Hi
I am going to notate all the tunes on Feadoga Stain this week. If anyone wants a pdf copy when I’m done, let me know.
Can anyone help me with translations of the gaelic titles? As written on The sessions is right?
Ok. here goes.
. . . no, I don’t have a life.
Try this, it may be more accurate:
http://www.irishtune.info/album/MB+1/
All of the dance tunes from “Feadog Stain” have already been transcribed at “theSession” – see link below :
http://www.thesession.org/recordings/display/24
If you look in “Comments”, I provided information where to find the corresponding transcription where the system fails through tunes having one or more title.
I’m going to disagree that “MTGuru’s” linked site is “more accurate”. Far too many titles attributed to tunes, solely on the basis that somebody, at some time apparently has recorded a particular tune under a particular title.
That’s true, Kenny, accurate but perhaps confusing. In this case, the first titles listed by Alan Ng are actually OK with a couple of exceptions (Mick Hand’s, Hut in the Bog). Alan does manually verify his track listings. But your recording comments at thesession are definitely a big help to navigate the bizarre linkages there. 
The titles themselves look fine, and the transcriptions are probably fine with the usual caveats.
But if squeezebox99 may intend doing his/her own whistle-specific transcriptions from the album as a personal learning tool and exercise, I can certainly understand the utility of that over simply reading generic transcriptions from thesession or elsewhere. I know I’ve learned a lot by doing close, detailed transcriptions of Ms. Bergin’s playing.
[BTW, Kenny, I hope all is well with you there. I understand our friend Chris is leaving Aberdeen for parts unknown. Cheers!]
yes, I am doing this to learn about the whistle and to better understand Mary B’s playing. I will look at the transcription of course - but I want everything in the key it’s played in.
Is there a norm for writing tunes keys? I know mary B plays some in Bb and F = so do I write them in those keys or make everything generic G or D to make it easier to read on whatever whistle?
Margaret
I think the norm is to transcribe it as if it were being played on a D whistle, (e.g. in D, G, Em, Am, or whatever). In your comments, you might notate the actual key of the source recording.
will transcribe in original key then transpose to D whistle.
Should be a fun challenge!
That’s a lot of tunes to transcribe. If you do it accurately, I’d be interested in getting a set. Hang tough.
If I can make a suggestion as I’ve transcribed a load of tunes over the years… My technique has evolved and I’ve arrived at what I think is the easiest system I can manage:
Listen to the tune a number of times at full speed, then listen again at about 75% speed and try to get a lot of it into your head. Then, slow the recording down to about 50% and get down at least 4 notes (of a reel) at a time. If you have a lot of it in your head already, you’ll be able to briefly memorize a full measure or so and get it written down.
Use a text file on the computer rather than a paper and pen/pencil. (All the letters you use are on the left hand.) You can use the cap lock for runs of lower octave transcription. Type 4 measures on one line and keep things lined up vertically. That will allow you to see repetitive phrases and you can listen while visually reviewing a previous line and get it all put down at once. Here is a sample of a transcription. Notice how you can look at the lines and see the structure of the tune and its repetitions.
The Fairy Child
EBB ABd |BAG FGE |EBB ABd |Bed B3 |
EBB ABd |BAG FGA |Bed BAG |ABG E3 |
fed Bee |dBA Bde |fed Bee |dBA B3 |
fed Bee |dcB AGA |Bed BAG |ABG E3 |
Bee gab |afa gfd |Bee gab |afa g3 |
bag fga |gfe dBA |Bed BAG |ABG E3 |
gfe def |edB Bef |gef d2 f|edB d3 |def
gfe def |edB AGA |Bed BAG |ABG E3 |
Have fun.
Tony
Hey
Thanks for the advice.
I have degrees in music - so it’s easiest for me to just notate everything using standard notation - I will listen to the tune and memorize it - or notate it as I listen to it.
Not easy for everyone, I know - but after all these years, pretty easy for me…though it will be a challenge. Got Port Sean Seosamh done this way fairly quickly. MM
At a festival years ago there was a guy who had written out a couple of those tunes with all the articulation etc, in other words not just the notes but complete transcriptions of Mary’s performances. They were very interesting to see.
That’s my goal. I know these are her versions of the tunes, but I want to figure this gal out. It’s brillilant. Have begun looking at Ril Gan Ainm, Ah, Surely and The Union reel already.
SImilar to the transcriptions of the tunes on the sessions, but not exactly. I will also indicate the keys she plays in - which so far seems to be Bb and Eb - - interesting choice.
Poor mando player. M
How do you plan to notate the airs (for example, cut #5, Liam O Raghallaigh)? I’ve been forcing them into specific time signatures (to be interpreted freely), but if you figure out a better way, I’d love to know it.
Idon’t know yet how I’m going to the slow aires yet. As a contemporary composer and an ethnomusicologist by trade I’m sure I will figure something out!
You’ll find that collections of slow airs, such as 110 Ireland’s Best Slow Airs forces the transcription to conform to specific time signatures. The accompanying cd’s tell a different story.
Tony
Lots of good advice there, Tonio.
One of the things that I hate about the black dots people is that they don’t see the merit in providing intuitive hints like your suggested alignment to show up the repetitions.
Another of my bugbears is the way they beam together notes in a way which disregards the phrasing - notably where the last note in a bar (measure) is the upbeat of a phrase that is part of the following bar. By beaming it with the preceding notes they send a message that it belongs with those notes, and sight-readers unfamiliar with ITM faithfully and leadenly reproduce this wrong phrasing.
The accompaniment is played on bouzouki by Alec Finn, whom I have it on good authority does actually possess a device known as a “capo”
To get even an approximate idea of the various articulations, you can do the following (which most “legit” musicians should be able to sightread):
- slur/tie notes together which are played completely legato with no articulation whatsoever
- notes not slurred/tied are seperated by tongue but are still played to full value
- notes with a bar or dash over them _ are a bit more seperated but still not staccato
- notes with a dot over them . are played staccato
Those should get you fairly close.
By all means you need to figure out what key whistle she is using for each tune, because that affects a lot more than just the key the tune is rendered in, it affects the way it is played, as certain things are done on certain notes on the whistle that are not done on other notes. For example most whistlers, uilleann pipers, and flute players do a B-C#-D triplet which leads up to the middle D of the instrument in question (on pipes that D is called the “back D”). Mary, unlike a lot of other players, also very often does a C#-D-E triplet. Her propensity to use these triplets has a huge impact on how she arranges the tunes she plays, and it would be very misleading to render her playing in incorrect keys, as for example these triplets would then show up on notes that she in fact would never play them on.
Another of my bugbears is the way they beam together notes in a way which disregards the phrasing - notably where the last note in a bar (measure) is the upbeat of a phrase that is part of the following bar. By beaming it with the preceding notes they send a message that it belongs with those notes, and sight-readers unfamiliar with ITM faithfully and leadenly reproduce this wrong phrasing.
Very true. My method fails in the same way, only giving you a way to memorize the melody notes easiest.
To get even an approximate idea of the various articulations, you can do the following (which most “legit” musicians should be able to sightread):
- slur/tie notes together which are played completely legato with no articulation whatsoever
- notes not slurred/tied are seperated by tongue but are still played to full value
- notes with a bar or dash over them _ are a bit more seperated but still not staccato
- notes with a dot over them . are played staccato
Those should get you fairly close.
An example of this level of notation can be found in The Dance Music of Willie Clancy, which is transcriptions of recordings of his piping, and written as standard notation with a lot of dots and squiggles to describe the above. It’s no joke to try to tackle one of those transcriptions.
So, we still have to acknowledge the supreme importance of hearing the actual playing to get the best idea of what’s going on. Like Pan said, these are approximations, though I’d say helpful ones.
There’s a lot to be discussed about tying legato notes together and the slight shifts in timing, the tonguing and slight pausing, etc. that create phrasing. I’d be intimidated at the thought of writing this stuff out.
Tony
Another of my bugbears is the way they beam together notes in a way which disregards the phrasing - notably where the last note in a bar (measure) is the upbeat of a phrase that is part of the following bar. By beaming it with the preceding notes they send a message that it belongs with those notes, and sight-readers unfamiliar with ITM faithfully and leadenly reproduce this wrong phrasing.
Very true. My method fails in the same way, only giving you a way to memorize the melody notes easiest.
To get even an approximate idea of the various articulations, you can do the following (which most “legit” musicians should be able to sightread):
- slur/tie notes together which are played completely legato with no articulation whatsoever
- notes not slurred/tied are seperated by tongue but are still played to full value
- notes with a bar or dash over them _ are a bit more seperated but still not staccato
- notes with a dot over them . are played staccato
Those should get you fairly close.
An example of this level of notation can be found in The Dance Music of Willie Clancy, which is transcriptions of recordings of his piping, and written as standard notation with a lot of dots and squiggles to describe the above. It’s no joke to try to tackle one of those transcriptions.
So, we still have to acknowledge the supreme importance of hearing the actual playing to get the best idea of what’s going on. Like Pan said, these are approximations, though I’d say helpful ones.
There’s a lot to be discussed about tying legato notes together and the slight shifts in timing, the tonguing and slight pausing, etc. that create phrasing. I’d be intimidated at the thought of writing this stuff out.
Then, there’s also the notion of making a tune your own as opposed to copying someone elses rendition. Copying, however, is a great learning exercise. My own inclination is to transcribe the melody with very little regard to where the performer put his/her ornamentation. I like to figure mine out over time. I will mark a squiggle to note something interesting happened here. (I transcribe a lot of fiddle tunes, so, you know…)
(By the way, I’ve looked forward to this type of discussion showing up on this board. There is a ton that can be discussed without getting into the metaphysical ineffible or the ‘who’s qualified to comment on the sacred’ that passes for advice sometimes. This is largely passed over as if inexpressible.)
Tony