Anybody out there familiar with Michael Vignoles’ work?
I have the chance to buy a second hand Vignoles flat half-set for $1500 (key o’ C).
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I’ve had a brief look at them last night.
Seemed okay – a chromatic tuner showed that the chanter was fairly true.
They required a fair bit of wind to keep going.
I’ve never heard of the maker.
(Forgot to mention: this is $1500 canadian)
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NP,
If you want to see if Vignoles has been discussed here before you can use the search feature near the top right side of the screen. Any topics that contain the name in your search will show up in the list.
Through my experience with four different sets of Vignoles pipes, a flat set would be the best thing for them. Place them directly under the wheels of your car and drive back and forth about a dozen times!
On the other hand if you have played the ones in questions, like them, and find they are a reasonable price then go for it…I believe them to be a rare find.
Thanks John, Kevin and Tony.
John: what’s the experience that makes you want to “flatten” Vignoles sets? (I see that “Hobgoblin Music” sells these things off the rack, which makes me downright suspicious right off.)
still undecided,
NP
NP, you might want to keep things closer to home try these Canadian pipemakers… even if you don’t buy their pipes, they can be a valuable resource for reeds, advice, repairs, etc.
http://www.kennedysuilleannpipes.com/
http://home.thezone.net/~pipes/index.htm
First I have to say that all the sets I had in my hands were not new from the maker…but I don’t see how that makes much of a difference.
Simply put, none of the sets were in tune either with themselves or any music system known to natural man. Almost all of them had been taped or altered in some way to get something close to a scale out of them. I’ve been told by several other ex-Vignoles owners that this is more the rule than the exception.
Thanks for all the help.
Cheers,
NP
I don’t know who John Allison is, but I have purchased a full set of pipes from Michael Vignoles, and they are the work of a true artisan and musician. I consider myself most priveliged to be playing a set of his pipes, as he has a interntional reputation for the quality of his work. I have never had any problems with my set and friends who also own his pipes, cannot give greater praise to his craftmanship. We all had the pipes made for us, and perhaps Mr. Allison, your friends purchsed them second hand? Once they are out of the hands of the pipemaker, he has no control over the care and maintenence they are given. As we all know, all pipes need to maintained properly. I find it very hard to imagine a set of his pipes ever being in question, and if “Northern Piper” would care to contact him, as I did before purchasing my pipes, I think you will find that he stands fully behind his work. He always responded to any questions I had in a very timely manner. This is the first time I have ever seen any negitive response to anything he has made, therefore I am most surprised to see such a harsh opinion of his work on this forum. If you have questions, go to pipemaker himself. Or better yet, take a trip to Ireland and see his workshop for yourself! I think it is important to be able to discuss the pipes with the seller, after all, he is the one who had them last! We are entitled to our opinions, but Mr. Allison, in MY opinion, what you have said verges on the grounds of slander. You are talking about a man who has spent nearly half his life making these pipes, giving workshops, educating and playing the pipes. And he is creating something that is all but a lost art. I should think one piper would have greater respect for not only another musician, but the maker of the instrument for which you play. It sounds more like a personal vendetta than constructive critisim. The sophmoric cartoons and comments speak for themselves.
“This is the first time I have ever seen any negitive response to anything he has made, therefore I am most surprised to see such a harsh opinion of his work on this forum.”
P. O’Callahan, I’m suprised that you’re suprised.
We’re a rather docile bunch here. You’ve taken quite a stand about defending Mr. Vignoles. Typically, a few words stating your satisfaction would be sufficient. Instead you go on defending his pipemaking career, which in my mind sends out an alert.
P. O’Callahan who are you?
P. O’Callahan…always good to hear a fresh voice on C&F. Most of us will consider anything from either side. What is written about pipes and pipemakers isn’t the way most people I know determine their value, esp on the internet. In fact, I remember thinking that I’d be more likely to hold off from forming an opinion if someone came down hard on a particular pipemakers name. I might even be inspired to investigate further to see if there was anything to it. One pipemaker in particular, who went through this same thing earlier, proved himself to be more than just OK.
I always defend pipemakers who can make and play their own sets satisfactorily. Others may not know how to get them working. This has proved to be true with another pipemaker too, Tim Britton. Some have had nothing good to say about his pipes, but I remember back in the late 80’s, playing in a band for a concert (flute) with Tim on the pipes (a five piece Irish band). I never even pulled my pipes out because he was so much better than me. I remember his pipes sounding perfect, his reeds worked great. He didn’t seem to mind high dry climates either and told me stories about playing for school districts, at 6700 ft. el. in So. Central Colorado where it’s so dry that even Paddy Maloney can’t seem to get his own reeds working right.
I don’t know much about Vignoles, but I have seen pictures of a couple of his sets of pipes, and have visited his web site. At the 2002 Milwaukee Irish Fest, Michael Vignoles was the featured pipe maker in the “cultural village” area of the festival. So he does get around apparently, and coming all the way from Galway, Ireland. Sound sample of him playing his pipes can be heard at: http://irishpipesmaker.com/sounds/5.mp3
I’ve heard negative comments about Michael’s pipes before, but I never took them serious because I’d have to know how good that piper is before I’d believe his spin on things.
Lorenzo,
I could not agree with you more on having to know the artist before being able to form an opinion. I have personally met and heard Mr. Vignoles play and I was humbled by his abilities!
When I saw the comment I commented on, I just couldn’t let that one go! I hope everyone on this forum is as open minded as you and they don’t take everything written here as gospel! I appreciate your quick reply to the issue addressed. Go raibh maith agat! P. O’Callahan
Tony,
I am new to the forum and found the reading most interesting. Having met the man personally and seeing his work first hand, I had commisioned a set of pipes to be made for me. As I said they are of excellent quality. I must admit I may have gotten a little carried away there! LOL! I live in the Pacific Northwest and all this rain must be getting to me! :roll: Still, I think there is a certain respect due to anyone who carries on the tradition of pipemaking. It must be Irish in me! P. O’Callahan
I do know who this John Allison and I will back him 100%!! To date, I have never heard/read/or known of anyone having a good opinion of a set of Vignoles pipes (excepting, of course, the set you may have). If you were to search through the archives of this board and the previous two boards you would see that this holds true.
We are entitled to our opinions, but Mr. Allison, in MY opinion, what you have said verges on the grounds of slander. You are talking about a man who has spent nearly half his life making these pipes, giving workshops, educating and playing the pipes. And he is creating something that is all but a lost art. I should think one piper would have greater respect for not only another musician, but the maker of the instrument for which you play. It sounds more like a personal vendetta than constructive critisim. The sophmoric cartoons and comments speak for themselves.
“Opinions are like noses…everybody has one”. Do you think that attacking me personally will make his past work any better?
Well, as I say you are entitled to your opinion. And I wil assume you don’t know many people who use his pipes. As I know several, and have not heard a complaint about his craftsmanship. In the end, we all pick the pipes which are right for us. They can’t be chosen for us. The only opinion that matters in that aspect, is our own. I just happen to dsagree with you. P. O’Callahan slan!
P. O’Callahan,
Welcome to the C&F message board.
A while back Lorenzo started a topic called ‘Pictures of Your Pipes’ it’s become the longest thread in the Uilleann Pipe Forum. I invite you to add to it by submitting pictures of your set. If you don’t have a place to host your picture online, we will gladly help out. The link is:
http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=8172&sid=ed46fd300899eeee7624dd096bcd9be3
Tony,
Thanks for letting me know about that! I will go take a look & I will be more than happy to submit a pic! P. OCallahan
First I have to say that all the sets I had in my hands were not new from the maker…but I don’t see how that makes much of a difference.
– John Allison
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Well, in my opinion, if you don’t think that a set of pipes being in the hands of God-only-knows-who doesn’t make a difference, then perhaps you’ll loan your pipes to me for a few hours and I’ll “work on them for a bit”, and we’ll see if you can ever get them in tune again.
The fact is, you make comments like that out of hand and it makes ME suspect that you know very little about what you’re talking about.
As an example, I can take a brand-new, right off the showroom floor Corvette, and have it working like a rusted-out DeSoto in no time at all. The reason is my own inexperience with things of an automotive nature. That might leave a casual observer with the impression that Chevrolet makes terrible sports cars.
The same goes for pipes - if you don’t know what’s been done to them after they’ve left the hands of the maker, then you have no business making comments about the ability of the pipemaker.
As it happens, I own a set of pipes made by Michael Vignoles, and have owned and played them regularly for the past six years. Through my own inexperience, I had some second thoughts about the purchase (early on).
But as my experience has grown, I haven’t had to touch them in the least in the past three years (knock on wood) - with the exception of normal maintenance on tightening the joints, etc.
I visited with Michael last October in his shop, and he provided me with two new regulator reeds, and a new baritone drone reed. While there, I was able to play a new set that he’d just completed. It was a very well-tuned set of pipes, a set that I’d have been happy to own.
Obviously, it’s up to the individual (such as the originator of this thread) as to what pipes he eventually owns. It might help, though, if people like yourself would try to stifle yourself when it comes to unfounded opinions on someone’s ability - especially when those opinions are based on “great unknowns” - such as “what did the owners of those pipes DO to them before they tried to sell them as a lost cause”.