Transition from Whistle to Flute

I have been eyeing Ebay for an inexpensive, but quality irish 'keyless" flute and I believe I found one. I do have two questions for you flute players before I decide to make a purchase:

  1. How difficult is the transition from whistle to keyless flute?
  2. here are the two that I am looking at…is there any preference. Would this be a good one for the transition?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=10183&item=7322553191&rd=1
or
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=624&item=7322041750&rd=1

Thanking you all in advance for your comments.

Let’s address the second question first. The two inexpensive flutes that come up again and again as good beginners’ flutes are the folk flute by Casey Burns and the PVC flute by Doug Tipple (with the Tipple wedge). I haven’t played either of those; the one that I always recommend personally is the Rudall model by Phil Bleazey, although that’s gone up in price quite a bit since the Pound is so strong.

As to hoe difficult the transition is, I guess that depends on how dedicated you are, what your talents are, and how you define “difficult.” I wouldn’t say it’s easy; the fingerings come along pretty quickly, but the whole air management thing takes awhile. I’d say I picked up the flute more quickly than I did the whistle, but I was also more motivated.

Hi,
Before puchising one of these flutes consider looking at this thread: http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=28695
And then we can find a perfect lamp shade to go with the flute taht you like… :laughing:
Seriously, DON’T BUY ONE OF THESE CHEAP FLUTES! They are out of tune and will bring you nothing but nashing of teeth! There is lots of threads about these horrible Pakistani flutes! They do make nice lamps though…

Casey Burns has nice beginner flutes, there is also Dixon delrin flutes, M&E, Tipple PVC flutes and also nice vintage flutes from France and England. There is another flute builder that I know personally, that makes flutes too… :roll:
Jon

Flute is much harder than whistle, even if you’ve played
whistle (though that’s a big help). Well worth the
trouble. Expect several months of struggle to produce
a consistent tone.

Also Sweetheart flutes can be added to the list of
‘beginners’ flutes.

Nope, you didn’t find one. Those are flute-like objects, not playable flutes. The best part about the purchase would be the case, and even that’s in some doubt.

Please, please, please do NOT buy one of those no-name flutes!

Flute isn’t like whistle. Although it may look like all you have to do is drill holes at the right place, that is absolutely not true. You can take a metal cylinder and drill holes to produce a whistle (well, kind of–apologies to you whistle-makers). You cannot just drill holes in a piece of wood. There is far, far more to go into it than that. Making a flute requires finesse, or it’s not playable. Period.

  1. How difficult is the transition from whistle to keyless flute?

If you whistle, then you know where the notes are and you know the tunes. That’s a big hurdle you’ve already crossed.

Playing a flute is different. More is required of you, since there won’t be a fipple. You basically have to learn to be the fipple . . . and then some. It can be a little bit frustrating at first, because you’ll spend a little time trying to figure out how to do this–and even trying to figure out how to hold it!–but it’s do-able.

Doing it is very worthwhile, as flute is a reward in and of itself. Learning it won’t be an overnight thing. It’s going to take years, and that’s ok. It will give you a long-range project to work on, and all along the way you’ll be rewarded with little improvements.

You’ll enjoy it, so don’t hesitate to try.

Just don’t try it with one of those eBay crap flutes.

Either get a Casey Burns Folk Flute or a Tipple. My recommendation is to go with the Tipple. I don’t personally have one, but I’m going on what Talasiga and others have said about them. For the price, even if it’s awful you’ll still be way ahead of the game, but it will be great, not awful.

They’re indestructible, so you won’t risk damaging it when you start fooling with it, and you won’t have to do all the usual wooden-flute care stuff right away. You can just play. And you WILL be able to get good sound out of it, from what I understand.

Then, after you’re getting addicted to flute, you can start thinking about getting a wooden one. By that time, you’ll have been reading the Flute Forum enough that you will have seen a lot about flutes and you’ll have some ideas about what you might want.

Right now, you may be thinking that flutes are so expensive that you need to balance getting the best flute for a reasonable cost–something that will last you years, if not a lifetime. That’s probably not the way to go. It’s more cost effective to go with a Tipple, then to see where your inclinations lie.

I’ll tell you something else about those eBay flutes . . . you’ll never, ever be able to sell them again. At least not ethically. You can sell the Tipple, but I sincerely doubt if you’ll ever want to. And you certainly won’t need to to fund another flute.

I’ve been thinking about this move as well. From the list below, Tipple and Phi Flutes seem to have people on board with personal endorsements as starter flutes and are both under $100 USD.
http://www.firescribble.net/flute/makers.html

Can someone tell me the difference between the six-hole and eight-hole keyless? Seems like the six-hole would make a more natural transition for a inveterate whistle player. True?

  • Bill

Can someone tell me the difference between the six-hole and eight-hole keyless? Seems like the six-hole would make a more natural transition for a inveterate whistle player. True?

Actually it won;t make a whit of difference when you’re starting. FLute players don’t use the bottom two holes (FOr playing C and C#) with fingers. IF you get a keyed flute, you MIGHT want the bottom keys. But they are really unnecessary for most of the Irish trad repertoire.

THe bottom two holes exist as a holdover from when these flutes were played in orchestras, and players needed the low range. They DO affect tone, but it’s a personal preference issue, NOT, a “good vs. bad” issue.

That probably made little sense, but in a nutshell, it’s not a huge issue when you are starting.

Two holes…

The two extra holes are not used.

The eight hole, being a bit longer, makes it easier to swat the cat from your chair.

Neither has a pointy end for use as a javelin.

Nope. Not true. :smiley: The extra two holes are on the foot–they’re for venting only. You don’t play them. You can’t even reach them.

I don’t think anybody here has tried a Phi-flute. Anyone?

I should mention, if you have little hands, or arthritis, you might want to consider a Casey Burns Folk Flute in a small-handed version. It, at least, will eliminate the aggravation of trying to cover the holes while at the same time learning to get a sound out of it. Check his website, www.caseyburnsflutes.com , to see the hand spread cutoff size. It’s 7.5 or 8 inches, thumb to pinkie, I think. If you’re under it, you should seriously consider a small-handed model, as you’ll likely have trouble covering a bigger flute.

I realy think pvc is the way to go when making the transition from whistle to flute. I realy like the one that Alan makes. I found mine to be able to penatrate half inch as well as five eights wall board with no damage to the flute. Im not sure he still makes them but they play great, they sound great and they dont cost much.
I thought the transition from whistle to flute was one of the most ill advised dicisions I have ever made. I mean how much can you spend on a whistle anyway.
It was the most challenging thing I have presented myself with sence I decided to get into martial arts.
It drove me nearly mad for months.
I could not comunicate with humans during this period.
My life was a chambles
And then, out of the blue, came some semblence of a consistent tone.
It was as if all of this strugle was for not and that embousure just comes of its own accord. Very discusting.
Belive me you are better off sticking to the whistle.
If you go down this raod your life will never be the same.,

YOU HAVE BEEN WARREND!!!

Take care;

Tom

I’ve been messing with it for several months. I don’t know if I can say it’s hard, but I can say that it takes time. I still can’t play the flute like I can whistle, but I can play most things that I want to.
I can make the whistle do what I want to pretty much any time if I concentrate. I have to be “on” to make the flute do what I want to.
Being one that likes to drink and practice, it can be frustrating. I’ve just now gotten enough under my fingers that I can play half soused.

I think you’re on to something, Vommitbunny. Playing flute at the last session I attended, I completely and suddenly lost my second octave after having only a couple of drinks. Couldn’t focus my embouchure enough. I played whistle for the rest of the night.
:blush:
Cheers, Mike.
BTW, Jon C., is the endcap on your new avatar from one of your latest?

BTW, Jon C., is the endcap on your new avatar from one of your latest?

Hi Mike,
Yes, do you like it? I can do upgrades… :roll:
I got inspired to make a replica, adjustable cork crown. It was fun threading the blackwood…
Jon

I tend to hit my sweet spot after about one beer. Enough to lose residual stage fright and “de-tense” the fingers but not my embouchoure. After that it declines steadily.

Yes, do you like it? I can do upgrades… :roll:
I got inspired to make a replica, adjustable cork crown. It was fun threading the blackwood…

Jon[/quote]

It’s really nice. Functional cork adjuster, too? Cool. Dunno about upgrading mine, though. I have fear of cork-moving, and the chatterwork on mine is sooo nice. I must admit that I stare at it probably a little too much. I don’t play as well as the flute looks (or sounds).
Mike

Do transition to the flute. The tin whistle is a lovely instrument - but the FLUTE - now, the flute is something else. It’s a thing of beauty when played well. It is work, but all things worthwhile take a bit of effort. Don’t go the PVC route. It’s just not musical. I absolutely abhor the sound of PVC flutes and whistles. If you don’t want to go wooden, go silver, but no PVC please. The Casey Burns flutes are the best way to go - unless you want to try for a Patrick Olwell bamboo flute in D. Those go for about $60 where as the Burns start around $250, I think. The bamboo flutes aren’t always the easiest to START on for tone - it will get your “wind” going though. The Burns might be the best bet in the long run as you won’t have to “graduate” from it as quickly as you might from others. Good luck! - Kate Dowling

Pat Olwell, I’m told, won’t be making D flutes for a while. Other keys perhaps, but not D. He’s out of bamboo for them.