Is Gaelic hard to learn???

Whistle
21

On 2002-02-13 17:44, StevieJ wrote:

Manx and Cornish are dead - although I’m sure there are people trying to revive them. Manx belongs in the Q-branch, and Cornish in the P-branch.

Actually, it might be better to refer to Manx and Cornish (or Gaelg and Kernuak) as revived languages. There are actually several hundred people alive today who are speaking/learning these tongues again (including me'self!)

If anyone is interested in finding out more about this, visit the Cornish Language Advisory Service, or look up a man named Phil Kelly, and they'll point you in the direction(s) you need to get started.

The “P” and “Q” distinction refers to the initial letter or sound used in common interrogative pronouns (who, why, etc.). In Welsh, these words start with a “P” (pwy, pam, etc.). I don’t know what they are in Irish.

The “P” and “Q” refer to more than just the interrogative pronouns, but to many words between the two language groups. For instance, in the “P” group, the word for “head” (in Welsh) is “pen”(sp?) whereas in the “Q” group, (in Scots Gaelic) it is “ceann;” this type mutation is carried across to many other words as well; this is just one example.

I would point out that Welsh has many more native speakers than any of the other surviving languages, indeed more than probably all of the rest put together, boyo.

I do believe this has a lot to do with the fact that Welsh language education is mandatory up to a certain age (I do believe) whereas Scotland, for instance, is still fighting for official recognition of the Gaidhlig (Gaelic) language. Check out Sabhal Mor Ostaig for more information on that!

As for spelling, Gaelic spelling is much more regular, intuitive and rational than, for instance, the spellings used in say, the English language. Once you master the basic rules, you should be able to go. Of course, I find one of the hardest things for people to do is to take the time to actually sit down and solidly learn the rules to any language. Most people, especially when they are tutoring themselves, try to learn a language at a pace that is far, far to quick, and then get discouraged when they aren't making the progress they would like to making. It's important to remember how long it took you to learn how to speak your native tongue!

~Firefly

who is currently learning 3 Celtic languages, as well as 4 others!

22

I don’t know about Irish, but I have been learning Scottish Gaelic for my job for the last five months or so. Almost the first thing that our teacher told us was that we would be speaking Gaelic with a broad Lewis accent, because that is the way she speaks! We’ve also had a teacher from Lismor and one from Uist and I work alongside a native speaker from Barra. They have all made the point to watch out for accents, which are all noticeably different, and for the different ways they use different words or phrases.

The second bit of advice the teacher gave was the same as I have seen on this board many times about learning to whistle - listen and keep listening. Listen to gaelic on the radio and watch the tv programmes. And, a little more on-topic but not much, listen to the music and songs sung in the language. I have not proved this myself yet but apparently it will help with pronunciation and phrasing.

I am finding the learning hard, but then I am well past my school days!

23

hey.mardarin isn’t that difficult ,is it?somewhat similar to cantonese
it really surprises me when i see some foreigners speaking cantonese!!!(very fluently!)
gaelic…well,my fav band is westlife,and i know that they(they are irish) only know SOME gaelic. irish people themselves even don’t know gaelic…so..i think it would be very difficult.i know some frenchand i think french is okay .it’sjust that i can’t pronounce the ‘r’..u know u have to useur tongue and././/./..it’s not like the english’r’

p.s. i only know ‘la gra’ becoz they always write this in their albums.



[ This Message was edited by: christina on 2002-02-16 00:57 ]

24

this has been quite helpful, since I, too, am interested in learning Gaelic. in fact, I would be learning it now if I hadn’t accidentally picked up the wrong language book at the bookstore (I want to learn the Irish Gaelic, and the book was Scottish!) does anyone know of any good books/computer programs/etc. for learning Irish Gaelic and where I can find them?

25

For beginners, I’d suggest “Irish on Your Own” by Eamonn O’Donaill and Deirbhile Ni Churraighin. ISBN 0-8442-2619-x. $49.95 US.

This is a book and seven hours of audio tape.

It’s available in the US at Barnes and Noble (both on line and in store, and Borders Books).

Also, check out http://www.bbc.co.uk/northernireland/blas/

There is a link to beginners lessons you can listen to on line.

Both of these resourses are in the Ulster Dialect.

Ná bac le mac an bhacaigh is ní bhacfaidh mac an bhacaigh leat!

[ This Message was edited by: tom_psalm40 on 2002-02-16 14:42 ]

26

I can’t believe none of us has yet mentioned listening to the radio!

Sara, you can get streaming audio of Gaelic (and great music you won’t get from ANY station in the USA) at: http://www.rte.ie

27

Firefly,

Do you happen to belong to the “Transnational College of Lex” group? I bought a book called “Who is Fourier” published by them and read about their concept of learning many languages at the same time which seem to be what you are doing. Sound quite interesting and also difficult!

Christina,

Here is the nonsense sentence I made up for practicing the difficult French R and U sounds. J’ai vu trois sou sur la rue! I’m still not fluent in French but I can whip off that sentence like a native! Don’t worry if your accent isn’t perfect. Have you ever heard a Frenchman who could pronounce English!

LadyAshling,

Be aware that there are also at least 3 different dialects of Irish used in Ireland. I took an extension course in the one used in western Ireland. Then I bought a book that turned out to be in the southern dialect spoken in western Cork. Confusing! Then I bought “Irish on Your Own” and it uses the Northern Irish dialect as Tom mentions. Maximum confusion! I had a lot of trouble even understanding their English! It does seem to be a more modern and adult approach to the language, however. My extension course was great for talking about the weather and the health of Nora’s cow! If you plan to spend time in a particular Irish speaking area of Ireland then the right dialect might be important. Otherwise “Irish on Your Own” might be acceptable.

Sara,

Good luck on learning Irish!

Slán go fóill, Tom

28

Conas atá tú? Tá mé ceart go leor. O! I hope I said the right thing!

tyghress,
Pefect idea! I’ll check that out! Thanks.

Tom_Gaul
Thank you!

Slan,
Sara

29

tom_psalm40 and Tom_Gaul - thanks! I will have to look into those resources.
anyone else have any helpful suggestions for learning materials?

30

On 2002-02-16 17:19, Tom_Gaul wrote:
Firefly,

Do you happen to belong to the “Transnational College of Lex” group? I bought a book called “Who is Fourier” published by them and read about their concept of learning many languages at the same time which seem to be what you are doing. Sound quite interesting and also difficult!

Hello, Tom!

No, I don't belong to that group; in fact, the first time I heard of it was when I read your post above! But I will definitely check it out - it certainly sounds like it will be up my alley.

I actually found that, for me, learning several languages at once was easier, especially if the languages were related, as something I learn for one language will reinforce what I have learned for another. For instance, I've been studying Latin for quite some time - and many French words retain there Latin-eque spellings, even if the pronounciations have changed. So I find its easier to navigate French spelling because it's so similar to the Latin I know. The same process can be used for the Celtic tongues, as well.

Thanks again for the book rec!

~Firefly (adding to her reading list)

31

On 2002-02-13 20:56, bgull wrote:
I have “Ireland’s best slow airs” and I have no idea how to pronounce the song titles - so maybe I should just refer to them as “Track 1”, Track 2"…> :slight_smile:

Aha! I am lucky to have a kind Irish friend and school teacher who recorded all the (Gaelic) names for me onto mini-disc, so I would have some clue as to how to say them.

There are several websites devoted to Irish pronunciation

http://www.geocities.com/ireland2000.geo/index.html

probably has links, and dig the great tune in the background. It’s familiar but I have no idea what it’s called.