I was just watching the Antiques Roadshow and it got me wondering what might happen if someone brought in some old pipes. Do you think those appraisers would actually know what they had? I know they use alot of reference works and databases of auctions to come to a price, but those things probably don’t exist for antique pipes except for the SRS journals. But your average appraiser I wouldn’t think would keep something so obscure around. What do antique dealers do when someone wants to sell them something that they either don’t know what it is (uilleann pipes) or don’t usually deal in (highland pipes)?
Finally, are there people out there who actually deal in antique folk instuments like uilleann pipes, even informally? I remember back when I played highland pipes that there was a guy in Canada named Ringo that dealt alot with old pipes. He now has a regular pipe supply business. I guess with uilleann pipes they would come up so infrequently that its not really worth the trouble in most cases. The unplayable sets would take tons of restoration work but then are proportionately less valuable the more restoration is done (compared to a playable unrestored set). And playable old sets probably only come available when someone dies.
Ah well, I’m rambling. My original point is how various pipes or other folk instruments might be handled in the antique world. Any comments?
james
James, I’m not any kind of expert on this stuff, but I have noticed that on many of the types of shows you mention, they are quick to refer things that are too obscure for them to someone recognized as being an expert in that particular field. There may well be people in the antiques field who are acknowledged as experts in pipes, or possibly someone who sells old/used pipes, or someone in a museum perhaps, may be contacted in order to trace an expert. The folks on these shows seem to be pretty resourceful at finding the kinds of expertise they need.
djm
Probably the closest thing to the sort of expert you are describing would be our own chiff board member Jim McGuire. Apparently he has had many old and rare pipes pass through his hands, most recently the Willie Rowsome set he had restored.
It seems likely that some highly regarded pipe makers would also have in-depth knowledge of many antique instruments, their availability, value, etc. through their customers.
Sale information for auction items is just like real estate, mostly based on comps (comparables). Antiques Roadshow checks databases for prices. If the item has a clean ID, the whole thing is a simple task. One guy on AR seems to do the instruments most of the time. He tends to give bonus points for stuff like ‘wow, this banjo is signed by Pete Seeger’.
Our world of Irish pipes has many more challenges including but not limited to ID, condition, completeness(all parts original?),extent of modifications/repairs, what did the instrument used to sound like, and original reeds/staples.
Irish pipes have sold through Sothebys on an irregular basis for the past 20 years. eBAY now is a great repository of closing prices. NPU and other web sites have a good list of asking prices.
So what would a Roadshow segment do? They would likely call a pipemaker and then give a wide range of value. ‘If this were a Taylor set, on a good day you might get…’
One fascinating thing about our stuff is that prices do not go up to the heights that one sees in other areas such as violins, oboes, pianos, harps, etc.
Check out Tony Bingham’s site: www.oldmusicalinstruments.co.uk
Some interesting stuff there, some nice flutes, good photos & honest descriptions, you may get a hum on prices too. Tony sold the giant Coyne set to Stockholm’s music museum, 1984 I think. There are a few serious collectors in Ireland & England of flutes and pipes, internal trading of the good stuff, you’d have to be in the know so to say. Still there are sets of pipes and flutes laying dormant here and there, with predators, sorry, businessmen/dealers waiting to pounce.
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I read an account of a news reporter who was allowed to go through the Antiques Roadshow process here in Chicago. 3,000 people, over two days, were allowed to bring 2 pieces each. There is a big winnowing out of all items up front. If an item is exciting, the expert ‘sells’ it to the producer. More research and then the person is told on the air (tape) what the deal is. 30-35 items make it on the 1 hour show.
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So in reality, he’s not valuing an instrument, he’s valuing the autograph.
I think I’ve seen the guy you’re talking about - he was asked to value some old movie posters or some such items, and he did indeed remain consistent - he valued the ones that had been autographed MUCH higher than the ones that had not.
I do recall seeing a recent show where a fellow brought in a Martin guitar that his father had left to him… the father had originally got it from his own uncle. The guitar had been repaired - by the Martin Company - and in spite of some holes left behind (required by the repairs, apparently) it still brought an estimate of value at about $12,000 - $18,000 as I recall.
No autographs from Arlo Guthrie or anything like that, though…