Pipes crafted by the Tailors

Uilleann Pipes
1

People come in all shapes and sizes. Some have long torsos, short upper arms, short forearms, big midsections, etc.

Why don’t pipemakers get some sense of the size of an individual they have never met before sending them sets?

A lady came over to the house yesterday with a new set. She being petite, had a blowpipe long enough to be employed on a set played by our big lovable Joe Smith and a bag neck long enough to be utilized by the tallest piper imaginable. It’s all wrong and the mechanical disadvantages are tremendous. She needs adjustments to be able to get going. Not to mention a soft reed. So, she now has to contact the maker, who now has to take time from his busy schedule to service the order after the sale. Wouldn’t it have been better for all parties if the set would have fit in the first place?

Optimally, a customer would arrange for a fitting. At the very least, I would urge pipemakers to ask a few questions re waist size, height, etc. of their internet or phone never-before-seen customers. Small, med, and large bag neck sizes and blow pipes options would be recomended.

Perhaps for the benefit of makers and players, we could tabulate a few measures, specific to makers, that the enginners amongst you could collate and analyze to come up with standard best guess or recommendation for these pipes parts. For example, if you play a K&Q set, and are satisfied with the ergonomics and playability of your set, you would provide measure for K&Q benefit, same for Gallagher, or Lynch, or Preshaw, Woof, and so on.

It would seem to me that ones waist size and the length of the blowpipe from bellows to bag should be recorded. Engineers amongst you would need to give thought to the bag neck length but I’d think that measures of ones tip of middle finger to bend in the arm, and top of shoulder to the point of elbow, or better, front of armpit to tip of elbow, as well as length of bag plus neck and length of neck would be good info for starters. This data would likely be able to provide makers with a range of measures that customers of various sizes might be satisfied with.

Thoughts?

2

Your thoughts are entirely rational. I play a practice set played before me by a ten year old. The neck of the bag is way too short for me and as a consequence the bag sits partially up on my stomach. I’ll get a new bag (with a longer neck), but I’ll wait till the drones are ready.

3

Has there ever been a good set of instructions written on how to fit a new bag/set to a player? A step by step approch by an experienced maker would be very usefull. I’m facing the same situation of needing to replace an undersize bag and couldn’t find anything in my past issues of the Pipers’ Review or in any of the tutorials I have, including the Brooks workbook.
L & M’s website indicates that they keep on file templates of bag specifications of different makers, but there doesn’ seem to be any way to access these measurements.

4

I think this is an especially relevant question since, in ways unolike any other instrument, this one is “worn” by the player.

DJones

5

When I ordered my set, I made sure the maker knew my waist size. That way I made sure I got a belt that would fit, and I don’t have to do what I do when I borrow guys’ sets: tie a knot in the belt so I can wear it!

J.

6

Absolutely a good idea. This is much like getting fitted for a bike- stem to seat post; in seam to pedal, seat to pedal, etc. You have to do that to get really comfortable on a bike. One of the guys in the club who is bigger than I, has a spare blow pipe that fits most people so that others can try his set.

7

Lovable? Not me, no way. :laughing:


But now that you mention it, I just can’t throw on any old set and jot off to the ball, certain things need modification first… which I’ll not go into now…heh…


But it is a good idea when ordering a set from the maker of your choice, be sure to let them know your girth and arm length. It ought to save some adjustment down the road.

8

Oh, come on, now. Give us a big cuddle! :wink:

djm

9

CUDDLE!!!

10

This is a really good idea. So what would you recommend for me?(Sandwich jokes aside, I already eat like a pig.) I am six feet tall with longish arms and a 29-30" waist. How long should the blowpipe and bag neck be? Someone tried the first practice set I made and almost dies trying to squeeze into an old belt of mine that I used on the bellows.

11

Best just to swap what you have with the girl!

12

You’ll need someone (experienced piper) to check the positioning of your pipes as you are playing them, and they’ll be able to provide you with suggestions as to what length blowpipe and neck ought to be.

Although I am certain you have some idea already.

For me, the neck of the bag shouldn’t be so long as to kink up or twist around when it is in playing position. The blow pipe should be long enough to allow the bellows to fit nicely on your hip (for me, rib cage :smiley: ) and the bag to rest comfortably under the elbow. Ideally, as far as I know (which ain’t an awful lot :smiley: ), the bulk of the bag should be behind your arm and when viewed from the side (bellows side), you should see mostly neck + the area for blowpipe and stock when playing.

13

An EXCELLENT query, indeed.

I was very fortunate to get my practice set from the maker directly. When I mentioned that the neck of the bag seemed a bit long, he offered to alter it free of charge. Fortunately, I soon figured out there was a good reason why the bag neck was a bit longer than on a GHB bag and alterations were unnecessary. However, there are plenty of instances where the size of the player does not fit the maker’s “player archetype.” It really would behoove makers to ask (if they don’t do so already…) about the general size/shape of the person they’re taking an order from, as impolite an imposition as this may be…

And while we’re at it…Might we return to my own personal pet peeve of providing adequate pipe cases for pipes? If you’re going to spend upwards of $6,000 on an instrument, it doesn’t seem unreasonable to include a case that has been custom fitted with the characteristic shape of the instrument in mind…As an ex-orchestral musician, I know that most classical players would not be caught dead sticking their intsrument in a case that wasn’t made with the specific contours of said instrument in mind…Most pipers seem satisfied with their cases, but every time I hear a piper pick up his/her Rowsome/Wooff/K&Q/etc. set and the case goes <clunk,clunk>, it makes my teeth grate…Really, it seems like gutted & specially retrofitted viola cases are the way to go…This really ought to become standard issue…

14

Yes, it is a great idea. If I am not mistaken, I think that David Boisvert does provide a case… at least with the purchase of a full set.

15

On the serious side, the entire burden for getting it right resides with the buyer, not the seller/maker.

As a group, the pipemakers have almost always defaulted to connections/bags being long (and adjustable, if necessary). Reeds are sent out ‘hard’ since they are far more stable on arrival. Playing in and/or scraping can make the reed easier to play, of course.

Few people invest the time and effort to pick their pipes up in person but that would pay dividends. Most pipemakers are willing to spend time with final adjustments at that time (and most are willing to adjust post-shipping, too). Shipping back and forth is cost effective since it replaces a full trip. It used to be ‘difficult’ to get more than reed from a pipemaker (25 years ago) but now people are often given a spare or two.

Tionols are ideal for people to try stuff out - from flat vs concer sets, hard vs soft reeds, etc.

The Mooncoin double shotgun case that Alain Froment sourced many years ago does a great job as that case is a tight fit for the gear (very desirable) and small enough to easily get on planes. Years ago, most bellows were fixed with the bellows connector permanently connected, thus becoming the biggest object limitation to fitting into a case. By elegantly separating that connection (on Alain’s sets, the connector uses a stainless screw connection), Alain (and several other makers) allowed a flatter case to be used. Old pipecases were always custom made - sometimes quite heavy and unwieldy. The Froment Mooncoin case is great and sometime I need to hide/smooth over the inside rivets. It is great case to carry, overall. The weight of my pipes and case is 18 lbs.

16

Re: cases. I flew back from the St. Louis Tionol last night. I ended up getting stuck on a small, 50 seat jet. They made an announcement before boarding that, due to the nature of the aircraft, all carry-ons larger than a laptop would have to be checked. Panic! I had visions of my beautiful Koehler reeds being reduced to slivers! Fortunately, they let me preboard to see if my case would fit overhead. It just fit. And this one of those skinny, older-model Rogge flight cases. What it lacks in padding (yes, SportinP, we both know they want for this) it made up for in transportability.

Re: Measurements. Uncannily (yet not surprising) Glands had read my mind. I was just thinking the other day (something I sometimes do) that there could be some sort of formula that a clever-jack could come up with to get a set to fit the player. You know, a ratio of waist-to-upperarm-to-lower arm-to-thigh length-to bag neck-to-chanter length etc. One of the targets (for a full set) would be so that your hand (on chanter) can easily reach those lower reg keys.

t

17

My pipe make contacted me about three weeks ago to say that my new set was just about ready and that what he needed from me was measurements for bag size. He asked me to provide an outlined drawing on a newspaper to show neck length and blowpipe location. I mailed that off with a few extra details. He emailed me yesterday to say that they were ready.

Oh, and he is providing a case. I had been wondering what I was going to stick it in.

18

Good topic, Lewis. I find the length of the bag neck to be crucial for comfortable playing. I’ve wound up switching bags between my concert pitch and C set for that reason, as the neck on the concert set was too long to comfortably play when inflated / extended without feeling that I had to wrestle the chanter back towards me, thus affecting my grip. It’s just the ticket for the longer C chanter, however, although if I added a gooseneck connector off the chanter top, it would probably require a longer neck still.

Check out the length of this bag neck on Mr. McNamara’s K&Q B set to see what I mean:


Cheers,
Mark

19

I’ve played that very set depicted in the photo. That is one looooong bag neck. The chanter sorta floats out there and bounces up off the knee on its own and feels somewhat disconnected from the set. Was a real treat to play it though. Full extension of the upper extremities required…

20

I’ll bet it was a real treat listening to Brian playing it.

I have always wondered how playing was affected by having the bag tied directly onto the windway.