Mini Review of the new injection molded Lon Dubh

That’s good to know 'cause I’m thinking about ordering a Tony Dixon duo whistle/flute! :smiley:

Alright, just back from a session with 10 or eleven players (including 4 guitarists, so it was a louder medium sized session), and the volume was more than fine. Tuning seemed dead on (one of the other players is a harpist and she is always spot on). It does clog easier than some of my other whistles with that long narrow channel, but I received quite a few compliments on the whistle and its tone. Still happy.

Eric

I tested an injection-molded Lon Dubh over the period of about a week:
The tone was sweet, professional, and complex, but on the quiet side, and grew on me. It could be heard in a small session, which surprised me. I think it was due to the complexity of the tone. It sounded very much like a recording I recently heard. It definitely required some breath control. Especially to keep from overblowing. Tuning (and ultimately the reason that I returned it to Whistle and Drum) was the main problem: the low d and e were flat and could not be blown into tune without jumping the octave. The middle d and e were sharp and had to be barely blown to be in tune. I tried taping them, but it affected the volume too much. The upper c and d were virtually unplayable and wildly out of tune. Frankly, I expected more from a whistle of this pedigree and expense. That said, it sounds like there is considerable variation between instruments. YMMV.

I pop up this thread as it turned a bit sour there for a bit.

A guy has set up shop in town for the week selling a bunch of Lon Dubhs. I tried one and found none of the things that started the negative mood on this thread . It’s a light blowing whistle but not in any way overly so. It played very comfortable for me. I thought the voicing and the balancing of the octaves was very nice, none of the shouting high notes some expensive whistles suffer from. Good job actually.

It is a plastic whistle and it feels and sounds like it though. I asked my wife what she thought of the sound. ‘It sounds like a plastic whistle’ was the reply. That probably sums it up. A nice plastic whistle though.


Would I buy one? Yes probably but not at the current price (which was set here at €70). At €30 or 40, maybe. But YMMV.


[copied from another thread where I originally posted this comment. It is more appropriate here and dwas intended for this thread in the first place]

Thanks to Mr. Gumby waking up this not-so-old review of mine, I’ve been reminded to update my original review somewhat. My opinion of the whistle I originally received has not changed. I’m convinced that despite the obvious handwork on the finger holes and the otherwise solid fit and finis of this whistle, it remains inconsistent as evidenced by the wide range of opinion among respondents regarding it’s performance.

But rather than return it or sell it as I implied early on, I decided that I would study a bit and attempt to rectify these perceived shortcomings. My perception of my instrument, which seems to be different than others, was that of a sweetly toned instrument that was close enough to being in-tune that I could control any difference with breath. Yet is had a weak low end and switched octaves far too easily. I’ve played the Shush and Hoovers so I understand that there’s a place for this voicing. But it seemed to me that this whistle was somewhat different than the original Lon Dubh, yet designed to emulate same. So my lifelong curiosity with how things work led me to experiment.

I pulled out a few old Woodwind Quarterly magazines and studied some old C&F threads on tweaking, then decided to make two adjustments. I used a very small needle file to just barely blunt the edge of the blade. I noticed that this whistle did not have the bevel that generally, almost ubiquitously, exists on the window side of the fipple block on well made fipple-based instruments. So using a small chisel blade on an Exacto knife, I created a tiny bevel on that edge. After testing and noting improvement in my two problem areas I made one more light pass on both areas and was delighted to note a dramatic improvement.

The primary changes were those I desired. The low D and E were strengthened significantly and the octave change was now more stable and controllable, at least for me. It is still quiet, yet ever so slightly less pure than it was before. Of course, as always, YMMV. Particularly since your issues may be different than mine based on the possible inconsistency between instruments.

I was willing to take the risk of ruining the instrument but I wouldn’t advise anyone who wasn’t to try this. As makers will testify, very slight changes in this area can have huge impacts. Oh, I was tempted to make a third pass but held back for fear of destroying this whistle.

I like this whistle now. It has a purpose now in my stable of instruments and I’m happy with it.

Good luck with yours, if you dare :astonished:
ecohawk

it remains inconsistent as evidenced by the wide range of opinion among respondents regarding it’s performance.

But the question is, is the whistle indeed inconsistent or is it the range of players who responded, the differences in what hey are used to and their experiences? I heard several people try different whistles in the shop, people who played quite different styles but whistles I heard were pretty consistent in their sound, tuning and response.

Yet is had a weak low end and switched octaves far too easily. I’ve played

Again, that is not something I experienced at all but I am used to easy playing whistles, in fact I wouldn’t want it any other way. Again, taste and what you’re used to can weigh heavily but I don’t think this necessarily points to a defective whistle.

While I can’t answer all of that, I know that I’ve got the experience and breath control to have confidence in my assessment of the one I returned (note the words now in bold)…

So, also having respect for the differing opinions of others (not least yourself, Mr.Gumby!), am compelled to conclude that 1. (however unlikely it sounds given their moulded origins) there must be tangible differences between finished instruments, and ergo 2. I’m probably wrong to suggest a design fault per se. Happy for anyone who’s got one and likes it when I wanted/expected/tried so much to like it too, but simply wouldn’t risk it again myself without testing the very instrument first.

That’s a good question certainly. There is probably some of both at play here. But it would seem that from the assessments posted by a couple knowledgeable players here that the whistles are somewhat inconsistent. Ecohawk knows his way around the business end of a whistle pretty well. I value Peter Duggan’s opinion here too. I am inclined to support his evaluation. So I’d venture it isn’t all operator error or inexperience at play here.

And thus some examples may be playing better than others - Mr. Gumby’s experience as evidence. Just because the parts are molded does not mean that they all fit together the same way every time. It’s not easy turning a handmade design into a manufactured product while still achieving the result in performance of the handmade original. We should remind ourselves about the long time it took to finally bring the product to market and could inquire as to what the issues were there. There could still be more issue to go.

Admirable, very admirable.

Feadoggie

I was just wondering what the story was. The (pop up) shop I was in had 15-20 Lon Dubh whistles sitting there, I picked a random one and found it fine, several other people were trying them as well and they didn’t seem to have any problems by the sound of it.

The board has a bit of history of condemning whistles on the basis of blowing them too hard. If you are used to playing low whistles or flutes all the time, it can happen when you suddenly hit on a soft blower. I don’t know. It just seems so unlikely that a whistle that had it’s launch hyped to a certain extend would be launched with a dodgy batch.

I am really thinking out loud and wondering what the story is. If the shop is still there I may go have another look and maybe try a few more. I was a bit reluctant doing that today as I don’t intend to spend €70 on it so maybe it’s not fair to try out the shop’s stock. We’ll see.

Right. I think that’s what we are all doing here. I sure don’t doubt what you experienced. I’d value your input from playing some more of the Lon Dubhs.

Feadoggie.

While that may well be true, it’s completely irrelevant to me. I could blow that thing as soft as you like and hold it there… lower octave, upper octave, on the cusp between the two or whatever, and never found it to suffer from the instability/over-eager switching described by ecohawk. The notes I found unacceptably sharp simply refused to speak at any pressure low enough to keep them acceptably in tune!

it’s completely irrelevant to me.

It isn’t to me. I am just trying to figure out how such wildly varying experiences could come about. I have no dogs in this race.

So (despite everything I’ve said) we’ve all just been blowing them too hard? :boggle:

I am just trying to figure out how such wildly varying experiences could come about.

I’m not. I know what I know about the one I had, and nothing anyone else says about theirs (with or without your generic board history) can change that particular assessment.

I have no dogs in this race.

Me neither. It’s history AFAIC.

I just wanted to make a quick reference in regards to Ecohawks earlier post on this thread about a little tweak that he made to his Lon Dubh whistle.
I also have a Lon Dubh that I purchased around the same time as Ecohawk. I also noticed that the bottom D and E were weak and unstable and flatter in comparison to the rest of the notes. The tone was not sweet as some described it but it had more of a buzzy edge to it.
After reading Ecohawks suggestion I decided to give it a try. I have a little experience tweaking and making whistles. I am also full time stringed instrument repairman and have a few tools that I use for guitars.
After a close inspection …
It almost seemed like there was a bit of a bur there on the edge of the fipple. Not enough to stick up into the windway but sort of a rough edge on the front lip.
I sharpened up my 1/8 in chisel and angled it a little but not much. The second tweak was to softened the front edge of the blade a little but not even a measurable amount. I made a small sanding stick with some 400 grit sandpaper glued to it and just touched the front edge of the blade. The biggest improvement came from chamfering the edge of the fipple. It was such an improvement that I would be afraid to do anything else to it.

It is hard to believe that a small adjustment would make such a difference but the instability and tuning problems have cleared up and the tone doesn’t have as much of that buzzy edge to it. The volume and tone are much fuller in the first octave and the overall stability has improved.

YMMV,
Nate

oh, you “Freeman-ed” it :thumbsup: