Peter - Are you native to Ireland?
My first thought is that you won’t make any progress in the direction I think you want to go until you lighten up a bit. I’ll explain why I think this as I go. Your questions strike me not so much as wooly as simply inappropriately overanxious.
Oh my!
I have to admit, I am a person who thinks a lot about a lot of things, and being new to posting here, if not to lurking over the years, I am unfamiliar to people with a longer history. But I really…well, maybe I should say a little more about myself, cause I’ve obviously given the impression that I’m losing sleep over this whole matter, when I think it’s something interesting that Musicians in any tradition should think about and discuss.
And being in a fairly isolated part of the country where the nearest session is over 100 miles away, I don’t get much of a chance to discuss these things!
First off, I’m hardly new to the scene. In fact, I’m the host, producer, and developer of a Celtic Music radio show in Western Colorado, which I’ve done for ten years. I also was the bandleader of an Irish-fusion group that played professionally in the colorado festival circuit until we broke up two years ago. And I’ve seen a lot of hostility and a lot of…interesting opinions expressed about what Celtic Music is and who should or shouldn’t be playing it and what it should or shouldn’t sound like.
personally, I’m in the “It’s a folk tradition and for a tradition to be living it grows, changes, and adapts” school of thought, and I’ve met many people, both from the USA and from across the pond who share this opinion. I’ve also met a lot of the “Capercaille is the devil” school.
I agree that “authenticity” is something you know when you hear it, and it has nothing to do with nationality. I also think that “authenticity” may be irrelevant, but that doesn’t mean I can’t be interested in the question, does it?
I’ve also seen a great many traditional systems of thought co-opted by people who thought those systems of thought were so cool and simply adopted them to the best of their ability, without actually studying them or even thinking about them, and, even though those folks aren’t necessarily…of bad intent, I think that kind of unthinking arrogance is disrespectful to the peoples whose cultures they actually are. And I’ve talked to many Irish and Scottish folks who take a somewhat cynical view of the popularity of the Celtic resurgence for that reason.
Yeah, of course, there are always people out there who are never going to be satisfied with whatever you do, however good your intent is. I still think the question is worth discussing. I’m not looking for a particular answer, or for anyone to tell me how to be. I’m looking for thoughtful discussion of a point I find interesting. I’m looking for what different people think. And as both topics I’ve posted have garnered an incredible amount of response, I think I’ve been successful!
Actually, one reason my band broke up was that my fiddle player thought I didn’t take these issues seriously enough! I’m usually the one playing the theme to “The Munsters” as a jig. (And we did “Freebird” as a polka, too.)
P.S. I just read back over this, and I hope I’m not coming across too strong. It’s just that, to me, when you want to define authenticity before you learn to play it, you’re telling me you’d love to learn to write, couldn’t we do that before we learn to read?
Ah, and for me talking about playing “authentically” without having some idea what that looks like is like…asking to be airlifted to the top of a mountain instead of climbing it on my own feet. The view might be the same but the process is entirely different.
Well, I apologise if I’ve given a wrong impression–but the replies have certainly been interesting!
Caitlin
My first thought is that you won’t make any progress in the direction I think you want to go until you lighten up a bit. I’ll explain why I think this as I go. Your questions strike me not so much as wooly as simply inappropriately overanxious.
Oh my!
I have to admit, I am a person who thinks a lot about a lot of things, and being new to posting here, if not to lurking over the years, I am unfamiliar to people with a longer history. But I really…well, maybe I should say a little more about myself, cause I’ve obviously given the impression that I’m losing sleep over this whole matter, when I think it’s something interesting that Musicians in any tradition should think about and discuss.
And being in a fairly isolated part of the country where the nearest session is over 100 miles away, I don’t get much of a chance to discuss these things!
First off, I’m hardly new to the scene. In fact, I’m the host, producer, and developer of a Celtic Music radio show in Western Colorado, which I’ve done for ten years. I also was the bandleader of an Irish-fusion group that played professionally in the colorado festival circuit until we broke up two years ago. And I’ve seen a lot of hostility and a lot of…interesting opinions expressed about what Celtic Music is and who should or shouldn’t be playing it and what it should or shouldn’t sound like.
personally, I’m in the “It’s a folk tradition and for a tradition to be living it grows, changes, and adapts” school of thought, and I’ve met many people, both from the USA and from across the pond who share this opinion. I’ve also met a lot of the “Capercaille is the devil” school.
I agree that “authenticity” is something you know when you hear it, and it has nothing to do with nationality. I also think that “authenticity” may be irrelevant, but that doesn’t mean I can’t be interested in the question, does it?
I’ve also seen a great many traditional systems of thought co-opted by people who thought those systems of thought were so cool and simply adopted them to the best of their ability, without actually studying them or even thinking about them, and, even though those folks aren’t necessarily…of bad intent, I think that kind of unthinking arrogance is disrespectful to the peoples whose cultures they actually are. And I’ve talked to many Irish and Scottish folks who take a somewhat cynical view of the popularity of the Celtic resurgence for that reason.
Yeah, of course, there are always people out there who are never going to be satisfied with whatever you do, however good your intent is. I still think the question is worth discussing. I’m not looking for a particular answer, or for anyone to tell me how to be. I’m looking for thoughtful discussion of a point I find interesting. I’m looking for what different people think. And as both topics I’ve posted have garnered an incredible amount of response, I think I’ve been successful!
Actually, one reason my band broke up was that my fiddle player thought I didn’t take these issues seriously enough! I’m usually the one playing the theme to “The Munsters” as a jig. (And we did “Freebird” as a polka, too.)
P.S. I just read back over this, and I hope I’m not coming across too strong. It’s just that, to me, when you want to define authenticity before you learn to play it, you’re telling me you’d love to learn to write, couldn’t we do that before we learn to read?
Ah, and for me talking about playing “authentically” without having some idea what that looks like is like…asking to be airlifted to the top of a mountain instead of climbing it on my own feet. The view might be the same but the process is entirely different.
Well, I apologise if I’ve given a wrong impression–but the replies have certainly been interesting! Maybe what I should have said is “How do you present a culture respectfully.”
Caitlin
If you like the music, play it. If you’re going to
perform, best to play it well. Finito.
It’s hard to see an issue here. Best