On 2002-10-02 22:11, Rod Sprague wrote:
If a reed mouthpiece is used on a cylindrical bore with a fingering system that plays an octave’s worth of notes, you end up with a chalumeau. A chalumeau usually only plays an octave because if you over blow it, it goes up a 12th, which is more than an octave, so you loose the ability to hit all the notes in it’s range. Closing one end of a cylindrical bore with a reed changes it acoustically relative to a whistle or flute, which have an opening at both ends of the bore. A clarinet overcomes this problem by having at least a 12th’s worth of holes and keys. What sort of range did the instrument have? If it was a reed instrument and the wall was thicker toward the mouthpiece so it had a conical cross section internally, it is basically a small sax, the conical bore allowing it to over blow by an octave rather than a 12th, giving it another octave or more of notes, like a whistle.
Cool information! How about if you open the top hole, or (sacrilege!!) put another hole in the back for a half-holer like a (shudder!) recorder? Wha-happen den?
Thx (1138)
Bill Whedon
My guess is the mystery whistle is two susato Dublins sawn off at the same point and taped together.I,ve created a similar hybrid except mine are connected via a brass tuning slide inside the body.Mike
I have a Susato Dublin Bb that looks just like this. I bought it about three years ago. It has an ivory body but the head is black. It is identical to and interchangable with the heads on my Susato Kildare models. I checked Susato’s web site. It looks like they have changed the Dublin mouthpiece since I got mine. Steve
Blarney Pilgrim, so you think its an older Susato Dublin perhaps? Where is Mike Kelhorn (sp?) when you need him – surely he would know if it looks like an older Susato.
Hi Folks, Here I am. The photo is not
detailed enough so I can be sure of what
it is. I’m sure it is not a Susato
one-piece “Dublin” but quite possibly a “Kildare” two-piece with an ivory body
and black mouthpiece. The black head section
of the whistle is to long for it to be a Dublin model. It could well be a hybrid or possibly not even a “Susato” at all. I’m curious to know the truth so somebody contact that dude and ask.
Hybrids of whistle and sax (or rather clarinet, given a cylindrical bore) do exist. Here’s a full series of “Chalumeau”. OK, these seem to have a recorder-like fingering, but whistle fundamentalists can tape shut the extra holes
See at http://www.Adler-Heinrich.de/index_eng.html, click “English”, click “Chalumeau”.
On 2002-10-02 17:15, serpent wrote:
Have a look at an enhanced piccy of the mouth area. Could the item pointed at by the yellow arrow be a ligature??
I don’t think so… Clarinet is my first instrument, and looking at that… The whole thing looks much too narrow to be a clarinet or sax mouthpiece. Particularly, because if it were a normal metal ligature, it would be much more visible in the bright lights, and the plastic ligatures (like the Gigliotti) tend to be very large, and make the mouthpiece look even larger.
It’s very strange, whatever it is… That mouthpiece looks very long for a whistle!
Any possibility it’s something like a navajo flute? They have a body similar to a whistle, and a long mouthpiece, where you blow into them end-on, not transverse like a euro-flute. And it would have a very unusual tone.
On 2002-10-06 19:18, MarkCC wrote:
Any possibility it’s something like a navajo flute? They have a body similar to a whistle, and a long mouthpiece, where you blow into them end-on, not transverse like a euro-flute. And it would have a very unusual tone.
Doubtful. The air path actually goes outside the flute for those, under a wooden block tied on top of the instrument. I don’t see one of those in the closeup pic.
If it were a Clarinet or Chalumeau, the microphone is in the wrong place. The reed area near the mouth has no sound hole. By it’s placement, obviously it is a fipple instrument.
That does look like duct tape, maybe it’s a commercial whistle with a PVC tonebody and some duct tape.
[ This Message was edited by: Daniel_Bingamon on 2002-10-06 21:28 ]
On 2002-10-02 22:11, Rod Sprague wrote:
If a reed mouthpiece is used on a cylindrical bore with a fingering system that plays an octave’s worth of notes, you end up with a chalumeau. A chalumeau usually only plays an octave because if you over blow it, it goes up a 12th, which is more than an octave, so you loose the ability to hit all the notes in it’s range. Closing one end of a cylindrical bore with a reed changes it acoustically relative to a whistle or flute, which have an opening at both ends of the bore. A clarinet overcomes this problem by having at least a 12th’s worth of holes and keys. What sort of range did the instrument have? If it was a reed instrument and the wall was thicker toward the mouthpiece so it had a conical cross section internally, it is basically a small sax, the conical bore allowing it to over blow by an octave rather than a 12th, giving it another octave or more of notes, like a whistle.
Cool information! How about if you open the top hole, or (sacrilege!!) put another hole in the back for a half-holer like a (shudder!) recorder? Wha-happen den?
Thx (1138)
Bill Whedon
Sorry, Serpent, I left town Thursday, got back Sunday and only read the post Monday.
I don’t think a register hole on a cylindrical bore reed instrument would help it go up an octave; it would probably just make it jump up by a 12th, but I’m not 100% sure of that. I think if it did make it go up an octave, the clarinet may not have been invented, as an expanded range chalumeau would have taken its place. A register hole does help make a conical bore reed instrument go up an octave, such as in the case of the saxophone and bassoon.
[ This Message was edited by: Rod Sprague on 2002-10-08 01:27 ]
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I don’t think a register hole on a cylindrical bore reed instrument would help it go up an octave; it would probably just make it jump up by a 12th, but I’m not 100% sure of that. I think if it did make it go up an octave, the clarinet may not have been invented, as an expanded range chalumeau would have taken its place. A register hole does help make a conical bore reed instrument go up an octave, such as in the case of the saxophone and bassoon.
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Many Chalumeau’s do have a register hole and a key on the bottom and a key on top both higher up then the register hole. Yes, the Cylindrical bore overblows on the 12th instead of the octave. A typical chalumeau will play two octaves with a few missing notes - the missing notes are carefully half-holed.
