I would like to tell you my first not so good experience with the pipes.
7 weeks ago I ordered my first practice set via Ebay (the seller is named Tradschool) from Michael Vignoles. I don’t want to blame the pipemaker but telling my experiance.
Well, after two weeks I finally received it and played on it and I have made good proggress in playing since then. But as I wanted to play along with a friend, we found out that the pipe was not in tune at all (I wrote about it here). I wrote to Michael Vignoles and he gave me advises about cutting the reed what I did. There was no better, still most of the notes not in tune and a falling back D. I decided to show my chanter to Tom Aebi, a flute maker of Switzerland who worked with Andreas Rogge and also makes Chanters. He then told me that the chanter is way to short and the reed to stiff and not given the final scrap. Well, the explained that the shortness of the chanter is the reason for the unstable back D. He made my chanter long as he removed the metal piece at the end (look at the picture above, its the same chanter) and made a longer metal piece with a part of blackwood in it (hopefully you understand). Well, then he mentioned that bottom D to A quite is in tune but the bore of the C hole should be placed higher (the B hole also but not that much since its only 30% flat) now that the chanter is made longer. He also told me that such a small chanter as it was before he made it longer is not allowed usually… Oukay, he scrapped the reed now and also included a wooden piece on the chanter that makes the room between the top of the chanter (the metal piece where the air flows in the chanter) and the wooden part with the holes and the reed bigger. He mentioned that there should be more room than it was (you see it also on the picture).
Oukay, after all that modifications the chanter plays much nicer, I have a good back D but the “wrong” C hole and flat B makes it hard to play unisono with a whistle or something and even accompagnied by a guitar you hear the disharmonic notes…
Well, I paid 1300 dollars for the practice set and luckily just 80 for the additional work of Tom Aebi. I’m quite disappointed now because on the website of Vignoles where you can buy a chanter alone, the chanter looks much different than my one and I’m sure the one on his website would be top quality (http://www.irelandwoodcrafts.com/images/Chanter_big.jpg).
This is my experiance with buying a set of pipes from Ebay from a seller that sells the pipes for a pipemaker.
I don’t know if I should buy a new chanter now or what to do. I can practice good with the one I have but for playing with others it would be better to have one that is actually in tune…
thanks for reading! and I hope not to have posted against the forums rules.
I think that U should call M.Vignoles indeed.He’s the main person with this.
Are U sure that your chanter+reed is Vignoles made?
(After seen how Michael makes his reeds+ his huge experiment about tuning etc ,I don’t think that He’ll let something "halfmadereed "with chanter.)
Uilleann pipe chanter and reed design vary so much from maker to maker (and even within the same maker) that the specs which one maker uses might seem “wrong” to another maker.
I always think that it’s best, when possible, to buy a chanter made a local maker. Then you can personally get a reed fitted. Why not get a chanter made by Aebi? To me that seems better than having Aebi re-work an existing chanter to his specs.
Are you sure that Vignoles is the maker? If so, he is the one you should go to to have a reed fitted.
I’ve been playing the uilleann pipes a long time and I’ve seen many sets (dozens? hundreds?) which come directly from the maker in unplayable condition, with a chanter reed which does not work right. Rare is the maker who sends out chanters which work perfectly out of the box. The most consistent I’ve seen is David Daye. I have had dozens of beginners show up with new Daye chanters and every one played perfectly. People tell me that Andreas Rogge chanters also work right as they come.
Best prepare yourself well before buying, a lot of caveat emptor are to be found on this forum.
Always deal directly with a reputable maker. Don’t buy from dealers, certainly not on e-bay. No reputable maker I know of sells through middlemen, a thing to bear in mind.
Not a great experience, but I think the advice here is right on. Contact Michael and see if he can make things right. I know a few makers and none of them wants a bad example of their work out there. When you get to a tionól (and you are going to one soon, right?), you’ll find a popular pastime is “pass the chanter”. Well that and “making excuses”. A bad chanter/reed isn’t good for business or a reputation. That being said, I think there are a lot of makers out there who make great pipes but are less than stellar reed makers. Another option is to get measurements from Micahel for his reeds and work with a local reed maker to get the pipes in tune.
In the meantime, get to playing even if the chanter is out of tune. With winter here that chanter is most likely going to be a bit wonky no matter what.
Are you certain it is a Vignoles - Ebay is a minefield for the unwary and there are plenty of warnings on this forum. Look at the Set on Ebay posts where the (probably) decent sets are bought to attention but not the Pakistani rip offs. There is at least one maybe two person claiming sets are made in Ireland and Scotland but they are reworked Pakistani ones. There is one person in Ireland buying chanters then adding them to pakistani bag and bellows and this maybe what you have
The B and the F# will be flat compared with a piano or guitar due to the way it is tuned to the harmonic scale
If the rest is OK then a chanter by another maker may be the best solution if the one you have will not play in tune or to pitch
Tom Aebi makes one of the nicest sounding concert chanters around. Tom was one of Rogge’s best craftsman for years (quite some time ago). btw- He does not make pipes in the “Rogge style,” his designs have long ago diverged from Rogge’s (which is not comment on Andreas’ great gear). Tom’s flutes are unbelievably sublime. He is a master instrument maker who is on par with anyone working today. I don’t know if Tom is selling chanters (drones and regs for that matter), but if so…buy one!
The half set is by Vignoles, but the practice chanter looks nothing like it. I can’t see Vignoles name in that ad either. Looks like the OP bought a Pakistani POS.
The chanter and bellows in Ugi’s photo don’t look at all like the chanter and bellows in the photos from Michael Vignoles’ website. I’ve not a chanter like the one in Ugi’s photo but the bellows in his photo looks like bellows I’ve seen on a set which came from Pakistan.
In fact, have a look at the following photo of a practice set sold by a New York seller:
To my eye, the bellows looks very similar to the bellows in Ugi’s photo, as does the chanter top.
The picture that the OP posted looks like the Pakistani set you posted in error, Peter, not the MV set. It looks like he paid for the Vignoles set and received the 230 E Pakistani junk. A real rip-off.
The picture initially posted doesn’t look like the ones Peter did get from Michael Vignoles and ebay items (no block mounts for instance, a different material look for the chanter, etc.).
That is true that Tradschool sell sets on behalf od Michael Vignoles. I am quite surprised though that such a reputable maker would let an unplayable chanter out on the market!
I agree. Also, check out the difference in the bag cover: the suspect Pakistani (Ugi’s) set has it sewn only on the back opening (plus around chanter and wind stocks). The Vignoles set has it sewn the entire lenght of the bottom of the bag (plus the other places). Also, the suspect Pakistani set has rather thin fringe with tassels incorporated into it while the Vignoles set has thicker, shorter fringe with no tassels.
a huge thank to all of your kind words and your research. I’m really getting pissed since the picture of the pakistani Set that PJ posted looks quite like my set…
I have taken three pictures of the set I’ve got for a better comparision:
The Bag:
The end of the chanter (you can clearly see a Vignoles sign). The metal piece beside is from Tom Aebi!
And this is the chanter (thee wooden part in the middle is also added by Tom Aebi)
I also suspect that the chanter might me a pakistani one since the one on the picture PJ posted looks really more like my one than a real vignoles chanter does. I’m now even more disappointed…
I’m writing an e-mail to Michael Vignoles with pictures and I’ll ask him if its his pipes or not. I don’t think it would be his mistake that the middleman sells cheap pipes under his name but I will keep you all informed about his answer.
Looks nothing like the same and I’m blind.
