Holy p*ss, Newsweek really did get it right.

Poststructural Pub
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050603/ts_nm/security_guantanamo_koran_dc

It’s lonely in here without the political rants. Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Jailers splashed Koran with urine - Pentagon Fri Jun 3, 7:45 PM ET



WASHINGTON (Reuters) - American jailers at the Guantanamo prison for foreign terrorism suspects splashed a Koran with urine, kicked and stepped on the Islamic holy book and soaked it with water, the U.S. military said on Friday.

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U.S. Southern Command, responsible for the prison at the U.S. naval base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, described for the first time five cases of “mishandling” of a Koran by U.S. personnel confirmed by a newly completed military inquiry, officials said in a statement.

In the incident involving urine, which took place this past March, Southern Command said a guard left his post and urinated near an air vent and “the wind blew his urine through the vent” and into a cell block.

It said a detainee told guards the urine “splashed on him and his Koran.” The statement said the detainee was given a new prison uniform and Koran, and that the guard was reprimanded and given duty in which he had no contact with prisoners.

Southern Command said a civilian contractor interrogator, who was later fired, apologized in July 2003 to a detainee for stepping on his Koran. In August 2003, prisoners’ Korans became wet when night-shift guards had thrown water balloons in a cell block, the statement said. In February 2002, guards kicked a prisoner’s Koran, it added.

In the fifth “confirmed incident” of mishandling a Koran, Southern Command said a prisoner in August 2003 complained that “a two-word obscenity” had been written in English in his Koran. Southern Command said it was “possible” a guard had written the words but “equally possible” the prisoner himself had done it.

Southern Command released its findings on a Friday night.

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It is sad how undisciplined, and disrespectful some members of the military can be. Thank God they aren’t near all that way.

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I’m just gonna sit back and munch popcorn this time around.

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You beat me to it ya bugger – I was just sitting down to up-date the thread I started with a similar title. I wonder where the attack dogs are tonight.

Here fellas… come on… come here… here boy… sound of crickets … hmmm.

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I don’t think piss is a bad word. I say stuff like “this person pissed me off” in chat all the time and Alan never tells me to not say it.

I don’t think it’s holy, though.

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I don’t think it’s holy, though.

It is when it’s on the Koran.

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I meant piss (urine), not the book itself.

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A guard pissed on a prisoner’s Koran; I was punning on “holy piss”.

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Oh. Duh. I feel blonder by the minute. I thought you were using it as an exclamation like “holy sh!t.”

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I guess all these complaints are so one way because it’s so dificult to file a complaint after you’ve had you head chopped off, or your body set on fire, or been drug through the streets behind a pick-up.

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You tell it, Duffy. Let’s never lose sight of that. Or of the “humiliation” of having to beg for one’s life on public broadcast before having those things happen to one…

Cran, I feel blonde a lot too…

M
And I’m done with this thread.

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I guess that I see it, in the same way that I see life, if you compete against others you only are better than the other person. If you set your standards low enough, you can always “beat” someone. If you compete against yourself, you will never win, but you will always be your best.

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That took several readings, but I think I both understand and agree with it. … I think… maybe…

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Is that really what we aspire to?

The USA - morally equivallent to the Taliban?

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I know. That’s the thing. I have had the same thought though, when reading these headlines–“why is it that we seem to be holding this act–disrespecting a muslim detainee’s holy book–in higher disdain than we might if an Iraqui soldier peed on a GI’s Bible or Torah?”
And the answer, as Simon suggests, is that we are not responsible for the actions of another nation’s military personnel. It is undeniably true that “the other side” has treated its opponents shamefully and horrifically. The examples are countless.
But we know that such behavior is idiocy, gives our detractors more reason for scorn if we do it, and makes our government’s attempts to claim the high road look like utter claptrap.
Besides…regardless of how we feel about the politics of the situation, we all know that that’s bad behavior, and the participants should be disciplined by their “parents.”

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So tell me, was a Koran intentionally flushed down a toilet?

And instead of a harangue, I believe there is a short answer.

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I have some spare popcorn if yer interested.

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Hey, do you have any carmel corn? If so, pass it over! :slight_smile:

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They aren’t “one way” as you imply. Atrocities against humanity have been a cornerstone of US foreign policy for decades. Remember now, death squads that carried out heinous despicable acts like you describe in Latin America were trained on US soil at Fort Benning. The US government has published manuals on terror techniques and trained secret police in Iran and other parts of the Middle East, and the US was Saddam’s best friend when he gassed the Kurds and brutalized the people. This is the example the US has established and the reputation among the victims isn’t very likely to inspire lawful responses. The US has regularly vetoed UN resolutions condemning such behavior from Saddam and the Israeli government so people in the Middle East feel helpless to follow legal procedures. Don’t get me wrong; I do not condone any of these sorts of behavior, but if people are driven to desperation the worst is bound to happen.

In the case of the men being killed and dragged behind a truck, they were corporate mercenaries that were hired for big bucks by US corporations, unlike the US soldiers who can barely make rent it seems. We have driven the Iraqi people into a state of desperation not unlike the way the Israeli government has done with the Palestinians. The people of Iraq know who supported Saddam when he was being the most brutal against them, and who betrayed International law by vetoing the UN resolutions against Saddam. So they really don’t have a very good reason to trust US government motives now either. When the US government abandoned International law and invaded Iraq it invited the reaction it’s getting. When I heard about the prisoner abuses I wasn’t at all shocked, just deeply saddened at the spectacle; yet another aspect of the cycle of violence.

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Now that the hearts are bleeding and the slobber is flying, I’ll go back to the things that originally brought me to C&F - Good tunes and worthwhile information.