What makes a good slow air ?

Uilleann Pipes
1

…in your opinion.
& dont just point me to “Doinna” (or something) altho its a great piece. :slight_smile:

what im trying to discern are the key essential elements, for you, that need to go into the construction of a dramatic, riveting slow air.

is it scale degree motion? ‘singability’? melodic direction? tension & release?
Tonally, is it the avoidance of certain notes that make or break the line?
Is adherance to a few specific ranges (ie tessiturae) on the chanter that give the piece its particular flavour?
Is it essential now to discard the drones and take advantage of the harmonic possibilities offered by a keyboard?
Are balanced, repeated phrases an asset, or is a throughcomposed piece now superior?
Do major or minor modes fall short of the sought after expression of the piece?
What role should melodic motifs play: central, or otherwise?
How much reg is too much?
How deep is the need for (other than purely technical) ornamentation?
Is it essential to exploit the chanter’s timbral variations?

Ok, these are not easy questions imo and there’s a fair lot of jargon in there. Looking for a little more than just ‘play what you feel’. Be specific. Give examples. thx. :smiley:

2

Is it essential now to discard the drones and take advantage of the harmonic possibilities offered by a keyboard?

wow, you just alienated 99% of the fellows here probably with that one…

:boggle:

3

Being in the shallow end of the piping pool and not much on music theory, I’ve heard and I believe it to be true, that you can do a much better job interpreting the air if you know what it’s about in the first place, so do the research.

My two cents, brief and uninteresting as it may be.

4

Down with keyboards. I can’t stand a wash of synth music mixed with pipes. Pipes and solo pipes, especially the flat sets, make the best slow airs.

Listen to sean nos (old style) singers and get your pipes to sing like that as closely as possible.

5

The most important factor, IMHO, is to know and have in mind while playing, the words to the air, in Irish. I am always amused when some Chinese or whatever band tries to play an instrumental version of a song, which is familiar to me, but it always sounds odd to me, as I have the words in mind while they are playing it. It usually comes off not sounding “right”, as the musicians are not aware of the words. It would be great to be fluent in the Irish language, but at least one should listen carefully and memorize as much of the words as is possible and keep them in mind when playing.

6

“I am always amused when some Chinese or whatever band tries to play an instrumental version of a song, which is familiar to me, but it always sounds odd to me, as I have the words in mind while they are playing it.”

That’s a great point and would even be better with a good example. I don’t suppose you (or someone else) has a link to one?

7

thx for replys !
ok so far the consensus tends towards singability (aka cantabile); lyricism, vocalization, word painting, and ‘traditionalism’.

Let me clarify: - Im not concerend with the interpretation of an existing slow air, setting texts (new or old), in Gaelic, (or Mandarin). think more basic. in a pure musical, melodic sense. structural. fundamental. “urlinie”,(if anyones familiar with that term)

Ought your ideal slow air to be built on a set of harmonic changes, ornamented melodic motifs, a directional line, or simply try to imitate plain folksong (range of an octave, within a scale or mode, metrically and rhythmicaly subjugated to the words)?

Or should it be impressionistic, idiomatic of the instrument (as opposed to voice) , have no set repeated structure, be more concerend with “the line”, as opposed to reaching crucial tonal points within the scale or mode?

What is it that sets an emotional, quality, slow air apart from a mere strophic ditty played with exrtreme expresion?

go deeper gents- yer doing great ! give me more ! keep feedin the fire :smiley:

8

The only problem with this statement is that it pre-supposes two things that are not necessarily true:

  1. The air has words; and,
  2. The words are in irish.

Most of the airs I learn are from english language songs (still traditional irish songs, often sung in similarly to a sean nos song, but still.) The airs I learn from songs I learn because I like the words or the story, or the melody moves me. The airs I learn that don’t have words, I learn because the melody appeals to me. I’m not too sure that the airs have much in common that could be analyzed at the level you’re asking. I like it, I learn it… simple as that.

9

In his book Traditional Music in Ireland, Tomás Ó Canainn discusses several factors (such as intervals, cadences, ornamentation) that make a tune “Irish.” He devotes separate chapters to Sean-nós singing, pipes, and fiddle. His discussion is not so much about what makes a tune good as what makes it fit into the Irish tradition, but still, it might give you some good food for thought if you haven’t already read it.

Or, you could study the works of Komar & Melamid, who created paintings and music based on what people surveyed by phone considered good art. Their ideal American painting included a lake, deer, a family and George Washington:)

10

I think there’s too much fuss made about knowing the words. I don’t disagree that it helps to get the phrasing of the tune but I don’t think that a piper should try mimic a singer.

But knowing the words does help the piper interpret the tune. Not all slow airs are laments: in fact, most of the slow airs I know are not laments. Knowing that a song is, for instance, that the theme of a song is love or patriotism, and not sadness, should make a big difference in how it is interpreted by the piper.

11

A few thoughts:
I’m curious as to why you’d want to consider slow airs in a “purely” musical way.
Such an analysis may be possible, but why?

Slow airs, it seems to me, only achieve meaning in the context of memory and social relationships. To ignore that is a conscious analytical choice, but one that, I think, will result in a shallow and incomplete analysis. If I’m playing Anach Chuain in Connemara, the possibility that one of my listeners may be related to one of those drowned in the tragedy is more germane to the air’s effect than a list of musical terminology that is irrelevant to, and not used by, the audience.

Why are you asking us for a prescriptive set of musical characteristics? We encounter the world of slow airs as a genre already formed, and it is varied and multifarious.
If you arrive at a set of prescribed musical characteristics, do compose an air using them, and then see whether anyone thinks it’s any good. I have my doubts.

And I don’t think you can make a “riveting” slow air. A performance is “riveting,” not the air itself. “Riveting” just ain’t guaranteed my musical structure.

Looking for the “urlinie” is reductive. Schenker demonstarted that Beethoven’s 5th went I-V-I. Big deal.
There, start with that. It’s an interesting subject.

12

It’s also entirely subjective. I have heard the same air played in a way I love , and the same air played not as well. I think it really, for me, comes down to mastery of the chanter.

I have wanted to get to a Tionol where someone teaches slow air playing, but haven’t gotten to one yet. One thing I have noticed that I like is, at the end of a phrase, the use of vibrato at the beginning of the note, which then stops to let the pure note come through before the note is completed. Sorry, I know you are looking more for the structure of a good slow air, and this is not what you are looking for. I think you could spend a lifetime on musical analysis of what makes any music “good” or “riveting” and maybe never coming to a true conclusion, due to the changing tastes of audiences. It is a very interesting subject and I am looking forward to seeing other responses.

13

But knowing the words does help the piper interpret the tune. Not all slow airs are laments: in fact, most of the slow airs I know are not laments. Knowing that a song is, for instance, that the theme of a song is love or patriotism, and not sadness, should make a big difference in how it is interpreted by the piper.

Bravo

14

The slow air performances that have made the biggest impression on me are the ones the truly suit – and exploit – the instrument’s (or singer’s) voice so that they sound like they’re just spontaneously springing forth. The “cri de coeur” (“cry from the heart”), I guess you’d call it; the true essence of the thing performing the melody.

I’m trying to learn Paddy Maloney’s “An Speic Seaogach,” (Gay McKeon does a killer turn with his C set on “The Dusty Miller”), and while my performance may never be suitable for public consumption, I’ve been struck by how obvious it is this tune was written by a piper. It uses every corner of the instrument and is just so … well, right for it. It’s totally in the pipes’ voice.

It also has a beginning, middle and end which I kind of prefer in a tune. :slight_smile:

15

Good. Thanks again! so, thus far:
Vocalism, up to a point.
Context. Impressionism.
Mastery of technique.

What else? What else makes a good slow air? stepwise motion? unsetteld harmonic implications? Is the tunes’ context an essential inseperable element? Does this context seperate and elevate a slow air from , again, an expressively played strophic ditty?
Should formal structure matter at all???

dissection is more revealing than imitative interpretation. What makes slow aires …tick..? whats going on …inside the tune…hmmmm?

DEscriptions work fine. :slight_smile: What do we see, what do we hear that makes a slow air satisfying, memorable, distinct?

What I’m interested in is cold, hard, incontrevertible, analytical musical evidence. Describe the musical elements that make any particular piece ‘superior’…( havent had too many concrete exx’s yet :slight_smile: ) for instance
“Because so&so uses the upper 8ve here…it makes the piece”
“Because so&so keeps returning to this motif…it makes the piece”
“Because so&so uses non harmonic chanter tones against this interval on the regs, it makes the piece”

Please, please, please continue!

16

“dissection is more revealing than imitative interpretation”

It may be more revealing, but it’s not more revelatory.
You can’t put a scalpel to the numinous and expect your analysis to reproduce it.
The numinous resides in the performance.

17

o…k…

Thanks to those who took the inquiry seriously :thumbsup:

so far,
The most important, essential aspects seem to be:

1.) Vocalism, but not a strict vocalism. Meaning: (for me):

  • Effective Range of about a 10th
  • Phrases of a manageable length
  • Primarily a legato texture.
    (id very much like to get into the “freeform vs strophic” question but no one seems very interested in that :frowning: nor yet what role melodic motives should play)

2.) Context. It is important wether or not the music is an effective impression of a place or event within the sphere of Irish culture.
and/or if it programmatically translates the artists vision of this place or event into music.
(I’ll add as a subheading to context, “authenticity”- although this seems to matter more to some and less to others)


3.) Genius of performance through technical mastery.
No doubt the artists mojo can spirit a piece to life, & if they got the chops for it, all the better.

My experience has been- well, there’s a song in everyone, and it s only a matter of extracting it intact. To me it seems: some have the ability to extract their song easier than others; and some have more interesting & relevant song-contributions than others. Personally I feel; to assert that a superior product is best left uninspected, and can only be produced by a small number of artists in close touch with context and the vocal tradition, frankly brings us to a creative dead-end. Evidence suggests otherwise.

nowhere near the nub yet.
so.

Lets put the postgrad musical terms to rest.

and pose the question-

What do you, as a practicing uilleann piper, aurally observe in a slow air, that makes it more appealing to you than other slow airs?

18

The two things that I notice in good slow air playing is first the tone of the notes being produced by the piper and secondly the emotional connection. First you have to be familiar with your chanter and know how to get the best out of it and secondly you have to put an emotion connection on the tune or else its just a series of notes.

The idea that its best if you know the words of the song ,I think are not really helpful because it still does not help you make an emotional connection.
The advice of the singer Jimmy O’Brien is that if you don’t know the words of the song or even if you do ,you should make up some of your own and make them about something or someone you care about. A beloved family member who has passed away or even a loved pet would be good. You may even subtitle the air with their name and when you are playing it, play it for them.
This is what being a musician is about.

RORY
PS the idea of coming up with some kind of formula for producing a good slow air is a waste of time.

19

Ye may find the following link helpful in the pursuit of Slow Air Playing.It is the normal standard adjudged at Fleadh cheoil.
http://comhaltas.ie/music/tag/Slow+Air

Then there is this blast frae the past which has long been buried …when I was much more self opinionated.My views are the same on the subject but my human interactive skills with other beings was/is totally undeveloped and probably more Neanderthal than Homo Sapiens Sapien.
My apologies to PJ in particular.
https://forums.chiffandfipple.com/t/slow-airs/27789/1


Lest Ye forget :wink:
https://forums.chiffandfipple.com/t/will-ye-make-a-difference/74730/1

20

“Uilliam” wrote: /… piece of music with no set metre in the accepted sense (ie.outwith of a song)with definite phrasing to ensure balance and expressive of the performers perceived view of the piece, which can then be conveyed to the listener with clarity, and, importantly,without mistakes in technique, which would distract entirely from the flow and the mood which is being created…/

thank you.
now were getting somewhere.
Can it be concluded that: a defining aspect that seperates a slow air from an expressively played tune, is the importance accorded to balanced phrasing, in lieu of meter & agogics?

I am comparatively studying 27 slow airs recorded over a 60 year period, (and not to devise a ‘formula’ a la Erno Lendvai {who is that ??} as many have suggested.), and note the following TENDENCIES: tendencies, as in tendencies, meaning tendencies. In other words, tendencies. not hard, fast rules. Have I mentioned Im speaking of tendencies? some can tend to be precise about semantics, as in having a tendency to do so. :slight_smile: Ive observed tendencies such as:
(& these are just tendencies I’ve observed)

Modified Bipartite structure: A, A, B, A’. (often- A, A, B: A, A, B, A’)
“C” sections are uncommon.
Stepwise motion prevails during ascending pasages.
Use of, (as someone put it quite well above) “every corner of the chanter”.

Older recordings exhibit a TENDENCY to stay within the mode, put greater weight on silences, and are much heavier on the regs.

Newer exx TEND to use more auxillary tones, (often using them to transition into another mode and/or melodic direction) insert rapidly repeated tones in an otherwise tenuto teture,
and are formally a little more complex.

Much of this may be “well, DUH”; but I find it very enlightening, especially in regard to contrasting the older exx with newer ones.
Further, it is interesting to note the commonalities that have tended to be continuous in 60 yrs of recorded slowairs