(First, a disclaimer: this post is not directed at any particular board member. I know a couple of us are pregnant, so I started not to post this but I figured I would with this disclaimer instead. It’s just something I’ve been mulling over lately…)
Anyway, I’ve been thinking. With the world’s population at over 6 billion people, and so many billions living in extreme poverty and dying from simple things such as starvation, infections, and largely preventable diseases such as HIV/AIDS and pneumonia, why do people who want children continue to have their own instead of adopting?
In my mind, creating more children on purpose seems like it only adds to the problem. If everybody in the world would have the foresight and compassion to adopt all their children, from poor families and countries, so many problems could be solved at once (homelessness, hunger, poverty, overpopulation, children growing up unloved and unwanted, the spread of disease, and more). But instead, people continue making more biological children. It puzzles me a little bit…
Because it cuts to the core of being a human being, to reproduce your own kind. And life is more than the intellectual sphere, where your arguments make sense.
If you have ever spent time with a somewhat large family, its kind of bracing to see how the children are varied iterations of their parents. They are a clan of sorts and its fascinating.
Before I had kids, I had all kinds of intellectual ideas about it, including the sensible desire to not over-populate the Earth with more than two, which is ultimately what happened.
But honestly, it was economics that limited me to two. If I was rich, I would have had more kids, because I love em so much. I just knew that I really couldn’t provide for them as well beyond two, but even that is fear-based thinking, with some reality to bolster it.
It seems like the fear of not being able to properly care for more children financially is a good fear. I mean, I’m sorry if you wished for more children but I am glad you think of the children first!
When I have children (in ten or so years), I want to adopt them all. I want about twelve or fourteen (I’m serious), if I can afford it. I love children (not in the creepy Michael Jackson way, though ).
“Reproducing my own kind” is not important to me because I think we’re all the same species, just different colors and different cultures. So many billions of people have already reproduced my own kind that (to me) it seems silly to reproduce even more. It even seems a little bit slfsh to make more (I blocked out part of the word because I didn’t want it to seem as strong as it probably does…) children in the world when so many are dying this very second in time.
I have a baby cousin who is a different race than me, but he is still “my own kind.” If he were green or purple, he would also be “my own kind” because he would still be a person. I really do wish more people could see it that way.
I understand that you didn’t want to come across as strong, but of course it did, despite the use of the *'s. If I am SELFISH then so be it. I am content on doing what I feel to be right.
Yeah, Cynth. I grew up fairly poor so it was on my mind. Believe me, I see the contradictions in my statements. When you open the floodgates and adopt what I think MIGHT be considered the Catholic viewpoint, you just have 'em and worry about it later…but it’s a pretty good way to end up working two jobs…so maybe I am being selfish after all.
No no no…cran, you didn’t hurt me, and I didn’t mean to make it sound like you did. I understand that my choice in having so many children is touchy with many people, and that’s fine with me. We are all entitled to our opinions, right? I shouldn’t have worded my post so strongly, and I apologize for that. Still friends?
What a nice thought. While you’re at it, why don’t you ask Santa for no more wars and an end to poverty and political repression, and have him throw in a pony, too.
We did adopt a kid – a behavior disorded foster child, and the next 10 years were a nightmarish hell of tantrums, petty crime, and ceaseless trips to the counselor. As soon as she turned 18, she made a beeline for the trailor court her birth family squatted in, which turned out to be the best for all concerned.
We later had two of our own, and there has been a world of difference. There is definitely a trailer-court gene, and all the behavior modification in the world cannot overcome it.
So to anyone considering adoption, especially adoption of foster children, I’d have to say “Run away; run away!” I’d sooner have my testicles slammed repeatedly in a drawer than take on another.
I understand your point entirely Cran. If I had been thinking along those lines a few years earlier, I wonder if I would have had 4. It’s a lot, I know, and what ultimately caused me to get that faucet disconnected, so to speak, was not $ (although bucks were tight at times,) and it wasn’t population concerns.
It was
–a sense of having completely saturated that biological drive–which is a strong drive–do not underestimate it.
–Stress at how out of control I was feeling with kids who were 1, 3, 5, and 7
–a sense that I would eventually want and need to explore facets of life beyond motherhood.
–an inkling that maybe the world didn’t need more people from my/my husband’s gene pool.(more ADD eccentrics with strong tendencies to OCD and depression–not that they’re not cool people.)
My daughters talk about maybe adopting, instead of childbearing, and I would fully support that choice–though I gotta tell ya’–there is no life experience to compare with childbirth and lactating…it’s a doozy.
OTOH, nothing would compare with adopting a baby from–I don’t know–India for example, and having them hand you(or introduce you to) your child for the first time. I’d like to have had that experience.
It’s a tough question and, as Weeks pointed out, you’re dealing with complex emotions that often trump intellect.
That’s a painful life epoch.
In general, I think that overseas adoptions, orphans from poor countries, poor families, etc go ok. I know many such children from many parts of the world who now are my childrens’ peers, and they’re great.
Since I believe I’m pretty much the only person here who has a large number of children (at least the double digits), I think that I should at least attempt to answer this. I’ve been trying to put a lot of thought into it before I respond, which in the end means that this post will be rather large. I apologize for that, but I also hope that it’s length can convey my thoughts accurately.
There really isn’t just one pat answer that I can give to explain Cran’s question entirely. I suppose that the biggest answer I can give is my Faith. Most of you here know that I am Catholic. This is a very important aspect of my life, and I take it very seriously. Because of this, I attempt to live my life according to that Faith. I don’t feel a need to go further with this, and I am not going to engage in a debate on whether or not the Catholic Church has the right to dictate anything, or whether or not it’s dictates are even correct. I was asked why, and this was my reason. You don’t have to agree with it.
I do understand the “overpopulation” concern, and I have heard all of the debate surrounding it. I also know that there are many, MANY things in our world which contribute to the sufferings, death, and poverty of the people in our world….in my eyes, considering that in many countries their birth rates are actually LOWER than their death rates, thus they are not sustaining their populations, over population is the least worry that we should be dealing with (this in my opinion). I look at the population of our country here in the US. When I look outside my window, I see 4 SUV’s across the street for a household of 2 fulltime adults, and one college student (meaning the college student is not there all of the time). 4 SUVs which serve what purpose? I realize they have a right to own these vehicles, and yet they are polluting our air, water and ground each time they use them, rendering our environment useless. In their use, they are depleting an already low supply of natural resources and making it so that the next generation potentially will not have use of these resources. I’m not attempting to judge them, or others like them. But for ME this is a complete waste as well as a travesty. Our earth is being compromised because we pride ourselves as a nation of excesses, and no one blinks an eye. Instead I have to endure the lady at the checkout line at my local grocery store informing me that I’m a horrible person for having too many kids, and she is praised for her comments.
I live in the Ohio Valley, and I am told that I cannot eat fish that come from the Ohio River. The steel mills have polluted the water so much that the fish are now toxic. And yet nothing is being done. I cannot even let my children swim in the river because of the toxins in there. How is this right?
There are many countries in our world that are fighting poverty, and yet we here in the nation of plenty do nothing. Our government is more concerned killing off the Iraqi people than helping those that are truly in need (which, by the way, DOES include thousands of people right here in our country). I honestly don’t feel that my 11 children impact the poverty rate any more than someone else’s 2. Why isn’t our country doing more to help those that truly need it, rather than fighting a war that is totally unjust and unnecessary? Sure, we send food and seeds and medicine, but we do not TEACH them the skills that are necessary to do these things themselves. Apparently our just throwing what we don’t want at these people is enough to assuage our consciences so that we don’t need to help them any further. And yet more and more people continue to die and suffer. There is absolutely something wrong with this picture, and yet the only concern that many people have when they encounter me is the number of my children.
I did have a reason for this rather long tirade (I’m sure you’re all glad to know that, right? ). It is my hope that the number of children that I do have somehow make a difference in this world. I have tried to teach my children how to be concerned with more than themselves….there is a whole world out there and we have an obligation to help those that need it most however we can. We cannot adhere to the “dogma” of “every man for himself” which seems to pervade our culture…we need to be mindful of everyone, and to also be mindful of how our actions can and will affect everyone, not just ourselves. I hope to raise my children into adults that are willing to live simply so as not to make it more difficult than it already is in our world. We are not a rich family by any stretch of the imagination, and there are things (materialistic things more accurately) that my children do without. We strive to live a “simple life” and cut out all of the things that are unnecessary. I hope and pray that my children can keep this spirit of simplicity alive in them, and that they pass it on to the next generation.
I don’t know if any of what I said makes sense….perhaps it doesn’t. I realize that many people feel that I’m terribly wrong in having so many children. I just hope that by writing this out, you can have at least a knowledge as to WHY, even if you don’t agree. I am not trying to start a debate here, so please don’t make this political. These were MY thoughts, and I’m not attempting to shove those thoughts down anyone’s throats.
Thanks for taking the time to read this, and thank you, Cran, for even bringing it up.
generally speaking, I think that adoptions (at least the ones that I know about personally), DO go well. The difficulty, from what I understand, is more in the process itself. It’s tremendously expensive, which I find to be outrageous. Also, the couple wanting to adopt is forced to go through a huge amount of psychological testing, which in some cases is understandable, but when my stepmother was told that they thought she had “issues” because her first husband died unexpectedly 10 years before, and therefore it was felt she was unfit to adopt, there is a problem. It shouldn’t be that difficult to adopt. Oh, and I am all for adoption, just for the record I just wish that the “powers that be” would make it a bit easier for good people to actually do it.
I never guessed that you were such a deep thinking Woman
I strongly agree with everything that you have said…very much so.
I was brought up..(dragged up, some would have it) in a very Catholic enviroment and all though many would find it all very confusing, somewhere in the middle of it all, is a very highly developed sense of Love, and in strange ways, Justice.
I am not the most articulate dude on the planet, but in your last two posts I see a truth that makes a lot of sense.
Some thoughts, not necessarily in any specific order:
Babies aren’t always planned. I was one of 5 kids–we just kept popping up all over the place, I reckon.
There are too many stupid people. Stupid people should not be allowed to multiply. There are, on the other hand, far too few intelligent people. It’s good when intelligent people multiply. (Ha, ha, only serious…)
Adopting is a wonderful thing. My brother adopted his son and he’s an important part of our family, no less than any of my other nephews or nieces. He’s a great guy and very much Bill’s son.
Stupid parents breed stupid kids. Please see no. 2, above.
Seriously, I think issues of whether to have kids, and how many, are each person and each family’s to decide. Everyone has to try to make the choices that are right for them and their life.
I am not the most articulate dude on the planet, but in your last two posts I see a truth that makes a lot of sense.
Thank you so much for your kind words, Dub…although I DO have an issue with your self description. You are absolutely one of the most articulate people I “know”, and it’s one of the reasons I think so highly of you!
Izz, and anyone else in your rambunctious camp. I have no problem with your making life choices according to your faith. My reasons for calling a halt pertained to me and my feelings. I know many fine adults and children, bred in families such as yours, and they are almost invariably on the good side of the force. Hats off to you. It ain’t easy what you’re doing–it takes, and develops, enormous strength of character.
And maybe you’ll still want 12 or 14 after the first 3 or so…I guess you’ll make that call when you get there.
I was an “only”, in a farming community where the normal family was 10 or more kids. While it was good for me in some ways (I tend to be really outgoing), it was also lonely at times.
I have 2 kids. Four years apart. Had my first at age 29. If I couldn’t have had children “biologically”, I would have attempted adopting, but would have not been able to afford to adopt more than one, probably.
I had my boys at the time of my life that it just felt “right” to have them. I had a terrible pregnancy, and honestly wasn’t sure about trying it again. My second was even worse, so no more after that.
I totally think it’s a personal decision for each individual, and respect whatever they decide.
You have my complete support. I come from a family of 9 kids, and have 5 myself. My reasons for that are also based primarily in my religious beliefs. But there are other reasons.
I grew up in a very happy family. We didn’t have much money, (Dad was a college professor and Mom never worked outside the home) but we rarely felt the lack. We grew gardens in the summer, and bottled what we grew. We had to learn to share everything and to work together. Today we are still a very close family despite the fact that we are widely scattered.
In a society which is steadily becoming more and more self-centered, having a large family is one way of keeping oneself grounded and raising your odds of providing the world with adults who know what’s important.
Just this morning my 13 year old was talking to me about how sorry she feels for one of her friends we’ve moved away from. Her older sister is grown, and both her parents work. She has spent her entire summer locked in her house - alone. She has good and conscientious parents. And a big house with lots of stuff, and pretty clothes, but Nikki wouldn’t change places with her for anything.
).
I just wish that the “powers that be” would make it a bit easier for good people to actually do it.
(Ha, ha, only serious…)