Tech question for whistle makers

I’ve played and owned a few whistles over the years, including a couple high end whistles, that would have one or two notes in the second octave that sounded slightly “gritty” compared to the surrounding notes that sounded perfectly clear. I had a Burke aluminum session (non blacktip) where all notes in the second octave were very pure except the G, which sounded a bit gritty, like there were grains of sand in the windway…which of course wasn’t the case. No matter how I altered my technique, the high G always sounded slightly gritty and it was just the one note. The windway was perfectly clean and could find no apparent damage to any part of the whistle. I’ve experienced the same thing on some whistles when playing a second octave D using 0XXXXX.

I’ve just always been curious as to what could cause this. I was thinking it may be something about the blade but I’ve made a bunch of whistles and don’t always get the blade perfectly angled or perfectly smooth but still get nice pure, clear notes. I’ve noticed, however, that if I slightly blunt the front edge of the blade instead of leaving a sharp edge, I get more consistent tonal quality. But then my Overton high D’s blade has a sharp front edge and sounds perfectly clear on every note. So I have no idea what could be at work to affect a certain note in this way on some whistles.

Check the tuning slide for air leaks - add some vaseline and try the whistle with different slide positions - if this has a big effect on the “sandy” tone then you might need to back-fill the tenon gap with a little bees-wax (use a round pencil to smooth it flush with the bore). The tenon gap can produce reflective frequencies that compete with specific notes and will behave differently depending on how open the tenon is when the whistle is tuned. Mind you - the tenon gap also affects tuning - so don’t over-fill it.

The other main causer-of-odd-note-phenomena is the window dimensions - adjust with caution - a single stroke with fine sandpaper can make it better or make it worse - enlarging the window will always alter back-pressure, make the whistle sharper and increase the breath needed for the octave break … it is fractal - so adjustments are totally non-linear - one thousandth of an inch can ruin the whistle, 2 thou might make it brilliant, 3 strokes might make it worse and 4 could make it nice again - the math is complex. If you go too far it will ruin the whistle :wink:

Hello Bally.

This is a difficult question to answer with the description “gritty”, but I will give it a shot…

The Embouchure or Voicing is the “Sound Generator” and the quality of the resonating frequencies is dependant on this design feature. A “Ducted Flue Voicing” needs to oscillate with easy breath pressure to reduce turbulence at the leading edge of the labium ramp. Here is a Wikipedia page with an “Ideal” Von Karman Vortex Street animation…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Karman_vortex_street

A slightly rounded leading edge allows the airstream to oscillate with less breath pressure (velocity). Reduced airstream velocity across the window greatly reduces the chance of secondary or “double” oscillations at the leading edge of the Labium. High Velocity Turbulence can build up on a leading edge, just like it does on a Jet Fighter wing. This is the reason supersonic jets have swept back wings.

A small bead of clear acrylic (nail polish) added to the leading edge may solve your “gritty” high note by reducing the windway velocity needed to reach this note. Try to thin the mixture with a little Acetone (polish remover). If you add to much or don’t like the result, use a Q-tip and remover to rub the edge clean.

I hope this answers you question. If not, I can clarify or give another example. There are a few other possible acoustic reasons that can cause similar symptoms.

Thomas Hastay.
thomashastay@yahoo.com

Is it safe to assume that since you are using the past tense in reference to this whistle that you no longer own it and won’t be operating on it based on suggestions given here? I just had to ask. The best course of action would be to talk to Mike Burke. You have a whistle made by a craftsman that stands behind his product. You paid for his continued service when you bought the whistle. He’s brought a couple of my Burke whistles back to life after they seemed to go around the bend. I’d recommend doing the same with any high-end whistle. (although it is fun to speculate on what the issue may be! :slight_smile: )

Feadoggie

Yes, my intentions are purely speculative and am simply curious as to what conditions could contribute to this type of issue since I’ve experienced it with other whistles as well. I just used the Burke as an example.

And yes, the particular Burke aluminum session mentioned was purchased from an guy in a large Ceilidh group I was in several years ago and I got rid of it long ago. He needed money, so was just basically helping out a fellow musician and I didn’t play it much since I prefer Mike’s brass whistles and wasn’t interested in sending it back to Mike for tweaking. Aware of the high G issue, a friend of mine still wanted it so I sold it at a reduced price and she still has it. It didn’t bother her like it bothered me since she doesn’t play much whistle. She thought it was pretty :slight_smile: Had I kept it to play myself, I’d have returned it to Mike without question.

I agree 100% with Feadoggie. Even though I’ve made many whistles and have made some really nice ones, I don’t like the idea of messing with another maker’s whistle and most definitely believe in sending problem whistles back to the maker. As Mitch pointed out, it’s too easy to ruin a whistle and even the slightest error in judgment can be disastrous. I don’t mind messing up one of my own, but it’s quite another thing to compromise someone else’s work.

Thanks to all replies so far.