I have been typing on a computer keyboard for some 20 years without problem, but I have been playing for 4 months, and am starting to feel the effects of CAS in both of my wrists. Anyone else had to deal with this? Am I holding the whistle wrong (I hold it what feels most comfortable)?
At my age, 49+, I think it may be typical of a harsh life and just means my wrists need better flexibility via exercise and stretching, but any 2 cents appreciated.
Thanks
Stew
Well this is probably the most unlikely response you will get. No email address so went to your website - wow!
After 18 yrs 0f my craft…wrists started to go bad and weak. I got involved with the yoga like exercises from the book Ancient Secrets of the Fountain of Youth. 'Has helped in many many ways and wrists are fine…whistling no problem…violin might be but back to the “Rites” again. I think I still have an extra copy of the book if you’d like it. It works! Gm
As an IT professional I too spend a tremendous amount of time at a keyboard. Although, my wrists do get sore from time-to-time when I’m at a computer I haven’t noticed that playing a whistle makes them any worse. If anything, I think my wrist soreness has become less frequent since I have begun playing. I do tend to play with my wrists fairly straight so perhaps that is the key?
Perhaps it would be worthwile to examine the way you hold your wrists and hands while you play - bending your wrists sharply (even if they feel comfortable) is not particularily good for them over long periods of time.
I’m not a doctor but AFAIK most repeated stress injuries or disorders can be corrected if caught in the early stages. Don’t forget to check your health insurance benefits - many pay for physiotherapy especially if it effects your performance at work. I once went to a physiotherapist for some back problems. After only a few physiotherapy sessions and consistent use of some exercises she gave me, my back became stronger than it had ever been. In any case some good exercises to improve flexibility and strength can often make the world of difference. As a side effect the additional strength and flexibility might improve your playing as well 
I do hope you don’t have to give up whistling!
I hold my wrists like her right hand:
C&F open page ladyI am going to work on keeping my wrists like her left, lifting the old elbows (probably get shoulder bursitis).
g’mouse: I will email you re: the book.
Thanks
Stew
“That fish looks like Moe!” ~Curly
[ This Message was edited by: StewySmoot on 2001-10-23 15:11 ]
Stew,
I too have been working on keyboards for a long time (support in the computer field). When I was a full time programmer, I developed a related malady, Capital Tunnel Syndrom. Capital is just like Carpal but it involves the Capital nerve instead of the Carpal. The capital nerve manages the little finger and half the ring finger. I eventually had it operated on. At the time my orthopedist gave me a number of refreshers on Repetitive Stress Injuries and how to avoid them. His most frequent advice was don’t do the exact same thing all the time. For example, move the keyboard around, move your body around so that the orientation i different. For whistle you might find that using any position ALL the time is going to give you more problems that using a number of positions. Stand up,sit down, whistle with the instrument vertical to the floor, whistle with the instrument horizontal to the floor. Swap whistles play thin whistles and thick whistles in the same key or alternate between high and low whistles.
His other repeted advise was to relax, if your typing make a conscious effort to relax your sholders while continuing to type. Same with whistle, relax what mucscle you can, to the degree you can.
I have applied the principles: varing motion and varing intensity or degree of relaxation to a lot of repetitive tasks. I have not had any relaps. If varying your stress doesn’t resolve the problem, you should see a neurologist. They are often complicating factors precipitate the injuries and a good neurologist can help your check for those other factors.
Gran’s recommendation for the yoga sounds good from my Orthedist’s point of view. Yoga includes flexibility exercises, increasing the variance of the motion and its intensity. It also seeks to reduce overall systemic stress.
Good luck and I hop this helps you …
Recently I talked to my doctor about Carpal Tunnel, and she said that often times at night people will sleep with their wrists bent, and this is often times the cause of Carpal Tunnel. What you can do is wear a wrist brace at night. I did this and still do sometimes tt works great. Quick Question while we are on the topic of CTS: I wondering if any bodhran plays had experinced CTS, after playing the Bodhran? It seems like Bodhran would cause CTS more than the whistle. Well that just my 2 cents. Hope everyone’s wrists feels better!
Caryn
Wrist and hand problems become pretty
scary for me about three months ago.
They’re gone now, touch wood!
First, there are people called
hand-therapists, who specialize
in these problems. I saw one, much
to my benefit. If your problems persist
you might see one.
Second, yes, hold the whistle so that
your wrists are in a median position.
Third, relax, relax. Try not to flap
your fingers–part of good playing
is to keep the range of fingers
small. Good posture, relaxed position.
Playing a high D whistle, I pretend
that it is floating in my fingers.
Fourth, if you are playing low whistles
a lot, shift to something smaller
and less heavy for most of your practice.
There was a while where I switched mostly
to a Clarke classic.
Fifth, wear a wrist brace if you find
that you are sleeping with your wrists
bent.
Sixth, yes to yoga, especially for
hand, arms, and wrists.
Kneel on the floor, turn your hands
out so that the wrists are away
from you, the fingers toward you,
put them on the floor, and rock/stretch…
After a tune, occasionally close
your hand into a loose fist, then
open the hand quickly, as if you
are trying to shoo flies.
Sit straight, stretch your right hand
out, your palm facing away, bend at the elbow and put your right hand under your chin.
Repeat. If you’re having trouble with
the left wrist, do it for that.
You can make some of these exercises
part of your playing, at breaks, etc.
If something starts hurting while
you’re playing, stop.
Best wishes…
It’s true that working with your wrist bent puts you at more risk for carpal tunnel syndrome. You need to look at your playing posture in the mirror and get familiar with how a straighter wrist posture feels. Also, try to relax your grip. I tend to hold on tighter when I’m going fast and try to remind myself to relax. I have developed hand pain from a combination of bending my wrist backward and tensing. And I’ve managed to keep it under control by becoming more aware of what’s causing it. I recently started feeling hand pain after putting in longer-than-normal practice times. A rest in between would be in order.
Stretch the forearm muscles by holding the arm straight out in front with palm forward, fingers straight up, pull the fingers back gently. Also stretch the opposing muscles by bending the wrist downward (toward palm) while fingers are curled. Push wrist down with the other hand. Doing this will stretch almost all the finger-controlling muscles. Massage between the long bones of the hand and the muscles below the thumbs. Carefully stretch the thumb muscles by bending the thumbs backward. Hold all stretches at least 30 sec. (I’m not making this stuff up. I have credentials. 
)
I tend not to put too much time into low whistle practice because it always hurts my hands, especially my thumb muscles. I have to squeeze a bit to keep the holes well sealed.
Great tips Tony…will print them off for future reference. I did or do notice some discomfort playing the low D for any length of time. Same with bodhran in excess. When I have had a problem with my wrist(s)… especially at night… I sleep on my stomach or side and always have an extra pillow handy so would rest lower arm and hand in a straight line. It seemed to help as my hand always wanted to go to sleep before the rest of me. LOL Gm
Many trad whistlers like to play with the whistle oriented towards the right side of the body which as well as enableing better monitoring in a session also promotes a more ergonomic holding position especially when the piper grip is applied and takes the strain off the right wrist,and if the barrel is slightly rotated anti-clockwise the kink at the wrist is eliminated resulting in a more relaxed right hand position and less stretching of the tendon.There,s sure to be some debate over this but it works for me.Peace, Mike
[ This Message was edited by: mike.r on 2001-10-24 03:31 ]
[ This Message was edited by: mike.r on 2001-10-24 06:33 ]
Thanks for all of the tips, advice…
I did a bit of self-analysis last night, and found I was breaking rule # A: RELAX!!
My wrists were loose, my playing fingers were comfortable, but I picked up the habit of severely locking my thumbs! I dont know whether this was an unconscious compensation for practicing with different whistles, or just not paying attention as I held the whistle. Anyhow I did want to share that info…
Thanks again all. You’re the greatest
Stew
We who live in the Detroit/Windsor area always have that fear of “Carp in the Tunnel syndrome” every time we use the international automobile tunnel between the two cities.
Comes from the fear of seeing condensation dripping along the walls and doesn’t matter how tight you grip the steering wheel, you can never seem to relax.
Mark
I know my problem is that I tend to play for hours on end with out a break, and I can feel it in my wrists. So now I set a timer when I’m in a long spell of playing/practicing, to take a break at least every hour. It helps!
I too am a computer professional, and have no problems at all with my wrists. I credit this to some of the above suggestions (particularly changing position frequently) and having a ‘bent’ keyboard with an added wrist rest.
My current problems may have nothing to do with my day to day use of my hands, but I’m finding it horrible. My fingers have been stiffening up, painfully so, mostly at the far end, and especially badly at night. This has come on suddenly and lasted for 3+ weeks, and is affecting my whistling, opening jars, typing. . .
My husband wants me to take a break from whistling to see if that is a contributing factor. I’ll confess to being afraid to do that, just in case he’s proven correct.
Being away from the keyboard didn’t help. Taking a break from horseback riding didn’t help. (The critter can have a tremendous pull when he puts his mind to it). I gave both of those one week, and the nightly stiffness wasn’t affected in the least. Should I take a break from the music too?
Tyghress, I’m no expert but nightly stiffness sounds a little like rheumatism to me, and that isn’t caused by overuse of wrists I think…
Now that you’ve mentioned it, you’ve taken a break from everything except opening jars. Opening jars must be the factor that is causing your pain. Do take a break from opening jars. =)
Tyghress,
so sorry to hear that you are having trouble with your fingers. Hope it is nothing that will impede your whistle playing. If it happens at night, you might want to try and find out what you do with your hands and wrist in your sleep. Maybe wear a wrist brace and see if that helps your hands stay relaxed.
Best!
On 2001-10-25 09:53, Eldarion wrote:
Opening jars must be the factor that is causing your pain. Do take a break from opening jars. =)
But there’s whiskey in the jar! 
Beware if you begin noticing the symptoms mentioned here. If you have noticing numbness / tingling in the ring and little fingers and / or pain just inside the bottom of your elbow, the whistle is likely implicated. The nerve serving these fingers runs through a fairly narrow passage at the elbow, and it is aggravated by the narrowing of the passage which occurs when the elbow bends, especially when the fingers are held bent or moved a lot. I speak here from personal experience, and am currently dealing with this. (Several weeks now of no playing!) Just as carpal tunnel may be aggravated by sleeping with the wrists bent, this condition is aggravated by sleeping with the elbows bent. If this is not corrected, by changing behaviours or by surgery, permanent nerve damage may result! Thought I’d throw this into the ring, as the only symptom I noticed for a long time was the pain at the elbows stuff, and I thought it was tendonitis, which is not nearly as serious, in my book. Need to go now - computers can also aggravate this!
Tyghress, you should definitely see a good doctor soon. Don’t try to self treat something like this. Try to find someone who has experience treating your symptoms, maybe an orthopedist. You might talk to them about taking 100 mg of B6 a day to help with nerve functioning and help to relieve your symptoms. That has helped me with a similar problem. Ideally you want to find the cause and remove or reduce it, not just treat the symptoms.
Good luck,
John
All right…I’m convinced. I’ll make an appointment. Thanks for the input.
I detest doctors.
