Piper's Grip - Covering the Holes

Whistle
1

This is one of those questions for which there probably aren’t any pat answers but “practice” but it doesn’t hurt to ask.

I’ve been playing a Low D Goldie for three years now and have improved a great deal, able to play many tunes and ornaments with reasonable skill . . . even if my speed isn’t up to normal on fast reels and jigs. What continues to bug me though is inconsistency in the way I cover the holes with piper’s grip. My hand position is good and comfortable (and vetted by a professional player on Skype!) and most days I can practice tunes without problem. And then I have a day or two, totally discouraging, when I just don’t manage to cover the holes properly and get all sort of bad notes. That really sets me back. To be fair to myself, I suffer with chronic pain - daily headaches and migraines (no sympathy sought . . . I least I don’t have arthritis) and the pain together with the codeine I take undoubtedly doesn’t do wonders for muscle coordination, concentration etc. However I would like to get my grip better, especially now that I’m playing more complex stuff like airs where frequent slides and vibrato tend to take the hand out of position more.

So, questions. Three years isn’t a lot of time when it comes to learning an instrument. Can I realistically expect to have ironed out all grip problems by now? Do any of you playing a Low D experience grip problems from time to time? And do any of you have tips on how to address the problem?

Many thanks.

2

Chronic troubles consistently covering the holes? Bliffy notes? Headaches?
As a whistle player, it sounds like you’re doing everything right. :smiling_imp:

No doubt some kind folks will chime in here with great tips on how to play with piper’s grip. Here are a few more generic things to consider:

We learn by doing, which unfolds over three broad stages.
In the first stage, it’s a struggle to simply do the skill.
In the second stage, it’s hard to do it well.
In the third stage, it’s hard to do it well consistently. You’ll know when you’re finally in this stage because it’s the interminable one. :tantrum:

Also, learning any physical skill is like gymnastics. No matter how well the gymnast does the quadruple twisting layout plutz move in the air, the judges score her way down if she doesn’t stick the landing. And it turns out that sticking the landing is often harder than that mind-boggling move in the air. The same applies to learning to play whistle. For example, once you learn how to do rolls, the real trick is in how to play them without mangling the notes afterward and interrupting the flow of the tune. You can diagnose the problem(s) yourself. It may require extra, focused practice on what your fingers are doing immediately after the roll, releasing any tension in your hands (and lips, and neck, and…), paying close attention to the pitch of the next note or two, the duration, timing, and attack of those notes, your finger placement and movement to get those notes, your use of air after the roll, whether and where to catch a breath, and so on.

One of the keys to “sticking the landing” is to sing the tune in your head, especially through the tricky spots. In other words, you know that critical voice in your head? It’s shouting, “HERE COMES TROUBLE! GLIDE INTO THAT HALF-HOLE WITH T2! OOPS! MISSED IT! NOW WIGGLE B3 FOR THE VIBRATO! FASTER!” So replace it with a calm, easy voice that’s doing nothing more than lilting the tune. Dee-aye-dum-diddle-dum… The idea is to quit thinking about the mechanics and how “difficult” they are and instead simply let yourself play the tune.

If things are still going awry, it may help to watch yourself in a mirror. Ask yourself what the problem specifically is and sift through as many causes as you can imagine: fingers straying from position? Why? Do your forearms or elbows flap around? Does the angle of your fingers change? Are you shifting from covering a hole with a fleshy part to landing on a crease and not-quite-sealing it? Often the quickest way to isolate and solve a problem is to slow waaaay down. So sloooooooooow that you hear and feel every detail, nothing escapes your attention.

Finally, thinking about “playing position” on the whistle…once you have a hold and posture that enables you to play effortlessly, without tension, and it sounds good, then your hands and fingers should always play from this hold and posture. Except when they don’t. That’s less of a contradiction than it sounds. The idea is to use a consistent hold and consistent finger movements, but also realize that these are not completely static. Know what “home base” feels like and play there most of the time, but flit around as necessary, and then land back at home base. That’s a skill in itself, worth some focused practice.

If you stall and need help, find a good whistle player to help diagnose. Or post a video here and let the hive mind sort it out.

3

Thanks very much for taking the time to write at such length. Some great and wise suggestions there that I’ll certainly take to heart. Your comments about the interminable third stage alone are a source of comfort and encouragement. I’m hoping to have a few Skype lessons before too long so will bring up the subject then and see whether the player in question can shed any further light on my difficulties.

4

I cheat. I use my pinky finger on my right hand. Works for me.

5

What do you mean by using your pinky? You use that to stabilise the whistle or to cover the bottom hole? I certainly use it to stabilise the whistle but see no advantage is using it for the bottom hole since stretch isn’t an issue and it complicates fingering. Would you like to elaborate? Do you avoid piper’s grip altogether?

6

I use the pinky to cover the bottom hole. so it’s a modified pipers grip. Same pipers grip just substitute the pinky. I started it when I got a Burke low c. Then applied it to other whistles and discovered it made my play easier and crisper.

Of course the other option is to get an onyx. It doesn’t require pipers grip and has a great tone imho.

7

Understood. But using my pinky wouldn’t solve the problem. I have a good and very comfortable piper’s grip that comes from relatively large hands/long fingers . . . and, in any case, I like to keep my pinky for stabilising the whistle. Consistent covering of the holes is the problem not any problems of stretch. The Onyx I’m sure is a good whistle but it has smaller holes and a tone that isn’t to my liking. After trying many whistles, it’s only the Goldie/Overton sound that I like and tonally I like bigger holes too, so I have to persevere. Thanks for your thoughts anyway. If I ever get a Low C I might then consider using the pinky but I think I’m more likely to stick with the Low D.

8

makes sense mike . . . i prefer the tone of the onyx . . . guess that’s why there’s more than one quality whistlesmiths out there!

i do hope down the road you venture into the low c world. its a marvelous key for low whistles.

9

I struggle with it too, though I’ve been playing various pipes and whistles for many years.

Thing is, being a piper, playing Highland pipes and uilleann pipes for many years, the low hand of Low Whistles comes naturally to me. Never any problems down there! (There was never any need to use the lower-hand little finger.)

But the upper hand of some Low Whistles gives me problems, for two reasons 1) those three upper-hand holes on some Low Whistles are further apart than the upper-hand holes on any bagpipe chanter I’ve ever played and 2) I’ve never used “piper’s grip” on pipe chanters on the upper hand (ironic I know, but there it is).

So, though this year makes 40 years on the pipes for me, using upper-hand “piper’s grip” is quite new to me, and I only do it on Low Whistles, never on bagpipes.

The curious thing is how otherwise similar Low D whistles will have marked differences in upper-hand hole spacing. I find that tiny differences whistle to whistle make a huge difference in my ability to cover the upper-hand holes. Oddly, one of narrowest-spaced Low D’s, and one of the widest-spaced Low D’s, are both Reyburns!

Just yesterday I was doodling on my Reyburn Low C for a bit… the upper hand is a beast on that thing. I find that the least uncomfortable way (there is no comfortable way) is to use the endjoint pad of the ring finger and the innermost of the three pads on the index finger, with the index finger curled around the tube, and therefore that upper hand at a rather sharp angle. I still fail to seal that top hole, always the hardest for me, at times.

It’s one of the things that makes the MK and the Dixon so easy and comfortable to play, the closer spacing of the three upper-hand holes.

10

The curious thing is how otherwise similar Low D whistles will have marked differences in upper-hand hole spacing.

I’ve noticed that too.

It’s one of the things that makes the MK and the Dixon so easy and comfortable to play, the closer spacing of the three upper-hand holes.

And I would add the Goldie to that list.

I obviously need to spend time analysing where I come unstuck. I think it’s with the larger T2 and B2 holes and my fingers are quite slender. Interestingly, when I played Colin’s big hole Low D, with even larger holes, my fingers tended to sink into them, creating a good seal!! Practice! Practice!

11

Yes, practice, but focused, attentive, responsive practice.

Before I bought a low whistle, I played flute. So when I got a low F whistle, I tended to miss the holes on it a bit, mostly on the bottom hand, and primarily the bottom ring finger. At first, all that registered was “muffed that note, hope to nail it next time around.” Which quickly became a viscous cycle (I drool a bit when I play). Frustration.

Solution: I slowed way down and paid attention to what happened when I played those bottom ring finger notes. Turns out I was overreaching, landing long of the hole (basically still using flute spacing). Identifying the problem was the first step in correcting it–I still had to woodshed a while, adjusting my finger placement, listening for the result, noting how it felt when it sounded clean, lather, rinse, repeat, before my brain fully grasped F whistle spacing.

One of the challenges of whistles is that the finger spacing varies so much across whistles, even in the same register, and wildly when you start moving from one key to the next. Sure, it’s the “same fingering,” except really it’s not.

12

Yes, good thought. Thanks.

13

Mike,

Took me a while to figure it out, but what helped me to easily get a good seal at speed was to condition my fingers / hands with lotion before playing. tim

14

Thanks. Good tip but I already do that . . . . followed by rubbing my hands with a candle to make for a better grip on the whistle.

15

When I played flamenco guitar, I would soak my hands in very warm water for a few minutes before preforming. It was a quick warm up. Until now I haven’t thought about doing the same warm up for my Goldie low D. :pint:

16

Another good idea! I’ll maybe try that myself.

17

I’m noticing that when I’m improvising and my hands are completely relaxed, I cover the holes much better than when I’m learning or polishing a tune and perhaps have tension in my hands. I wonder whether muscle memory, or whatever you want to call it, is somehow interfered with by tension in the hands and maybe the rest of the body too.