I have a question for any whistle maker who cares to answer. I’ve been trying to find PVC and Copper tubing in the right diametre internal and external, 14mm and 16mm respectively (high d sizes), but can find nothing in PVC less than 19mm internal and although I can source the correct copper tube, I can’t source any copper plugs or copper sleeves to go over the tube. I want to make whistles in a similar style as David O’Brian’s. Anyone able to tell me where I should try to source my materials from? and where does one acquire ‘delrin’ from? Also being in Australia, telling me to go to some big chain store based solely in the U.S, U.K, Europe etc won’t be much good to me.
Thanks in advance for any help offered,
Mick
G’Day Mick,
Try lawerance and hanson in Redcliffe for 16mm Outside Dia Electrical PVC conduit. This is what Guido uses for his low cost whistle. I have made one according to his plans and plays extremely well. For delrin try Dotmar Plastics in Acacia Ridge, Not sure if this is nearby, any engineering plastics supplier will have delrin or acetal rod. Good luck!
Sid the Sloth
Here in the states I use:
http://www.mcmaster.com/
I want to make whistles in a similar style as David O’Brian’s.
I would suggest you ask David himself.
Here in the states many whistle makers start off with either CPVC or copper pipe standardized to the plumbing trades which is used for cold/hot water delivery in housing construction. I am not sure what your standards may be down under. The copper plumbing pipe here is indeed ~14mm i.d. and ~16mm o.d. . The CPVC equivalent is also 16mm o.d. but the i.d is closer to 12mm - which is better suited to a high D whistle, IMO. Both copper and CPVC connectors are available with an i.d of ~16mm. These can be used for the external tuning slides or mouhpiece collars. In fact if you wanted to use a CPVC connector on the mouthpiece of a copper whistle it will work provided you drill out the raised stop inside the connector. That can be done easily using a 5/8" Forstner bit and the result is much cheaper than boring out your own delrin. Probably not at all like what David is doing but you could try it. There is also similar copper and CPVC plumbing pipe here with a 22.5mm o.d for making lower pitched whistles.
While quite nice whistles can be made from off-the-shelf plumbing parts, electrical conduit and shower/towel rods sometimes you need to fabricate parts yourself to get the proper size or fit. Let us know how you get on with things
Feadoggie
Google tubing suppliers. In Seattle “Alaskan Copper and Brass” - I doubt if they ship internationally but someone there would know where to look in Australia.
Allied Supply in Elkhardt Indiana carries a wide range of tubings used for brass instrument tuning slides. Usually these are stocked in 1/2 meter lengths. In brass and nickel. You might see if there are any band instrument repair suppliers in Australia - usually a local woodwind repair shop knows of a few.
One caution about Brass and Copper. Beryllium Copper, Brass or Bronze is sometimes used for industrial applications because of its machinability and other properties. For whistles or flutes or any home hobbyist type setting (even instrument springs) NEVER use this or any copper alloy containing Beryllium.
The dust is deadly poisonous and can cause complete liver failure if inhaled, usually within a few days. Beryllium even in minute quantities is extremely toxic!!!
Casey
Thank you all for the help, I was down to my last idea (which I will be looking into today). Sid, I will try your suggestions next as they are closer to home, well Acacia Ridge isn’t as it’s the other end of Brisbane city, but a phone call and the mailman might solve that problem.
Casey I didn’t know that about copper and I’m very glad you told me, it’s something I will ensure I ask about prior to buying any more bits of copper (bought a small amount of tube yesterday).
Feadoggie, Guido’s site was what got me started on this little foray of mine and I have made a couple of whistles already but not being able to source the right dia PVC (yet!) I thought the copper parts might be easier to find. Your idea of a copper whistle with a PVC mouthpeice will be put on my ideas to try out list, thank you for the suggestion
Dryer, I want to try and avoid ordering from overseas if possible even though I have to do that for some kinds of knife making tools and steels. I really think the country I live in should be able to provide everything I need (even though it doesn’t, it should!)
Thanks again to you all.
Mick
I appreciate this. I’d like to try my hand at making a CPVC whistle myself. 5/8" O.D. CPVC (made by Charlotte Pipe and called Flowguard Gold) is readily available here with the dimensions noted above. I’m told there is another manufacturer, Bristoltherm, with slightly thinner wall thickness. So far I’ve been unable to find this using the usual Google. Does anyone have any info on this pipe? Is there a forum dealing with whistle making?
I also appreciate this forum. I’ve been lurking for some time trying to learn what I can and have picked up quite a bit. I’m currently annoying the cats and my wife with my first whistle, a Tony Dixon Trad.
Thanks for whatever information may be forthcoming, and for this great Forum.
RVC
Well I paid a visit to Lawrance and Hanson this arvo, thanks Sid, and they had the goods with PVC and joining sleeves to suit which will make for a decent looking mouthpiece, rather than Guido’s idea of splitting a same size piece of tube and making a clip on mouthpiece. Just need to look into the right size drill bit to bore them out, as they have the inner ridge and possibly a slight taper to get rid of.
I also contacted Dotmar via email and have been told they also have the goods and I am now just waiting to see if they are able to tkae 'phone orders and post them out. If they can, I have my delrin supplier organised. Life is looking good.
I knocked out my third home made PVC whistle this arvo and I must say what a difference it makes to have materials in correct sizings. This whistle, though I made it in a helluva rush, sounds like a whistle should with c nat best played so, OXXOOO.
I was unable to find the shop I wanted to source copper tube from (not where the telephone book listed the address as) but I will be ringing them back to see if they have changed address. I feel that PVC might make for a better (read less clogging issues) whistle than the copper but I think the copper might make for a more professional looking whistle. Especially if I get them plated.
Thanks to all who offered help and advice, feel free to keep ideas coming, as it may help out other peoples unanswered questions.
Mick
FlowGuard Gold is a tradmarked brand name for CTS (copper tubing size) plastic pipe made with CPVC compounds from a supplier named Lubrizol, as far as I know. They license the manufacture of the pipe to a number of companies. Charlotte Pipe is one, Genova is another and Harvel (who just happens to be near me) is another company producing pipe under the FlowGuard name. It seems to be the “upgrade” pipe used in the “mortgage bailout” housing market. Most of these companies also produce CPVC pipe in the same sizes without the FlowGuard name and at a lower price. I have used both and while I “imagine” the FlowGuard branded stuff is more uniform in size, I can’t see much difference in it mechanically. The whistles made with each come out very much the same. Lowes Home Centers carry Genova and/or Charlotte pipe.
I don’t know about Bristoltherm. There are tons of polymer pipe products. If you have a large specialty plumbing supply house near you, and they tolerate non-tradesmen, make a vist. Tell them what you are looking for and they should be able to help.
Yes, there is one.
http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/whistlemakers
However, it has rarely had activity in the last couple years but there was a new post on Saturday. You may just be able to bring it back to life. It’s worth browsing through the archives. A number of the contributors to that forum also post here. You may also enjoy reading through the flutemakers forum as well.
http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/flutemakers/
I hope that helps.
Feadoggie
I would have commented, but I buy all my supplies from local companies in the Vancouver, BC, Canada area and Mick said that wouldn’t help. But, in general, plumbing suppliers, hobby shops that specialize in model trains and industrial plastics suppliers are who I go to.
Indeed it does help and thanks for your reply.
I’ve found the Flowguard Gold at Lowe’s and have purchases some. I came across the Bristoltherm name when checking out pictures of the Water Weasel on The Whistle Store site. I figured if I was going to make CPVC whistles I would try to find out what Mr. Schultz used for his. You can read the print on the whistles when you zoom in on them. They have the same ASTM and nomenclature numbers as the Flowguard Gold pipe so apparently it’s the same CPVC. But other pictures of the WW reveal (to me anyway) a slightly thinner wall. My Googling attempts haven’t turned up anything for Bristoltherm so I guess it’s not available anymore.
I’ll check out the sites when I have more time to cruise through them.
Thanks again.
RVC
Thanks David, It isn’t so much that it wouldn’t help as that there should be supplies available in Australia that would suit, and indeed there is, as I have found out. I will be ordering delrin rod on Wednesday to suit the PVC I have bought. I will be making a trip to the hardware on Sunday to buy a suitable drill bit to bore out the PVC joiners and will be doing a dry run to locate the plumbing supplies store that has the copper tube I need, but isn’t where the 'phone book lists their address as.
You may remember me from an email I sent recently, regarding a simple fix to a loose tube on my ‘Rover’. It is now as good as the day I bought it, and still travels everywhere with me. Although I also took one I made from PVC on Sunday to work with me today. My co-workers, though not ‘whistle savvy’, were suitably impressed. I think they may be easily impressed sometimes as they were also impressed with other things I’ve taken for show and tell (sheath knives and Australian stockwhips).
I told my boss as a joke that I should quit to start my own business and call it “Mick’s Whips and Whistles”. Hmmm, might have to look into it all the same, sometime down the track.
If I ever get to a standard that pleases me with copper whistles, I will be sure to send you one for your comments and opinions. Having said that, I’ve yet to attempt my first copper whistle, so we will have to wait and see what happens.
Mick
Hi Mick,
Glad yo hear you are on your way. I have found its almost as addictive making them than it is buying them. Always thinking “I’ll change that a little and that should be it” although it never is.
Regards
Sid
Mick, it sounds like you’ve got things sussed out now; that’s great. Keep us posted on your progress, epecially with “Mick’s Whips and Whistles”.
Ok! Good sluthing. I did a search on this board for Bristoltherm. It did turn up a post about a Water Weasel low G that still had the plumbing code on it. I have a few WW’s but only one with the printing on it. But it’s in the key of A which is made from the grey electrical conduit.
My point on CPVC pipe is that it is all very much the same stuff. There can be some unusable pieces of pipe out there but a visual inspection when you buy it will sort that stuff out.
There are variations in the wall thickness of CPVC pipe. The outside diameter is what is standardized. The pipe is made by extrusion so variations occur in that process but they are slight. I think if you can stick with pipe from one manufacturer you will get consistent results. I have used hundreds of feet of Genova’s CPVC in both the 1/2" and 3/4" sizes.
Just keep making those whistles!
Feadoggie
Yes sir, will do, and thanks for your help. Incidentally, I went to the Yahoo Whistelmakers forum you listed and registered. I’m still awaiting approval of my membership - apparently an exclusive lot, those folk.
Thanks again.
RVC
Oh Gawd, I’ve already hit those stages!!! I’m going to try and find a perfect level with high d whistles and then work on making some low Dee’s as well. Not going to be overly concerned with other keys just yet, but I’m sure they will be done at some stage.
Mick
Here’s the stuff I use: PEX.
It’s Polyethylene, not PVC, so it won’t drill or sand, but it does cut nicely.
It comes in nice 15mm diameter tubing and 20mm diameter tubing, which fits Guido Gonzato’s instructions very well.
One advantage is the stuff I use is barrier pipe, so it has a grey (or blue) layer between layers of white. This makes it easier to see what is happening when you chisel out the whistle lip.