I’ve recently decided to learn to play the whistle. I play the bagpipes and have been around whistles a lot so I do have an idea of reading music and an idea of how I should be sounding. I’ve managed to get my hands on a book called ‘Play Pennywhistle’ by Peter Pickow and a very cheap D whistle. I’m getting on okay with the book but I was just wondering if it would be a better idea for me to invest in a bit of a better quality whistle.(If yes, any suggestions?) Does the quality of sound vary with the quality of whistle, and would a better whistle be a bit easier to play, easier to keep a steadier sound and give a cleaner sound when changing between notes?
Any other advice for a newbie would be much appreciated…
I think you will find the transition to whistle to be fairly easy - the fingering isn;t identical but it’s close, and you can use “piper’s grip.” Experiment with your piping articulations - most of them will translate over to whistle fairly cleanly.
The hard part is learning how and when to breathe - it is quite different from pipes. That and there’s no pinky hole!
You might need a new whistle if yours isn’t great, but it doesn’t have to be expensive.
The sound will vary a lot from whistle to whistle, but not necessarily proportionate to price. You’re less likely to get a stinker with an expensive whistle, but you can find good whistles in all prices. It’s more a question of what sound you want and whether or not you want to pay someone (the maker or a whistle tweaker like Jerry Freeman) to adapt the whistle to your preferences. You can certainly buy a very decent whistle for under $40 if you look around enough. Buy a more expensive whistle when you’ve heard enough to know exactly what you want.
Now, there is no consensus on what is and is not a good whistle, so what follows is my opinion only. In the inexpensive whistles, Feadogs are good, and even better if you put a Mack Hoover Whitecap fipple on top of them. The new Feadog pro has been well reviewed, but I haven’t heard them. Generations are good if you get a “good one” or have Jerry Freeman tweak it for you. It’s hard to go wrong with one of Jerry’s tweaked whistle. I’ve heard good things about Oaks but have never tried one. That should get you started finding a decent, inexpensive whistle. You can certainly spend more if you care to.
Some whistles make less squawk when you change notes without perfectly timing your fingers so that they all move at the same instant. In my opinion, however, it’s better to learn on a whistle which makes mistakes like not moving your fingers together very obvious, even if it’s hard to listen to at first.
But most of all, pick tunes you like and enjoy yourself! 
You can’t go wrong with a Burke. 
Here’s a tip for getting started using tunes in your new, more expansively ranged instrument. You can play all of your piping repertoire on a whistle if you “transpose” your fingering up to the top hand. . . . In other words, what would be a low A on a piping scale would look like this:
xxoooo
on a whistle. To get most of your A-mixolydian scale, you will need to blow into the second octave on the whistle.
Some good crossover tunes:
Atholl Highlanders
Farewell to Erin → This is very tricky to get the arpeggios right on whistle if yer comng from pipes. A very good workout.
Kesh jig
Gravel Walks
Hag at the Churn
Sandy Duff (AKA the High Reel)
Jolly Beggarman (AKA Red Haird Boy)
Jig o Slurs (Most ITM types don’t realize that’s originally a piping tune)
Langstrom’s Pony
Many common pipes tunes are also played on whistle but in D. Fingering wise, this just means you play the whistle like a pipe chanter:
Old Hag you have killed me
Blarney pilgrim
Hey pipebond,
I also started whistle as a bagpiper. If you want my 2 cents, I wouldn’t spend very much on a high D whistle. There are just too many inexpensive high D’s around that do the job just fine. It is important that you have a whistle that is playable so that you don’t get frustrated, but you should be able to find a Feadog or a Walton at most music stores for $10 or so. They work just fine. Stay away from Generations - they’re too inconsistent.
You will obviously want to branch out eventually, but I can tell you that I bought 8 or 10 more expensive whistles (non-high D) before I replaced my first high D. It’s harder to get whistles in other keys, and so it makes sense to spend a little money towards those when you feel like exploring them, but for the most part, in my opinion, you have to spend a fair amount of money on a D whistle to get one that is a substantial improvement over a decent inexpensive, and when you’re starting out, I just don’t think it’s worth it (most squeaks and squawks and be controlled in large measure with your breathing and finger placement). If I were you, I’d put the 40 or 50 dollars you would have to spend on even a moderately priced high D towards a Low D (which is a whole other world of fun).
That being said, if you do have your heart on a mid-range high D, any of Jerry Freeman’s tweaked whistles would be a good investment (I have one and have played several). I can also say that David O’Brien makes good copper whistles at a very reasonable price (I have a set). But as I say, adequate high D’s are pretty easy to come by, and I think you’re way better off finding an inexpensive that works, building a repetoire, and buying something that’s not a high D (like a low whistle, or a whistle in another key). Get a quality high D later.
That’s me.
Welcome. I also play GHBs but not much these days I usually stick to Flute.
Hello pipebond, being just a little more then a newbie to whistles myself I know what your about to go through. Most of what the others said is true my friend, but in my opinion its kind of like putting the cart before the horse. What I mean is I think one should start off with a whistle that works good instead of having to buy 15 or 20 whistles trying to find one that plays right. That way you learn things right and when you make a mistake you know its you and not the whistle.
In my opinion a Jerry Freeman’s tweaked whistles would be a very good investment. Buying 15 or 20 different whistles trying to find a good one (when your not even sure if a whistle is good or not) is a waste of money. And will cost more in the long run then a Jerry Freeman’s tweaked whistles. At least you know the whistle is good, if it dont sound right you know its you and not the whistle. So your not running out to buy a couple more whistles to see if they are good ones.
No I dont get a kickback from Jerry Freeman, I dont even know him. But I know his whistles are good ones.
If your current whistle is relatively in tune with itself, as Oaks and Feadogs seem to be, you could send it off to Mack Hoover for a Whitecap or Blackhead, which should improve the sound quite a bit. (If you do that, be sure to tell him whether you want it to be loud or quiet.)
I’m also very fond of Mack’s tunable CPVC whistles.
You can’t go wrong with the Humphrey Stealth, either.
I’ve only bought a few cheap whistles, but none of them had the sound quality that I wanted. I’d rather spend a few bucks more and deal with a maker who stands behind their product–as all of our C&F makers seem to do.
Well first of all Happy New Year everone, and thanks for all your help.
Learning the whistle is going fine at the moment - the hardest part is reading the music and getting the right fingering in relation to the notes as they’re different from piping, but apart from that it’s relatively easy.
My brother had a Walton whistle which he randomly bought in Dublin a while ago, so i’m using that at the moment, and one of my mates has a Clarke whistle which he said I could have. I think these should be ok to get me started then I would probably look at getting one of Jerry Freeman’s tweaked whistles or getting one with Mack Hoovers whitecap on it, but not for a wee while.
Wormdiet, I already know pretty much all the tunes you listed so it shouldn’t be too hard to transpose them to the whistle, cheers for the info.
Luckily i’m on holiday from uni at the moment so i’ve got loads of time for practising, just hope I have enough time when I get back to uni to juggle pipes, whistle and uni work!
Unseen122, is that you? From Bobdunsire? Wow! What a small world. This is Brian, we are talking about your Highland Hornpipe right now.
You can’t Go wrong with Clarke. Especially for a beginnger. Although I’d stay away from the Meg C. It’s a whistle with tuning issues. However, the Meg D (black looks sharp and won’t tarnish) is 3$ and I love the whistle. Seriously this whistle is pretty damn good for 3$. It’s not the clearest sounding whistle, while not the breathiest, kind of in the middle I’d say. Get one. And if it’s not to your likings, it was 3$. However, since you say you play the bagpipes, (and I’m assuming highland although there’s lots of uilleann pipers lurking around these parts…) you might find this whistle to squeek and squak a lot. That could be very well do the fact that you’re use to blowing so hard with the pipes, (again, assuming you play the highlands) so if this might be an issue, I would go with a Clarke Original with the wooden fipple block. This whistle takes a little more air to play, and therefore sounds a little breathier like an Irish flute. But, I learned on this very whistle, and a lot of other’s have as well. I think it’s a good beginner’s whistle for anybody. Except maybe little kids who might not have the lung power… This whistle is around the 12$ mark. You can get 'em at www.thewhistleshop.com if your local music store doesn’t sell them.
But, if you’re doing just fine learning with what you’ve got, and there’s no problems, go for it. Everyone’s different, this is just my experience and thoughts for beginning the whistle.
Enjoy!
-Eric
I’m sure this piece of advice will open a can of worms but here goes:
Don’t worry so much about reading the dots. (Sheet notation). If you want to pick up tunes to play with people in a session, learn to learn by ear. The reasons are that:
- once you get good at it (which takes practice) your repertoire will grow more quickly
2)you’ll know local versions of tunes (which usually vary from published sources)
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you’ll remember the tunes more easily,
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you will pick up on a lot of nuances that can’t be conveyed in notation.
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You’ll improve at creating your own variations on the fly, which is a lot of the fun in Irish music.
The biggest difference between piping and whistling is that whistling is more individualistic - because you’re not playing in a marching band, you don;t need to worry about playing everything in absolute unison the way you do on pipes. Practically, this means that you can be a lot more relaxed about learning the “right” version of a tune, and learning tunes by ear pesents fewer problems. This is why I dropped GHB and moved to flute - more latitude for creativity.
The “right version” of a tune in a pipe band is just the version your band is playing (there are inumerable versions of every tune I’ve heard). Unison is a virtue when playing with other pipers just as it is when playing any instrument in a session, including whistle. If you’re playing with other people, it just sounds better when you’re playing the same thing. In fact, if your not playing the same thing, you’re not actually playing with other people - you’re just playing at the same time as other people; you’re just making noise.
Like whistle players, most pipers also play on their own, during which times you can be as “individualistic” with your playing as you would like. The advantages of the whistle over the GHB is that the whistle is a less demanding instrument (physically); is quiter; has a greater range; and can easily be played with other instruments.
While learning to play by ear is important, and offers many of the virtures Wormdiet suggests, before you show up to play at a session you should probably know how to play the instrument first, which means you should probably know a few tunes. Sheet music shows you how to do that. If you do eventually play with others, and if they play some of the tunes you picked up from sheet music, but play them differently, it’s a very simple thing to adapt what you’re playing.
Besides, if you want to play an instrument, you should be musically literate in its terms (you should know that you’re playing an A when you’re playing an A, and being able to read the music will ensure you do). If you can already read music, it doesn’t take long to match the notes up to the fingering on the whistle. There’s only six holes. It’s pretty simple.
I speak from my own experiences as a solo and band piper during the late 80s - maybe things have changed since then. Anyways, especially in solo competition, knowing a widespread version of a tune was quite important - judges would often recognize the tune books that one learned a tune from. No one I heard or competed against played any competition piece (solo now, not band) with anywhere near the amount of variation one finds at a good Irish session. For one thing, since one plays a GHB tune only once through, the opportunity to display some creativity on the repeats obviously doesn’t exist.
Unison is a virtue when playing with other pipers just as it is when playing any instrument in a session, including whistle. If you’re playing with other people, it just sounds better when you’re playing the same thing. In fact, if your not playing the same thing, you’re not actually playing > with > other people - you’re just playing at the same time as other people; you’re just making noise.
I guess I just have different preferences then - if I wanted to hear Irish music played with absolute unison, I wouldn’t bother going to sessions - the fun part (for me) is hearing how all sorts of minor differences and tweaks can blend into a whole that is greater than the sum of its parts. What’s the point of having two whistles or flutes playing in exact, perfect unison? We’d be better off listening to one player, with a microphone and PA system if the environment was loud. Moeover, it’s physically impossible for some instruments to play in perfect unison with others. . .e.g. a fiddle exactly mimicking whistle or box ornaments.
On the sheet music thing - any decent piper shouldn’t have the need to spend a lot of time on sheet notation since they should already have those skills. It’s pretty simple to figure out how to transpose the fingerings and correlate them to the dots. Learning a tune solely by ear, however, is an extremely valuable skill for session players and it isn;t obvious for those of us coming from GHB - trust me, I went through this transition myself recently. One simply does not need to use notation to learn tunes prior to going to a session. Don’t get me wong, it’s a very good skill to have, but is not any sort of a prerequisite.
I am the same one.
Wormdiet don’t even get me started about Pipeband comps. One time my old Band lost a competition because the drum instructor in our band is in a rival band against one of the judges. That was the reason as we lost to bands we had beaten the week before.
Wormdiet:
Performing new arrangements of old tunes is meat and potatoes for competitive pipe bands and has been for quite some time. While it is true that soloists are usually best off keeping to traditional settings, such settings vary depending on the collection you get the tune from. Morevover, the real reason soloists stick to traditional settings in competition is to avoid confusion about whether they’ve made a mistake. This isn’t a problem in all solo contests, though. The last time I played competitively, the open jig in PPBSO contsests required the tune to be played twice over. You could play whatever arrangements you wanted with no confusion. It was great.
What is more to the point, though, is that playing the bagpipes does not equal playing bagpipes for a competition. If you’re not playing in a competition - if you’re playing, say, by yourself or at a pub - you can play what you like. In fact, in an informal context people usually prefer less controlled performances then they do if they are judging a contest (I do). Apples and oranges, no?
As for the general virtues of unison, no one ever suggested that a symphony orchestra strip down to 1 violinist per part and replace the rest of the players with a PA, and with good reason.
While it is not always possible to play tunes note for note on different instruments, and while subtle differences can still be complimentary (particularly if they are harmonic), the greater those differences are, the more cacophonic they become. It is a qualitative scale with melody and harmony at one end (where people are playing in unison) and noise at the other (where people are playing, say, completely different tunes, or any random notes that come to them). This is why professional folk musicians (like all musicians) practice together before giving a concert, or cutting an album.
Session playing is meant to be more fun and relaxed, of course, and offers its own excitement and spontaneity - again, different context. But even here, a degree of uniformity is necessary. Why else would it be beneficial to learn the local settings of tunes, as you suggest it is? It’s beneficial because it allows you to play with the local musicians. Right?
And re: reading. We’re in general agreement, any decent piper should have no trouble with it, and its a good skill. The thing is that while learning tunes at a session is great, you can’t play at a session unless you can play, and I haven’t yet met the person who could play an instrument without every having played tunes on it. So how do you start? You can, of course, learn by making noise at a session (which I’m sure everyone else would love), but in that case, you’ll never learn to read on that instrument - you’ll never develop that “good skill”. Alternatively, you could make the very modest effort of matching the notes on the page to the notes on the instrument, then learn to play modestly, then get better at a session. That was my point.
THis is a good discussion - I think we’re mostly in agreement. For one thing, that open competition you describe sounds like a blast. I wish there had been more of that going around in my neck of the woods 20 years ago! I still remember when the 78th Frasier’s album came out - people were dropping jaws over the inclusion of F naturals, if you can believe that.
The reason I focus on the competition scene is because, (Again in my experience), that’s where just about all serious, decent pipers learn to play. There are the parade pipers and guys who will gig for weddings and parties and such, but the standard of playing from those types is (generally, IME again) nowhere even close to what even a journeyman grade II piper would find routine. Around these pipers, a guy who knows how to tune his drones is a rare and wonderful thing. Of course it’s possible to play in pubs and so forth, but for obvious reasons isn’t that common.
About the minutiae of the dots issue - in my own experience, the first tunes I played on whistle, in a session, were those learned originally on the pipes. I think the very first was “Old Hag you’ve Killed Me,” which I learned from a Davy Spillane album (Another medium of learning tunes besides live and from notation.) The other was “Jimmy Wards.”* Of course there’s no real harm in picking up the basics (Kesh et al) from notation, and if it allows somebody to jump in quickly, then go for it. But I guess my point was that it’s never too early to learn from ear.
About the individual difference versus unison issue, horses for courses - I like a bit of random dissonance I guess 
Otherwise I woulda stuck with brass and joined the orchestra. Yer again absolutely right - a totally cacophonous session isn’t much fun, but I do enjoy that latitude that exists even in (Especially in) high-level sessions. Which I enjoy watching more than disrupting.
*As an aside, in the 80’s it seemed liked every fifth tune in a competition medley was stolen from the Bothy Band.
I appreciate your thoughts and hope this thread has been fun.
And apologies for the threadjacking!
A lot of the more old-fashioned judges also frown upon re-arrangements of these traditional tunes, especially MSR, so they are rarely played with amendments.
In regard to the confusion of making mistakes or not - I’ve heard of a few pipers making mistakes in parts and then repeating the mistakes the second time through the parts, so the judges think it had been changed on purpose - i’ve even heard of this happening in some major solo comps!
True. In fact it’s more frequent than that - I’ve done it myself! I even tried it in a grade 1 piobreach contest when I was 15 - and got away with it!