)
I consider my customers to be my best critics and not certain members of this forum. All I have seen so far is what i can only describe as the most appalling behaviour I have ever witnessed. I am not surprised that there was talk of shutting this forum down. It seems that some people have the mentality of a child and need constant reminder to watch their manners. I refer here to the post by DW.
If you expect newcomers (and I include myself here) to the forum to have respect for you, and the advice that you give ,you need to show it to each other first.
all the best
John
edit
Well said Sean,
“Since”
when has this thing about beginners having to make do with second grade pipes been O.K,? whether £300 or £700 the chanter should play in
tune, I would not buy a practice set that was not able to be up graded to a half set due to poor quality, their going to have to start all over again
when the time comes that they decide to play on drones, thats if the beginner ever manages to learns on a set like this as mentioned, he or she needs a good chanter from the beginning. people are not as poor as you think! why do you think the reputable makers books are full, people
are lost to were to go for a well crafted set of pipes, people are now
just taking a chance because Uilleann pipes are scarse and they want
a set, they are being ripped Off! the pipes end up back on the net for
sale for some other innocent person to go through the same procedure,
its so easy to use lots of excuses and make easy money with Uilleann
pipes, Uilleanns are not hard to play,people give up on them
simply because they’ve been sold CRAPP,RUBBISH, there are much better words I would love to use to decribe such sets but I’ll