I’m new to this whole ornament thing. Whenever I listen to music, I can never figure out what they are doing when they’re flippin’ there fingers all over the place.
So, I was wondering, would someone mind telling me what they are using in this music clip? To me it sounds like rolls and triplets, but I could be dead wrong.
Whistle](http://userweb.suscom.net/~artguy/tell-me-ma-whistle.mp3%22%3EWhistle) clip
Thanks for your time.
bob
I can’t answer your question, but I love your avatar.
Cant help you there, but what is the the name of that tune is sounds very familiar.
thanx
Andrew Cassidy
“I’ll tell me Ma” is how I know it.
So is Blackhawk a Go player too?
Hi, I listened to the clip, hopefully someone else more experienced than I can also chime in, but the first ornament right up from sounds like a triplet, and the other common ornament I would describe as a ‘trill’, like a playing the note and then lifting the finger up on the same note and cutting. My whistle teacher would have called it a really sloppy cut, lol. It’s not a trad ornament for sure, but sounds nice in that clip. I like the digeridoo in the tune.
A poor one, but yes. It’s quite a game. I just don’t have anyone with whom to play.
I listened to it slowed down, I believe these are doubled cuts (doubled graces).
Sometimes like this:
A2 A{BA} G2
And sometimes like this:
G2 G{AGAG} A2
This is also much like a short trill; lawhistle is correct. I have heard this effect (and many others!) often in Matt Molloy’s playing.
–James
I was thinking short trill, too.
This leads into something I’ve been thinking about. I think this is Paddy Moloney(sp?) playing, and the ornaments don’t sound anything like pipe ornaments, and I don’t generally find his whistling anything like his piping. Do most pipers play the whistle very differently from the pipes? I know Liam O’Flynn plays the whistle very much like the pipes – almost no tonguing, most notes and all accents decorated somehow. How’bout fluters, too? Do they tend to bring a lot of flute-playing style to their whistling?
Paddy plays a lot of solidly traditional piping ornaments: “shivers” or “shakes” (these are equivalent to “short trills”), double cuts, crans, rolls, staccato triplets, etc. I haven’t heard him play anything that other, older pipers didn’t use at one time or another, like Ennis, Touhy, etc. Get an earful of Patsy Touhy, Seamus Ennis, Willie Clancy, Leo Rowsome etc., it’s all there.
As for playing the whistle differently, yes, I do anyway, I figure I have a tongue so I might as well use it to help articulate the tunes. But that’s just a personal preference of mine. I use lots of ornaments too but I don’t rely on either method exclusively.
Thank you all for your help.
I thought it was very interesting you guys could pick up on who was actually playing the whistle and what style each person plays with. Quite facinating.
It is indeed “I’ll Tell Me Ma” performed by Van Morrison & The Chieftains on Irish Heartbeat. And it is Paddy playing the whistle, to my knowledge.
Thank you for deciphering the ornaments. That just always bugged me but knew someone would have a clue on here.
Thanks. I do love playing Go. I’m just learning. I made by own goban and bought some Ing stones. Play with my wife on 9x9 so we both learn. Been wanting to go on the KGS servers to play with those guys.
Is geek4music a Go player as well?
artguy, I may have asked before, and if I did, I apologize for my forgetfulness! Being from southwestern NJ, I can’t help but wonder where in the hell Jersey Shore, PA is??? 
~Larry
I don’t recall you asking before, but I don’t really mind repeating myself anyway. It’s not quite, but close to the very middle of Pennsylvania (250 miles or so from the actual Jersey shoreline). We’re about 15 miles outside of Williamsport, PA where the Little League World Series just ended this past weekend. There’s several stories of why it’s called Jersey Shore. I think it mostly revolves around the settlers who origanted from New Jersey starting this colony in the 1760s.
The ornaments in question are just simple nonharmonic tones. Such as, where you have two consecutive D notes, played with a D chord, you put a quick E between the two D notes. E is not part of the D chord, but is the neighbor to the two D notes. The actual name in Irish-speak, I’m not sure, but in theory classes it’d be called a neighbor tone. JP
Wouldn’t that be considered a cut then if it is a quick E to separate 2 D notes?
You know, you’re right. I just can never remember the exact names in Irish-speak. Let me ask you this: Is a cut always a cut, no matter if it falls on the beat or inbetween, or whether it falls on the strong beat or on the weak beat? JP
It would be, but the notes don’t have to be neighbour tones for a cut. You can cut with a note somewhat higher than that.
Hi,
Those twiddly ornaments in the clip are common in marches and
sometimes polkas. You play them also in slow hornpipes. That’s why
they are easily recognisable. The triplets - they aren’t the same
as ‘classical notation triplets’ but I’ve always heard them called triplets.
As an aside, a friend just lent me the whole Chieftans’ collection which
somehow I’ve never heard b4! I’ve listened to the first couple albums so
far, they are great.
Cheers, Lesl