So I’ve played whistle now for about 4 years. But I’ve not really played for 4 years–I’ve played probably for about 2, with large spaces of time (months long) when I didn’t play at all for various reasons. The major reason, I’m sure, is that I don’t have a teacher to keep me on track and I can’t do it myself.
I’ve even taught the basics of whistle to other people, but I’ve never moved beyond the basics myself.
So now I’m thinking…I have the oppurtunity to get recorder lessons (as part of a group) for really cheap. I’m thinking about doing it, but first I’d have to get a recorder…heh.
I’ve fiddled around with those plastic $2 Wal Mart recorders for a while, but I’ve never been serious about it.
Anyway, what I’m wondering is for those people who play both or who have left whistle for recorder–how do they really compare? I mean, I know I’d not be playing Irish music but I don’t really play Irish music on the whistle anyway.
I guess basically I’m opening the floor for discussion on recorders.
Cran, I’ve got one of those plastic Yamaha recorders that aren’t supposed to be too bad. If I can find it, I’ll send it to you. Give me a bit to look for it, though.
I went the other way - started on The Fipple Flute That Cannot Be Named then took up the whistle when I discovered Irish music. Both are fipple flutes and many skills like breath control transfer directly from one to the other. The music and style of playing are different, of course, but the basic skills are the same.
The fingering of a C recorder very similar to a D whistle with the addition of the thumb hole and C hole(s). Some of the notes are fingered differently and it is confusing at first if you try to play both. When I started on the whistle I would play it for a week then go back and play the recorder for a week. I’ve used this example before but now it’s like when I drove my Mom’s Plymouth station wagon and my Dad’s VW: confusing at first then the hands and feet just automatically thought “big automatic” or “small stick-shift.” (I won’t tell what years those were but the VW was NOT a “new Beetle.”)
I’d say the benefits of learning with a group would be well worth the effort to learn a second, but very similar, instrument. I still play recorder with a pick-up group on Sunday nights. We play a little Irish music around St. Patrick’s day but mostly popular music. Sometimes I use a whistle for the high parts. There are no sessions nearby so I’ll enjoy both instruments for the foreseeable future.
As for a recorder, no question. Get a Yamaha 314 plastic. The soprano (same pitch as the D whsitle) is model YRS-314 B II and retails for about US$38; the alto (a fifth lower in F) is model YRA 314 B II and retails for about US$59. Ask your teacher which one you should get. The tenor (YRT-304 B at UD$110) is also good but the finger reach is a bit far for small hands and is more challenging for a beginner. I got mine through Antique Sound Workshop but you can run a search and find other sources online. Your local music store no doubt carries Yamaha band instruments and can probably order one for you.
I’m sure others will offer additional opinions, especially about which recorder to get. Listen to them all and make your own choice. But join the group; learning is learning.
I’ve played recorder for a number of years (I’d guess around 4 or 5, seriously) and whistle for about 1 now, and thoroughly enjoy both. Although I do play recorder by ear (quite a lot) I still see it as a bit more “structured” than the whistle playing and do most of my playing off of sheet music. One of my brothers also plays, so we do a lot of duet-playing on vacations together. I use a computer app (“Harmony Assistant”) to play duets and ensemble pieces too, which can be fun… Collecting recorders can be a bit like WhOA, if you’re sights aren’t too high (or your bank account is fat enough) (mine are all plastic, but sound quite nice to my ears, at least). My main workhorse is a “tweaked” Zen-On soprano (voiced and with a cedar block lining, by Lee Collins) – I recently bought a Mollenhauer Dream Flute which was billed as having a more “renaissance” sound, but the differences are barely detectable to me (maybe due to the tweaks on my Zen-On). Since the Dream Flute was cheaper ($26) it’s probably a better deal (although I think a baroque recorder looks nicer…).
We have quite a few recorders in our house mostly played by my wife. Recorders can be very expensive so the one we have that cost over $1,000 would only be regarded as midrange!! It really is frightening how much they can cost. I’m no expert but here are a few thoughts.
It is possible to get lower priced instruments that sound great. Plastics are an option but for me even the best of the plastic recorders still sound plastic even though there are some that play very very well.
My favourite low-cost recorder is the Mollenhauer Dreamflute. The wooden alto sounds terrific and is easy to play. It does not sound like a Baroque recorder and is more flute like with a strong bottom. It has some characteristics of a Renaissance recorder, though it plays just over 2 octaves.
There are soprano versions and we have an all plastic one, an all wooden one and a hybrid which has a wooden body and a plastic head. The all wooden one sounds terrific to me. It is louder than a Baroque recorder and has a rich tone. It looks nice as well. My hybrid is almost indistinguishable in tone to the all wooden one, though it might be slightly quieter. It has a very nicely shaped beak. It is a joy to play and with a plastic head it is very low maintenance and with a wooden body has a rich non-plastic tone. Give one a try if you can.
One challenge in learning recorder is the matter of properly dealing with the thumb hole.
On recorder, the left thumb covers a hole on the back of the instrument for the first octave, and “half-holes” for the second octave; the hole is an octave vent, as well as the sounding hole for c# and d (on a C recorder).
Even though just about every fingering chart I’ve ever seen describes what you do to the thumb hole as “half-holing,” it’s more accurate to say you uncover just the barest slit of an opening–and, to further complicate matters, how much you uncover changes from note to note.
That said, a very common mistake among recorder players, including some who are not beginners, is to create that slit of an opening by "pinching in’ with the thumb so that the thumbnail actually touches the recorder.
This isn’t a real problem on plastic instruments because the plastic is much harder than your thumbnail and won’t erode over time the way real wood will. But, over time, this can cause real damage to a wooden recorder–in fact, you may see instruments which have an ivory bushing around the thumb hole, which is a common repair for this type of damage.
The proper way to vent the thumb hole is to rock the thumb back as you pull slightly down; once you become practiced at it, it’s a very dependable way to handle the thumb hole.
I think it’s important to form good habits, even if you are just playing an inexpensive plastic instrument, because one day you may either want to move to a better instrument, or you may have a chance to try someone’s wooden recorder–and if you do, you definitely dont’ want to damage it!
Just put yer recorder hat on and learn it. When you want to whistle, put on yer whistle hat. You’ll be fine. And yeah, a cheapie will get you going great. I think cheap plastic recorders are better starters than most cheap whistles, but that’s just me.
Recorder is a bit harder because you have more accidental notes to deal with (with the double holes). You are expected to be able to play in more keys than a whistle on a single recorder. The most prevalent repertoire for recorder is some very cool Early Music and because of those extra holes, you can play a lot of folk songs that have the occassional accidental note without much problem.
I forced myself to learn a little tune on a sopranino for a gig and it wasn’t a big deal at all. You’ll do fine. Easier than clarinet, I bet.
You just have to get used to the tooty sound. After whistling for a long time, recorders sound funny. Nyuk.
Lemme put in another vote for the Yamaha plastic recorder – I got my wife and daughter one of the sopraninos and it’s wonderful.
I was never able to get the recorder. I thought I couldn’t master the cross-fingerings and such. Then I got bitten by the Baroque flute bug. It has some, albeit not all, of the recorder’s cross-fingerings, and I picked it up really quickly. (Okay, I don’t play in Dflat or anything, but anything from about four sharps to three flats is okay.) So I think my inability to pick up the recorder was a lack of desire.
Go for it, Cran. Once you’re a little bit into it, look up some Telemann. He da man.
I too play whistles and thanks to the good advise from the people on this forum have just finished my first month of attempting to learn recorder as well. I bought a plastic Yamaha and a cheap learning book and just had at it… If I wanted to play in only the key of C or one or two other keys like G or F, I would say that the recorder is easy to learn after privious whistle experience. I have been trying though, to learn the fingerings for C,G,D,F A and Bflat all at the same time and am finding it a little hard to remember them all… But I really do like being able to play in many keys without having to half-hole… I am really enjoying reading music also, but I always did that with the the whistles anyway…hopeless but happy dot reader I guess. If I had an oppertunity to play in a group enviornment, I would jump at it myself… Good luck, DreamOgreen
I still have my plastic Yamaha recorder from elementary school music class almost 20 years ago. Not very interested in it myself…figured I’d let my kids mess with it while saving my guitars and whistles for myself.
These have the simulated woodgrain finish, rosewood or ebony. In the recorder world, folklore has it that these not only look better, but sound better, too, than the plain brown plastic, and they really do look and feel like wood. Even serious players around here use them as practice instruments, and both Adrian and I like our rosewood models. Courtly Music has a nice deal on a soprano + alto combination, and Richie and Elaine are nice people to deal with.
I sometimes play my Mollenhauer Dream Flute at serious ITM sessions, and have yet to be thrown out for cross fippling.
Hey, Cranberry…
With that many posts, no wonder you only had time to play your whistles 2 out of 4 years!
Years ago, camping in the Black Hills of South Dakota, I was walking one morning through the forest. Comes the glorious sound of two recorders, playing sweet Boroque duets through the trees. One of the nicest things I’ve heard in this life.
Afterwards, being inspired, I took up the thing. Hmmmm. It didn’t resonate as well, for me, while playing it up close and personal. Much later, took up the Low Whistle. AHHHHHH. Much better.
Still love the sound of recorders…mainly through the forest…at that nice distance.
Have at it, and ENJOY!
MTGuru posted the link ot DreamOGreen’s similar question thread from not all that long ago. All my various musings and ramblings are there.
I play both whistles and recorders (having come from recorders) primarily in the little music group my wife and two younger kids and I are in for our parish. I use both during any given Mass and sometimes even during the same song I switch from one to another. I went from D whistle to alto recorder between verses for one yesterday in fact so I could go from the tune to a written instrument line (probably intended for a concert flute) that had too wide a range to be comfortable on the whistle (either for me or the congregation ). As I said in that other thread - it CAN be done.
I did the Responsorial Psalm yesterday on the E body of my Syn set (psalm was in A). That was mostly by ear, though. I normally intone the psalm for the cantor, then play with the response either the response tune or the vocal descant line. But that’s all a digression from the point of this thread…
