I’m a n00b, trying to figure out “keys” with pennywhistles. I’m perplexed. Why, when, and where does someone find a use for an Eb whistle as is sold in the Blackbird set of whistles?
Cheers — Larry
They are responsive and sound nice and bright?
Isn’t that enough?
I’ve no idea where and under what circumstances you intend to play. If you’re playing by yourself, it’s only purposes may be to provide a bit of variety and avoid ear fatigue. If you’re playing with a vocalist, you may need to play in a key with which the singer is comfortable.
Keep in mind, that playing an Eb whistle doesn’t require that you have music written in Eb (or Ab as that’s the second key on an Eb whistle). Many whistlers look at the different key whistles as having the same function as a guitar capo. They allow the player to change keys and continue to read music written in the more common key of D.
So people may turn them into key of E whistles???
www.tuxedomusic.com
Eb - When you need it , you need it. You apparently haven’t run into a situation where you need it. Right?
As for why you have Eb whistles, here’s some conjecture on my part. I’d probably blame Beethoven,Mozart,Mahler and Hayden. Not sure exactly who started it but a fair amount of classical music is written in Eb. Some call it the “heroic” key. I am not sure if there were a lot instruments specifically made in Eb before then but there have been since then. So band instruments show up made in Eb and Bb. If you want to play along with the band then another Eb or Bb instrument is the choice, hence Eb and Bb whstles. Again this is mostly conjecture on my part.
As for when you need it, beside playing band music, well you need it when everyone else is playing in either Eb, Ab or their relative minor keys. Maybe you play in a band and all the music is arranged in Eb. You may need it because that’s the key the singer in the group is most comfortable with. You may need it because you can’t play along with Mary Bergin’s Feadoga Stain album without it (ok, these days we have pitch shifting software 
). You may need it because you play in a church group and God has ordained that a particular hymn or song is to be played in Eb (the music director is likely more responsible in this case). Maybe the piper you play with can’t quite get it together and his tuning just falls short of the key of D. Some musicians only speak Eb and they don’t transpose very well. When you want to play Hector the Hero 
. So there are a few reasons when you need Eb.
As for where you use it, normally in the same places or circumstances you play any whistle. And the Eb is smaller than a D whistle so it can fit into places at those times when a D whistle is just too large. Or maybe because it’s a “flat” key you play it so it won’t roll off the pub table so easily.
It’s just another key, another voice, another color on the palette, another tool in the box. Like Peter said, it’s nice and bright, especially compared to the despairing key of D.
Feadoggie
Or maybe because it’s a “flat” key you play it so it won’t roll off the pub table so easily.
A C whistle won’t roll off the table, Eb is at the cutting edge of whistle playing.
Everything below D = flat, D = concert pitch, everything higher than D = sharp.
Silly me. I thought the sharp keys were cutting edge.
Didn’t read the small print did you?
I did explain the different terminology in the last post
Hmmpf! Try carving a roast with a D# and see what happens. You absolutely NEED an Eb!!!
What fine print? Many of us older folks can’t read such small fonts. Besides this is a whistle forum, the world does not revolve around the pipes.
JTC, I’ve got no beef with you. More like a prime ribbing, I’d say.
Feadoggie
Don’t take me seriously either, Peter.
. Besides this is a whistle forum, the world does not revolve around the pipes.
Where did that one come from?
I usually hear the same terminology applied to both pipes and whistles (and the odd instrument, concertinas spring to mind). That aside, I wasn’t looking for an argument.
Didn’t read the small print, did you?
Ah feck, walked right into that one, didn’t I?
If this was Facebook, I’d click on “like”.
Hypothetical question - if Gen were starting out today to produce a range of whistles, d’you think they might make an E rather than an Eb if they had to choose between the two. And I guess they might sell quite a few whistles in A rather than the high F and high G whistles. So, my fantasy Gen range for the 21st Century is:
“low” A
Bb
C
D
Eb
E
(the un-written rule is that you can only choose six different keys, since they currently produce whistles in six keys)
Ah…maybe that’s it. From the responses (thanks everyone) I should have been more clear about why I was asking the question. I play only by myself and for myself and as I’m pretty isolated here in Quebec City, it’s unlikely I’m going to be playing with anyone else.
What I see is that most whistle manufacturers produce D and C whistles. There are a few that create a wide range of keys. But what I also see is that if they don’t want to produce them all, the next most popular seems to be the Eb (eg - the Blackbird whistles). I assumed there was a reason that I didn’t understand.
hat’s the key the singer in the group is most comfortable with. You may need it because you can’t play along with Mary Bergin’s Feadoga Stain album without it
I only dream of playing along with Feadoga Stain This, I guess, could be another reason. If whistle players like the sound of an Eb to play songs written in D, then it would explain their popularity. My ear is as tin as my Clarke whistle. Does Bergin play an Eb regularly?
those times when a D whistle is just too large. Or maybe because it’s a “flat” key you play it so it won’t roll off the pub table so easily.
That’s a feature
the box. Like Peter said, it’s nice and bright, especially compared to the despairing key of D.
Those of you with experience and who have other people to play with might find it hard to fathom how we noobies struggle with this stuff. Or maybe I’m just stupid. But, for instance, it’s easier to say “You play all whistles, in all keys, the same.” Interpreting this is hard for me.
At the risk of starting a ‘don’t waste time with dots on a page’ debate, I’ll tell you why. If I grab some ABC notation for Sally Gardens and it’s notated in C, how do I play it on my D whistle? Do I simply transcribe everything up a whole note? In this case, I have no choice if I’m going to play the notes that are the C below the base note D on my whistle. In short, when do you simply transcribe and when do you change whistles?
Thanks again, everyone.
Cheers — Larry
You’ll struggle to play a tune in the key of C on a D whistle. Transpose the abc into the key of D. If you’re just playing on your own, then play it on any whistle you like, but if you wanted to play it in the key of C, pick up a C whistle and play it as if it were a D whistle. Hope that makes sense!
And welcome…
I understand what you’ve said. Whether I comprehend, however… Truth is, my brain is spinning with all this stuff…much faster than my fingers are moving, I’m afraid. But having fun nonetheless.
Cheers — Larry
Let me try to simplify this for you… On every major key whistle, you can play a scale from the root note to it’s next octave the exact same way using these fingerings:
xxxxxx
xxxxxo
xxxxoo
xxxooo
xxoooo
xooooo
ooooox
oxxxxx
You can do that because the relative distance between the notes is the same no matter what the whistle’s key. Since most Irish trad whistle music is written in D, D is the key we learn. Many, perhaps even most, never have to read music in a key other than D because if you need to play in a different key, you simply change whistle to whatever key you need and still play as if you were playing a D.
For example, if you want to play Sally Gardens in C, you don’t need music written in C. Take your music written in D, substitute a C whistle for your D whistle, keep the fingering exactly the same as if you were playing in D, and voila! …you’re playing Sally Gardens in C.
Yeah, that’s probably the thing to do, although, if you run across this in trad music, you may not have a hard time finding the same piece in D if you look around. As you’re very new to the instrument, there’s going to be no shortage of music written in D for you until about …oh …the year 2085 or so.
Personally, I’m a guitar player first (35+ years); I can scratch my way around a piano fairly well. I have no problem reading music and I have a good knowledge of music theory so I’m not coming at this as a total n00b but I just don’t see a practical reason for a whistle player to know how to play in anything than D and G. I can think of some rare exceptions where it might be an issue (for someone with perfect pitch, if you’re handed a piece of music in a different key and you don’t have time to transpose it before you have to perform it) but those I can think of would only apply to a few people of unusual talent and ability. You’ll get different opinions here on that, I’m sure.
The root note… it’s written in C so the low note in the scale will be C. As you progress, you’ll occasionally run across pieces written in D that call for a C# below the root note. Some makers sell whistles with an extra hole to accommodate this or you can get the note by using your pinky to partially block the end hole of the whistle while fingering the low D note. But that’s something you shouldn’t come across for quite a while.
Also, your whistle has a secondary major key that’s a fourth above the marked key. On your D whistle, it will be the key of G and you play a G scale this way:
xxxooo
xxoooo
xooooo
oxxooo
oxxxxx
xxxxxo
xxxxoo
xxxooo
The last 3 notes are in the second octave.
The advantage to playing in the secondary major key is that you’ll have notes available below your root note.
I hope some of this helped. Ask more questions if this is still fuzzy.
Ha…you may have identified the ONLY thing I understand
…but I just don’t see a practical reason for a whistle player to know how to play in anything than D and G. I can think of some rare exceptions where it might be an issue (for someone with perfect pitch, if you’re handed a
I’d bet you saw this as a side comment that might be disputed. I see it as a most valuable piece of information in response to my original question. As you’ve described, as a n00b (gotta make sure I spell that right can find plenty of ABC notation in D-major to keep them busy forever.
Where I’ve become “confused” has been in interpreting two things. First, lots of you guys have whistles in half a dozen keys AND if I go to a site like Sessions I find notation in a variety of keys. Interpreting what that means (or doesn’t) is difficult…until you say "most whistle players think in D and G. Puts me on stable ground, even if it might slip a bit once I become a more proficient whistle-player. Thanks.
Also, your whistle has a secondary major key that’s a fourth above the marked key. On your D whistle, it will be the key of G and you play a G scale this way:
xxxooo
xxoooo
xooooo
oxxooo
oxxxxx
xxxxxo
xxxxoo
xxxooo
I’ve been trying to master that scale (on D-Gen). Still working on eliminating the sour notes with the overtones but while I lack talent, I make up for it in persistence.
I hope some of this helped. Ask more questions if this is still fuzzy.
Immensely. The Internet is a wonderful thing for those of us trying to learn things. But it can also overwhelm. You’ve grounded me somewhat, more so than the 3 books I’ve got. They want to talk about playing different keys but they don’t discuss why you’d want to, why you’d need to, or why you might not need to worry about it
Cheers — Larry
I’m glad to have been able to help. In looking back at what I said, I noticed a mistake of omission on my part that I sort of fixed later on, but just to be clear…
That should have said “D & G” but I think you sorted that out on your own okay.
Pretty much every song I’ve learned for the whistle has either come from a book or I’ve learned it by ear. I haven’t really had to search for much music so I’m not sure what keys you’re running across. My knowledge of ITM is less than most here but I’d guess that if music is notated in a key other than D or G it may not have been intended for whistle in the first place. Or it may be the case that some tunes are traditionally played in some particular key and thus presented that way.