OMG! ![]()
I think even Glinjack would approve… ![]()
Gee, that’s pretty.
I wonder if it has internal tuning issues–
I think lots of RRs of the day did.
Jon, I think even Andrew would approve! ![]()
Wouldn’t you, A?
M
Nice.
Is it just me or does it look a little Banana-esque? Could be the photos.
IT’S MINE, I TELLS YA! ALL MINE!! MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE!!!
![]()
Hi Ben!
So, when you get the flute, bring it on over for inspection ![]()
M
I saw this too and the first thought that came to me was “reproduction”. Haven’t I read somewhere that R&Rs with fake certificates are becoming a real problem? The part about appearing it having never been played professionally and few nicks or normal signs of age started me wondering.
It does look extremely nice. I wonder how much it will go for?
firewood.
Will you say why you say this, please?
Brit humour ![]()
I’m no expert, but having looked at the sites below, I’d be very skeptical of rare, historic flute with no apparent provenance on e-bay.
http://www.mcgee-flutes.com/RR_fake.htm
http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=38275&highlight=fake
I wanna go warm myself by Gary’s hearth!
Maybe he’ll let me bring some kindling home! ![]()
Andrew wrights:
Whistling Dixie wants to know if I approve.
I APPROVE , not that I know anything about flutes.
( but I have a great mentor )
You might tell her that I was able to test a new recipe on a charming
American visitor Mr Wilkes brought over with his group.
He loved it.
( Testing on Americans is midway between animal testing and human
testing.
I am able to say that * No Americans were hurt in making this dessert
- unlike
the Irish group Chris insists I poisoned with a meat pie some years
ago ).
.
Microwave a sliced banana for 1 Minute with cream and rum and a
spoonful of orange marmalade.
Yummy
( I have a suspicion that whisky ,would do at least as well )
I must go into the garden to see if any of the bananas are ripe.Moderatedandrew
Well, then, if it’s a fake it’s probably a very old fake.
Why wouldn’t an old fake be played?
Maybe because it doesn’t play very well?
The seller seems to be getting good ratings.
How does one tell what’s what?
We so far have no solid reason
to think it’s a repro.
Not that I’ll bid on it, but it’s interesting, yes?
This should be when our R&R expert comes in and varifies the authenticity! Where is Dave? ![]()
I tried to get a message through to the seller about tuning,
maybe I succeeded; anyhow here’s an answer.
It is increasingly hard to believe this is at all crooked.
Also it’s one of us, betcha.
I have had a query regarding the internal tuning of the flute. The issue of tuning is ever-present with old flutes. The tuning of a Rudall from this period is better than earlier Rudalls. With the slide pulled out and the flute playing at A440, the A is not noticeably sharp. The D is not noticeably flat. The tuning on this flute is better than on many modern flutes made by emminent makers. The problem of internal tuning is more often related to the player than to the flute. The tuning on this flute would not be a problem. Regarding some the features I mentoned, David Migoya had this to say: “I have seen the ribbed foot cap to match the crown. There are a few, I think from the same batch. The silver crown without the patent head is a feature that seemed to be a way for RR to rid itself of all the extra pressed crowns it had left over because of the abysmal failure of the patent head. The science of the [patent] head is great, as is the engineering, but the application was poor. That’s why we see so many of them attached to flutes with the extended foot joints, for balance. Ergo, the foot cap on the shorter flute…balance. There were clearly at least two stampings of the crowns: told by the “roping” of the inner circle of the design, just under the name. It was around this series we see them.”
To obliquely address the issue Jim raises about tuning, I append information from Thomas Aebi about his R+R copy of an instrument from a similar period (1841, but no serial number given. If memory serves, 1841 is about serial number 4100. I am not competent to judge, but his comments on tuning seem sensible. Perhaps it is worth pointing out that the keyed instruments weren’t meant to be played with whistle fingering, and that by venting with keys, one can improve the tuning for some notes. But there clearly is a problem, or he wouldn’t offer a version with improved tuning for Irish playing, and I assume this problem exists with the originals.
“Copy of an original from about 1841. Very round, mellow, rich and balanced in tone. The large fingerholes make this flute a powerful and flexible instrument. Tuned in three octaves (with the C foot - from low C up to C4). There is a “progression“ in the internal tuning, which is typical for flutes of this period: the left hand notes are comparatively sharp to those of the right hand. This shift is caused by compromises in the tuning of certain notes between the lower registers and the third octave. However, with a moderate and flexible embouchure one gains a compass of full three octaves without having to
use too complicated fingerings, which would hinder the flow of one’s playing. Especially, E3 is to be mentioned in this context; a note that depends largely on the aperture of the third fingerhole. However, I take the liberty of making some minor modifications in the tuning. I recommended this flute for a varied repertoire and large range of tone. For powerful irish style playing I do recommend the modified version with “straigher“ internal tuning, as described below.”
Rudall&Rose with medium size fingerholes
(R&R medium)
This is the “smaller“ version of the flute with large holes. The size of the fingerholes is some 0.5 mmsmaller, which makes the flute more precise in the sense that the notes are more clearly seperated fromeach other; and for more ease of playing. I havedeveloped this model particularly for beginners orflautists who prefer smaller fingerholes, or this particular tone, with the option of enlarging the holes laterto extend the flute’s capability in terms of volume and modulation. The medium model is softer in toneand more balanced over the compass of three octaves. In comparison with the large model, this flute iseasier to control in tuning, but not quite as flexible in modulation and dynamics.
"Rudall&Rose with large fingerholes (modified tuning)
(R&R large modified)
In this model I omit all unnecessary compromising between the third octave andthe lower registers, which is most apparent in the tuning of E3. However,all high notes can be hit cleanly, though sometimes by the use of more complexfingering (meaning a larger number of keys used). Consequently, the left handnotes are more in tune favouring powerful playing as in irish traditional music or other styles of folk."
“Rudall&Rose headpiece and embouchure
All three models play with the same head. The emboulchure is large, longitudinal and oval with a deep undercut. With a flexible style of blowing one achieves very rich dynamics and modulation of tone. The slide has to be moved out quite far to play in 440 Hz ( 15 – 25 mm). The extra cavitiy created in the barrel is important for the overall resonance of the flute.”
Hugh
I have bought a flute from this seller and it was so accurately and fairly described without puffery that it didn’t bring what it should have and I got quite a deal. Although I have never met the man and only corresponded with him. I am sure he is a player and would take as gospel anything he says about the playing qualities of his flute. The man is a gentleman and unlike a lot of ebayers doesn’t add alot of metaphysical bs to hype his auction and is accurate to the point of understatement (which you should have been able to figure out from the copy he did write and the response to Jim Stone’s enquiry). However, feel free to cynically believe the worst about people. Back to lurking (although I’m pretty much fed up with this list).
From the info on those sites, though, the date, the serial number and the four-petal stamp all seem to point to authenticity. It sure is a beauty!!