Does anyone know where this tune (also known as “O Waly Waly,” I believe) originated? The sources I’ve found just say “traditional”…they don’t say traditional “what” 
It’s a favorite of mine, both to sing and to play, and I like to know these things (what…me like to KNOW things?? 
)
Thanks,
Redwolf
This might be ridiculous, but I’ve always felt it to be a simplification of Carrickfergus.
[ This Message was edited by: Chuck_Clark on 2002-11-08 01:10 ]
I believe that it is an old Irish song. I could find out more if you like!
Sandy
On 2002-11-08 01:23, Sandy Jasper wrote:
I believe that it is an old Irish song. I could find out more if you like!Sandy
I’d love to know, if you can find out easily or point me in the right direction. I play it often enough that people occasionally ask. I originally learned the song as an African American traditional (from the islands off Georgia), but I know that tune is waaaay older than that (and almost certainly originally from the British Isles).
Redwolf
From The Fiddler’s Companion:
"O WALY WALY. Scottish, Air (3/4 time). D Major/Mixolydian. Standard. AABB. This very old tune can be found in William McGibbon’s collection of 1762 among others, although the first printed version appeared in 1725. Neil (1991) remarks that the origins of the ballad are obscure, but probably relate to some amorous incident in the life of Mary, Queen of Scots, or one of her courtiers. The song references Lady Barbara Erskine, daughter of the 9th Earl of Mar, who married James, second Marquis of Douglas, in 1670 and tells of her ruin after being falsely accused of adultery.
The melody was transformed in America into the hymn tune “The Water is Wide.” Neil (The Scots Fiddle), 1991; No. 11, pg. 13. June Tabor - “Airs and Graces.”
There is some information on this song at The Contemplator website at:
http://www.contemplator.com/folk2/water.html
This is a GREAT website with information on a lot of different songs and tunes.
Rob S
Many thanks to all! That helps tremendously.
Redwolf
A little bit more.
The song was orginally Waly, Waly, but in the 19th century came to be known as The Water is Wide. The song was published in 1724. O Waly, Waly is sometimes reported to be part of a longer ballad, Lord Jamie Douglas. However, Douglas was first published by Herd (1776) where it states it is to be sung to the tune of Waly, Waly, so it is fairly certain that Waly, Waly is the earlier tune.
Has anyone noticed that stanzas from this song tend to turn up, sometimes slightly altered, in other songs? Especially
I leaned my back up against an oak
Thinking that he was a trusty tree
But first he bent and then he broke
And so has my false love to me.
I’ve heard variations on this in a number of places and it’s always like meeting an old friend by accident in a new place.
This song has a special place in my heart. It was the first song my voice teacher gave me when I began taking lessons, so I’ve been singing it for something like seven years now. On my first date with the woman I married a year and a half later I took her out on a boat, rowed up the Severn River, and sang this song to her. I guess it went over pretty well.
[Edited for spelling. Also: in the third line of this stanza “bent” is sometimes “bended,” right?]
[ This Message was edited by: Michael Sullivan on 2002-11-08 13:19 ]
For a lengthy treatment of Carrickfergus and its relationship with Waly Waly/The Water is Wide, (not to mention Peter O’Toole and Richard Harris!) see the following thread:
http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=16707
It is a great example of how useful forums like this can be. There is some sterling scholarship, keen insight, neat speculation and good sense in the thread–along with other stuff.
Tom D.
OOPS!! The internet address in the prior post is for a page. The ‘thread’ I was refering to is “Origins(95)” on that page.
Tom D.
Quintessential folk ballad, yes?
Do you’all know the one
“He’s young but he’s daily growing?”
The trees they grow high,
The leaves they do grow green.
Many’s the time my true love
I’ve seen.
Many’s the night his cradle
I’ve rocked.
He’s young but he’s daily growing.
Father, o’ Father,
You’ve done me great wrong.
You’ve married me to a
boy who is too young,
For I’m twice twelve and
he is but fourteen.
He’s young but he’s daily growing.
Daughter, o’ daughter
I’ve done you no wrong.
I’ve married you to a
a great lord’s son.
He’ll make a lord
for you to wait upon.
He’s young but he’s
daily growing.
As I looked out from
my father’s castle wall
I saw the boys,
Playing with a ball.
I saw my young love,
The flower of them all,
He’s young but he’s daily growing.
Well, there’s more, but
I’ll stop here. It’s Scottish,
I’m pretty sure. Imagine
writing a song that
people sing hundreds
of years from now!
This is slightly OT, but if anyone is familiar with the song VanDiemen’s Land (the version I know is the one off of U2’s Rattle & Hum, sung by The Edge), it sounds a LOT like the Water is Wide. I remember getting the sheet music and playing the song and thinking, hey, isn’t this that U2 song?
Anyone else ever make this connection? Or know anything about the song Van Diemen’s Land?
Regarding Van Dieman’s Land-- you took the words right out of my mouth.
Tres
I first heard this tune as background music for the video The Ladies From Hell…the story of the bagpipes in war time (2 vol) ..a very stirring production. I hunted far and wide for the music which was listed as “The Day the Pipers Played”. I was having no luck at all until I wound up singing it out of the Methodist Hymnal…titled “The Gift of Love”. It’s page 408 but can’t tell you which hymnal at the moment. There is just a very slight variation from The Water Is Wide. I’ll be going back to my home church on the 24th and will check further. All of this probably just adds to the mystery! Gm
Yes…I’ve heard “The Gift of Love” sung to that tune in a couple of different churches (it works beautifully as a hymn, doesn’t it?). I think there are a couple of hymns in the Evangelical Anglican repertoire that use this tune as well.
Redwolf
I remember hearing the song in question many, many moons ago done by Peter, Paul & Mary…or Pizza, Pooh and Magpie as Dylan prefers to call them. Seems to me they did it as “The River is Wide”. Brings back memories of my old folk song days when I first began playing guitar.
Denny