There are many different dances that sound quite similar to one another but still are often distinguished as different dances.
The most difficult ones are the ones that sound like hornpipes, but are categorized as something else. I know that strathspeys are scottish tunes and have that “Scoths snap” thing which makes them recognizable. But then, how about highlands and flings. Are they the same thing and something in between hornpipes and strathspeys or what is the difference here?
Then I have heard that there are tunes that are called “rants” and that this “rant” is always indicated in the tune’s name, for example “Morphet’s Rant”. Also, Barndances often sound like hornpipes to me.
Also, I’ve noticed that hornpipes are sometimes played more like slow reels, kinda straight, without the distinctive “long-short” rhytmic figure.
So is there anybody round there who could answer these questions? I would appreciate that a lot. I don’t know anything about dancing, so are these different tune types different in that sense (have different steps or something) and musically similar?
To further muddy the water for you, there are different acceptable ways of playing hornpipes, especially depending on your instrument. Maybe flute (and accordion?) players tend to play theirs rather straight, whereas fiddle players often have a bouncier more uneven style. For a good example of the phenomenon, check out “The Funny Reel” by Andy McGann & Joe Burke, where they play some hornpipes loopy and some straight.
Now, after reading that stuff I’m not sure about jigs and reels anymore
I’m still very interested in the matter (I study musicology and I’m doing a study considering ITM), however it seems that these flings, highlands, germans, barndances, rants, scottiches etc. are distinguished differently by different players and there is much confusion between them depending where one lives and so on.
Still, cause I don’t know anything about dancing, it would be nice to hear from somebody that does, and are these ones above all different dances.
Information about the different dances is definitely what you need here. A few snippets to help fill in the pieces of the puzzle, or maybe just muddy the waters further:
I’m famililar with hornpipes as played for modern, hard-shoe step dancers for demonstrations and competitions etc. The tempo tends to be very slow and the note values even. Painful to play and even more painful to listen to.
I think the older people dancing the “sean nos” soft-shoe style would like their hornpipes a lot livelier and bouncier.
Then hornpipes are used for some figures of Cork and Kerry sets, but at a very lively tempo.
Barn dances are generally couple dances as opposed to solo, set or ceili-type dances. I think the well-known Stack of Barley" is a barn dance which is usually done to The Stack of Barley, which is yes, a hornpipe.
But yer average barn dance tune (e.g. James Gannon’s Barn Dance, Memories of Sligo) although in a similar rhythm to hornpipes has a distinctive melodic character, less characteristically Irish somehow.
Then there are Germans or German barn dances, the tunes for which are again different (some of them resembling English rants). Germans are a Northern thing, like highlands.
Highlands are also couple dances, and they are still danced today in parts of west Donegal. The tunes are generally two parts, eight bars each. The tunes are often strathspey tunes borrowed and “straightened out”. Or what Packie Manus Byrne described as “failed reels, reels that didn’t make the grade”.
Rants, as far as I know, are a North of England thing. Morpeth is in Northumberland. There is a characteristic a-one-two-three step done in the dance. The three strong crotchet beats to end are phrase are even more marked than in Irish hornpipes, and in fact tend to occur every four bars.
A place you might look for more information on highlands and flings would be a detailed book about the Donegal fiddle tradition, Between the Jigs and Reels by Caomhin Mac Aoidh.
Highlands don’t tend to find their way into printed collections much but there are 16 nice ones in the above mentioned Packie Manus Byrne’s tunebook, A Dossan of Heather (Mel Bay).
And here are some remarks about dancing highlands from another book by Packie, Recollections of a Donegal Man (currently out of print). Not much by way of a description of the dance but gives you a bit of atmosphere:
Great! Thanks Stevie for the thorough answer you gave. So it is the thing that these all really are different dances, but sometimes sound similar to others.
Only one question remains: Are highlands and flings the same creature?
Fling=Highland. Highland is the Donegal term I guess. On the old 78s and books they were called “Highland Flings.” I’ve seen flings and barndances in old books listed as Schottisches. And the dances for all of these varied all over the map.
Flings have been described as strathspeys with all the really herky-jerkiness taken out, or as slow reels, or strathspeys without the runs of triplets. Some old records have “Highland Fling” on the label but the tune still has some of these features, Coleman/Packie Dolan recorded Stirling Castle/Lady Mary Ramsey like that. Very strathspeyish but it wouldn’t impress a Scotsman I imagine.
I like these weird old tune types. Topic’s Round the House CD has lots of odd old dances, and great liners from Reg Hall.
Thank you, so Highland and Fling is the same thing. This triplet-thing is interesting. Listen to Matt Molloy’s Stony Steps and there is tune called “Frank Roche’s Favourite”. Now, this is sometimes categorized as Fling, however it is full of triplets, so would this make it a Strathspey instead?
Yes, I like the more odd tune types also very much! (Even though I seem not to understand which is what)
Highlands and flings are derived from the strathspey. A well played strathspey has a ‘ghost beat’ in the first beat of dominant measures meaning you hold the first beat out almost to two beats and cut the second beat to compensate. See if you hear a similar structure in a Norwegian springliek: http://www.tvfolk.net/gif/high.gif
I’m sorry I have not asked this earlier, since it’s been while I checked this thread. I’m not sure what do you mean by the “ghost beat in the first beat of dominant measures”. Can you please give me an example? Do you mean the “scotch snap” or what?
