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I wasn’t going to say anything, but it’s important to know there is nothing wrong with referring to an instrument (or drones) as being at 440hz. Professionals do it all the time. It’s a term that has come to mean standard pitch for the whole instrument…“that piano is about a quarter step below 440.” It would be considered nutty for someone to correct a piano tuner and say, “no, not every string on the piano is about a quarter step below A49.”
Nothing to do with A=440Hz. Nothing wrong with tuning to A or G on the chanter. If you are playing UPs without drones or regs you are hardly playing UPs anymore, are you? (Why not try recorder? Royce can get you a good deal. 
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I still maintain my original point that after tuning the regs to the chanter, you should make sure your regs are tuned true to the drones. 
djm
Well said…Lorenzo
Alan I’m with ye 100% on this 
It seems to me that there is a lot of pontificating going on frae (I suspect) bats..that would be far better employed learning the instrument rather than endlessly talking about them,and thereby shewing a woeful ignorance on the subject. :roll:
I started to dabble with the regs after about 2 years playing,Martin Nolan at the time, told me to stop ,in no uncertain terms(as is his way)and concentrate on the chanter work more.I felt hurt at the time but he was bang on.I waited another 5 years or so before experimenting with them and slowly only slowly started to introduce them into the music.
Today I will use the regs in a limited form to add expression (or if my hand slips!) When I listen to the likes of Robbie Hannan the regs are played only a lttle during a piece and catch your ear and add colour,which is what I like.
As for learning the regs after having the set only a couple of weeks I would advise against.There is plenty to learn before ye even go there.Whilst I believe the 21 years thingy is a bit daft there is certainly a lot to be said for learning to walk before ye can run…resist temptation.take the reeds out of the regs if necessary and get on with your chanter work…(that tip isnae meant just for L24B either,a little less posting and a lot more playing may actually improve the contributions to this board). 
SlánGo Foill
Uilliam
Playing at today’s standard pitch has everything to do with A=440hz. You might consider mentioning what you’re talking about.
I said, “UP chanter” w/o the drones or regs, not “UPs.” Surely you realize that the UP chanter is not anything like a recorder.
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this is getting absurd!
The drones are the last thing to be tuned and incidentally the easiest to do!!
DJM ye are actually doing a disservice to those daft enough to follow your advice and it is not in the least bit helpful to those struggling to learn the instrument to be told a load of crap as though it is from some sort of authority!What is your source?
Slán
Uilliam
I think one of the most startling things for a learning piper, who thinks his set is all fixed up now…full of tape, putty, and rushes everywhere, fingerholes filed out, etc.,…is for someone more knowledgeable about pipes to come along and tear out all the tape, putty, rushes, etc., stick a good chanter reed in the thing, tune it up and adjust the drone reeds and listen to pipes sing. “How’d you do that?” It wouldn’t do that for me. I said, it wouldn’t do that for me! Let me try that. You mean this is how they’re suppose to work?"
It’s happend to me before. I know. I’ve seen it happen a lot. Don’t take it for granted that your set is set up right. A reed can be in tune but a complete throwaway. And on the other hand, you might want to throw it away, but fact is…it’s perfectly okay.
Uh, I was under the impression that you tune an instrument to the center of an instrument’s range and the UP plays from D to d’, so back D is the center of the range.
If you tune the A of the chanter to 440 hz, your Ds will be slightly flat (hey, I might just be in tune with the concertina then), around 2 cents, enough to bother some musicians, others say “close enough for Celtic music”
The main point is I can tune to the band with my method faster than the band can tune to me (6-8 knobs to twist and it takes them forever) and I have to think up jokes and remember if I have used it on that audience.
You tune your way, I’ll tune my way and wait for you until you are finished when we get to play together. If I manage to break or kill the reed, I will use my backup reed (I think I have a real good one on the way for my Hillmann chanter). 
Hint: never tune while sitting under a rotatating ceiling fan as it gives a “leslie effect” and you will spend 15 minutes wondering why your drones sound so funny and won’t tune…
Lorenzo, I have no putty or rushes in my chanter, not even in the bell. From time to time my A goes a bit sharp when the weather dries up. Then I put a bit of tape over the top of the A tone hole (whew, that was close!).
Uilliam, making sure the regs are tuned with the drones comes from my teacher, Debbie Quigley, and she’s right, it works. I don’t claim to be an authority on anything, unlike you, who put down anything you don’t have or anything you don’t do, as if you were the only yardstick the rest of us should measure ourselves by. Sorry, I don’t buy it.
djm
The drones (properly balanced and tuned) provide an unmoving foundation for the sound of the pipes.
I try to make “winter” reeds as they seem to perform better (I have to take the poster putty out of everything except the bell and bottom 1/3 of the ghost D hole and occasionally a tiny bit in back D when I have to run heat) all year round with either a rush or a few other holes using poster putty.
In all cases of the players I have observed at the schools and tionols, the last tuning I have seen done is playing and tuning the regs against the drones, even with Paddy Keennan.
I can tune the drones to the chanter in my living room, but when I go somewhere else, I gotta do drones first because the change in the atmosphere will affect my chanter reed much more than any other reed in the set.
I’ve never read so much bollocks as one half of this thread. Try reading the Rowsome tutor, Wilbert Garvin or the Seamus Ennis tutor and you’ll find universally that the DRONES are tuned to the CHANTER.
Take a flat set and tune it to the drones and you’ll have one unholy mess. You get the chanter at it’s optimum tuning and tune the rest of the set to it.
As far as the original question goes, I would agree with Uilliam, leave the regulators alone until you’ve got a decent repertoire and a few years playing behind you.
Ken
First, I don’t play my regs yet because the reeds that came with them weren’t balanced with the drones and chanter, and on the G chord, one reg would play sharper, the other flatter with the increase of pressure needed for the upper octave.
I now understand why most reg players only play them in the A part of a tune. Unbalanced reg reeds! However, I have heard Ronnan Browne play on one of the Drones and the Chanters albums, so I know it is possible to balance them (darn his hide, I am green with envy. He caused me to buy more trouble for my pipes)
However:
I tune my C flat set drones (the one with regs, I am not satisfied with the regs so I will wait until I can make a tenor reg reed that suits me, then put it in, then I plan to work on the baratone reed after I can play some with the tenor) to C and not D. That is both simple and in tune. If I had a flatter set, I would tune it the same way.
Of course, this is my “play for pleasure” set, so I don’t bother with pitchforks/tuners unless I find players willing to play in C, F and their related modes. I just tune it to it’s self in bottom and back D are in tune with each other, but I tune the drones to back D and hard D.
You gotta remember these instruments are different individuals, unlike mass produced ones, so each one has it’s own quirks and “that one note” that gives trouble.
Sorry if this is off track a bit, but I think there is some relevance. Have you ever noticed how Liam O’Flynn’s C# chanter’s low B sounds really flat when played by itself (w/out drons & regs) accompanied by orchestral instruments, yet when played solo with drones and regs it all sounds so wonderfully harmonious.
My feeling is (and I am fallible) had he tuned his chanter without regard for the drones he’d have tried to sharpen his B note and then perhaps tried to tune his regs to his chanter’s new tuning. Turn on the drones and play the set and I reckon it’d sound pretty bad.
Cheers,
DavidG
It’s hard to get the b to play in equal temperament tuning as in just intonation, it is flat according to an ET tuner.
I believe he just had to put up with “that one note” rather than taking hours to tune the B and flatten everything else.
Besides, his reed adjustment proceedure is to take the reed cap off, stare intently at the reed from different directions, then replace the reed cap.
Perhaps he lost his reed hypnosis (pipes tune naturally to just intonation) with the orchestra (which uses equal temperament and usually go with A=442 (or the closest that the oboe player can get to that).
My point exactly - the chanter when compared to equal tempered instruments sounds out of tune. When compared with the rest of the pipes - tuned properly to harmonise with drones and regs (which came first, the chicken or the egg?) sounds harmonious. There’s nothing wrong with his chanter. Played in it’s correct context it is in tune.
My theory being that had he tried to tune his chanter without regard for regs and drones it may have come out sounding a right mess.
HOWEVER - on a note slightly closer to the topic, I recall Leo Rowsome’s tutor telling that to tune your chanter, tune the drones to A. The check your chanter’s low D against the drones and then the Back D against the drones and depending on whether the D is sharp or flat against the drones will determine how far in or out to reseat the chanter reed.
Cheers,
DavidG
Shouldn’t that be "tune the drones to D so it will to harmonize to the chanter’s A?
The check your chanter’s low D against the drones and then the Back D against the drones and depending on whether the D is sharp or flat against the drones will determine how far in or out to reseat the chanter reed.
I still find it faster to tune drones, check bottom and back D for tune (remember bottom D will go sharp with about 10-15 minutes of playing, I usually have a “cold lump” of poster putty and a smaller, “warm lump” that I add to the bell when it does), adjust chanter reed opening/height if needed, then check C natural, A, G and F# (and their octaves) against the drones, and adjust those if necessary.
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Sheesh!
Sorry AlanB, I understood that this thread was a friendly discussion, exchanging different ideas about tuning, I was unaware that I was posting “crap about who can do what better than who”.
I didn’t mean to upset you, but since you feel forced to read and take offence with my posts, I hereby unsubscribe from this thread.
Orriginally Posted By Uilleam
(that tip isnae meant just for L24B either,a little less posting and a lot more playing may actually improve the contributions to this board).
I think your right on that one . Perhapse your right I emailed Mikie Smyth and he said to wait a little while. Concentrate on the Chanter and drones, to perfect that first before touching the reg’s. Although he did say to practice the movements of the lower hand moving up and down the regulators. But not play them.
Basically I’ve decided to leave the regulators alone for at least an other six months to a year. However please continue adding your points and discussions to this thread. As it will help others who wish to start on the regulators. I will book mark this thread for future reference. Again thanks for your help.
Cheers L42B 