Alas, I have had no luck deciphering the search function here, so I am forced to ask a “whistles for dummies” question at large.
I am a very happy Burke (brass and aluminum) whistle owner, both high and low D. They are wonderful instruments, buttery, loud, and responsive, but they are quite imperative about being warmed up before playing. Since I also play mandolin and cittern, and sometimes switch instruments mid-set, this is somewhat problematic. Volume is not a priority, so I’m considering a wooden whistle, that would not require pre-warming. Am I correct in thinking wooden whistles don’t require warming up?
Also, are they generally higher priced and more upkeep, needing regular oiling, like wooden flutes?
Or should I just buy a cheap blonde Generation/Clarke/Feadog and hope for the best, and blame it on a cheap whistle when it sounds bad? JK. (that means Just Kidding)
Yes buy it all. The sooner the better to catch up with the rest of us whistle nuts. Also check with Annie about big bags to carry them in, and make sure there is room for a flute or two. Nothing worse than showing up at a session or gig, and not have the one that will top the person next to you.
Some whistles do better than others when played cold; my Burkes are actually some of my most forgiving whistles in that regard.
If you haven’t recently cleaned your whistles, I would suspect there may be a condensate building up in the windway.
My very best whistle, my Overton D, plays beautifully when warm, by the way, but it needs to be warm both to be in tune and to be fully responsive.
I’ve found inexpensive whistles to also be prone to clog when played cold, so I’m not sure that they would do any better for you. Of course, they are inexpensive, and it’s always good to have a few extra whistles around, so why not?
I’m interested in the cold whistle = flat note syndrome…
I’m familiar with the necessity to warm up a whistle to get it in tune (I think that this has more to do with the air temperature than the actual temperature of the whistle body though). But, can anyone explain what happened to me a few weeks ago…
I was doing some recording with a couple of friend I play with regularly (fiddle and accordian). Despite warming up the whistle (a Clarke’s Sweetone in D), I was consistantly 20 cents flat, which was odd cos I’m usually bang in tune. It was a very cold day, and the recording studio had no heating, so my fingers were almost turning blue. When I got back home to a warm house, bingo - back in tune!
If you have access to power on stage, get yourself a little neck warming blanket, possibly 20 Dollars or so in price, set on the right temperatur and put the whistles on it, this will keep them in playing temperature. No power access then one of these plastic jelly bags for cooling or heating down might do the job, too they will just loose heat during the gig. A friend who often plays in churches has this little heating blanket inside a whistle case and it works well, Colin has bought himself one for this reason.
Brigitte
P.S. in regards to the flat Sweetone, there is basically two physics that kick in and affect it, how much each is responsible on its own for producing a 20cents flatness on a high D I do not know, there are formulars online if you are into the maths about it.
Metal expands or shrinks in hot or cold temperature. We are just discussing here how much the heat or cold might affect the length/diameter ratio of a high D.
The speed of sound also is influenced by temperature, warm temperature it is faster.
I found on Wikipedia a German page, explaining temperature changes on Organ pipes and per 1 degree Celsius it says, tuning changes by 3,3 cents.
There are far more knowlegable wood mavens here, but I’ll give it a go.
Nope, not really. Most whistles are voiced to play in tune at room temperature. So a cold wood whistle will play flat. And the same thermal properties that make wood whistles slower to cool down to ambient temperature also make them slower to warm up when cold. Playing a cold wooden whistle can risk cracking.
Maintenance is not such a big deal, oiling a few times a year. But play-in can be a problem if you don’t play it regularly. Ideally, new instruments should be played in only a few minutes the first day, a bit longer the second day, etc. until the wood adjusts. An instrument left idle for a while needs to go through this process again. The danger is in deforming the fipple blade and block.
So you may be trading one set of problems for another.
FWIW, my Burke thin-tubed aluminum D is very quick to warm up when cold. A few seconds tightly in both hands, then a few seconds blowing warm air through the closed tube - hands over holes and finger over fipple window. Even switching in mid-set, it’s usually ready to go by the first A repetition. Heavy brass may be slower to warm. In a critical concert situation in a cold room, I’d probably use a portable sock warmer or heating pad.
Sound travels more slowly in cold air. So a cold air column effectively lengthens the whistle from the point of view of the standing waves within the tube, which lowers the pitch. Only a portion of your breath goes to warming the air column; the rest is out the fipple window. So if you’re playing a thin-walled Clarke in a freezing cold room, the light touch of your fingers and thumbs won’t be nearly enough to keep it warm. You’d need a tuneable whistle that you can push in far enough to compensate for the average ambient temperature conditions.
Whistles clog when hot moist breath comes in contact with the cold windway of a whistle, causing condensation. The little droplets of water clog the mouthpiece.
If you warm the mouthpiece by blowing your hot moist breath through it, you are causing the very thing you are trying to avoid. However, if you warm the head of the whistle to body temperature by holding it in your dry hands, putting it in your pocket etc, when you blow into it the moisture in your warm breath contacts a warm whistle which produces much less condensation. Simple physics.
Your cornet has a spit valve, right? This hot breath, cold metal idea is exactly why you need a spit valve at all.
Anyone have any comments about composite whistles warming up? I mean, my aluminum Alba (low D) sounds very different after warming up, but, my composite Burke (high D) always sounds the same to my ear; I don’t notice any change at all in the Burke as I play it.
(But, I only whistle at home, so far, as my whistling is not yet good enough for me to whistle at sessions. So, I’m not sure I would even notice if the composite whistle’s tuning changed as it warmed up.)
A lot of this is going to depend on how cold the room is in which you are playing.
If you are a performer under hot stage lights then you’re not going to need to warm up anything. (Unless you have stage fright and the Icy Cold Hands of Creeping Doom. )
On the other hand…
If you like to keep your house in the high 60’s in summer–some people seem to enjoy living in a refrigerator --then you’re going to need to warm up any wind instrument for it to play well.
"some people seem to enjoy living in a refrigerator "
or “England” as we prefer to call it
ducks and awaits “you think that’s cold” comments from Canadians
Seriously though, some great comments and all very useful. I’m going to try a wheatie for my whistles next time I have to play in the cold. On warming up the whistle, I take it that the best thing is actually not to warm up the mouthpiece (at least if it’s a composite whistle).
I take it that the best thing is actually not to warm up the mouthpiece (at least if it’s a composite whistle).
No, I’d say the best thing would be to warm it in your hands or under your arm.
Warming a cold whistle (regardless of material) by blowing warm, moisture-laden breath through it may not be the best way, as your windway may already be half-full of water before you ever start to play.
Maybe not … But I do it all the time. A quick puff / suck through the windway and the condensation is gone. No biggie. Many good whistle players that I know do it. Whatever works.
There’s a joke in there somewhere about no room in my pants for a whistle …
Through a little research here are some cool science facts.
Volumetrically speaking, Aluminum is more affected by temperature than brass is. That is, Aluminum will show more shrinkage per drop in degree of temperature.
However Aluminum is a better conductor of heat so it will actually warm up quicker than brass.
Not sure about composites or wood as their material makeups are a bit more complicated.
Theoretically if you had two whistles of exact same dimensions and design with one being aluminum and one being brass, the aluminum one should always be a bit flatter in cold weather. However it will take less time for it to literally “warm up”.
edit: I just forgot that woods are great insulators. And shrinkage may vary greatly, so woods are probably always best played when you know they are warm.
Delrin is even less affected by thermal expansion/contraction than brass or aluminum. However it does take the longest to “warm up”.
So if you find yourself running late to a session and you are carrying your whistles in out of the cold, start with a composite as it will play slightly better on average than any metal whistle. But if you have a few minutes to say hello and order a beer then pull out your aluminum once you sit down to play
Different materials require different amounts of heat to warm up the same amount. This value is called Specific Heat. It is measure in Joules of energy required to raise one gram of material one degree Kelvin. For some common whistle materials, the values of specific heat are:
Aluminum .897
Wood .42
Copper .385
Silver .233
So, an aluminum whistle will take over twice as much heat to warm up as a brass whistle of the same weight (I assuming the speciifc heat of brass is similar to copper). The amount of heat to warm a high D whistle is so small as to make this discussion probably moot, however there may be a noticible diifference in a low D, especially if you compared a silver low D to an aluminum one.
I’ve been playing recorder for something like 35 years and have always warmed up the head of the recorder in a pocket or arm pit (I promise to never sell one of them here!) before a performance. Not only is tuning affected, but so is the amount of condensate generated – warming up the instrument will certainly produce less condensate build-up. Can’t speak about brass/aluminum, but the warm up time s/b very little given the conductivity of metal vs. wood. My guess is, given your situation, that brass or aluminum will beat wood 100% of the time.
-dan
Most whistles are voiced to play in tune at room temperature. So a cold wood whistle will play flat. And the same thermal properties that make wood whistles slower to cool down to ambient temperature also make them slower to warm up when cold. Playing a cold wooden whistle can risk cracking.
--then you’re going to need to warm up any wind instrument for it to play well.
