On this third part of Luck Penny there is the F natural, twice
X:1
T: Luck Penny (third part)
M:6/8
R:
K:G
|:dBG GFG|DGB dBG|cA=F FEF|C=FA cBA|
dBG GBd|g2g fd^c|def gdB|1 cAF GBc:|2 cAF G2A||
On other tunes where I encounter the Fnat I’ve been able to find a work around. I was wondering if anyone had a suggestion on how I might make this sound good, I’m not very happy with the Fnat key and half holing doesn’t sound very pleasant on this tune. Maybe its just not a good piping tune. Any thoughts? Thanks,
Mike
I’ve been working on that very tune recently, and am in the same boat! Looking forward to hearing what the experts say.
As for me, I’m fooling with various alternatives, but at present I’m liking using the F natural key and basically playing a “cranlet” with RH index and middle fingers (like you might do on an E natural) on the bottom F natural sequence. Then I either play the second sequence like you do, or sneak around the whole mess by playing =ACA instead of =CFA. Basically, thus:
Breaking up the F natural with a roll or mini-cran seems to help. I don’t know if I could do it with a ring-style key, though, so I guess it depends on what kind of F key you have. Also, I suppose you could replace the ACA bit with an A roll, though not sure I’d do one right after an F roll/cran thingy. Might be too much?
[Is there an ACA triplet opportunity in there? ( ) ]
But like I said, I’m really eager to hear from people who know what they’re doing!
hi, i was thinking once that it would be nice if there were video tutorials dealing with aspects of playing that can be hard to negotiate - not whole tunes but specific things that are hard to work out - for instance, i’v always been puzzled by how to play cnat, 2nd e, 2nd g when they come up in tunes like the scholar, kitty’s rambles in varying forms which involve playing the notes in a loop, because it’s really hard to play a true cnat in this sequence and i end up compromising by playing c sharp or play off the knee and it never seems to work 100%
I agree with john that a sort of exercise sheet with all those tricky combinations pulled out would be extremely useful.
In this particular case, is there mileage in opening the Fnat key at the same time as the preceding A? I hasten to add I’ve not tried such a thing, as I’m mostly using my chanter keys to gather ambient dust at my stage.
Some time during the early eighties I heard Pat Broderick play a version of the tune that avoided that whole bit altogether. I learned that maybe a year or two before I heard the Killoran fiddle version and always considered it a ‘piperised’ version.
Unfamiliarity, plain lack of playing them regularly, is what makes some of the use of some movements harder than other. There’s only one thing for it although you do need to work out first which bits really don’t sit well on the chanter and need adapting to get through and which ones need to be conquered by exercising the fingers. There’s no harm in working out strategies to get around certain movements you find hard, even if only to use them for the time being.
In this case it shouldn’t be too hard to find a way through :
c2A ~F3| with a sliding Fneutral roll should work while the next fnat is really a passing note so you could get away with something like c2 A cBA or c(3fga cBA…
In almost all cases I’ll have the F key open before I get to it. Presuming that the preceding note is above F.
In this case C A F3, I’d open the F key when I play C, and cran the F off the knee with the pinky down.
There’s only one thing for it, practice!
Try transposing tunes you know well into other keys like D to C and G to F.
it makes the practicing easier knowing the tune.
The Legacy Jig is nice in F, as is the Boys of Balisodare.
It is my understanding that some tunes, back in there day, originally had C#s or F#s where today those notes have been naturalized. Perhaps this tune could use some sharpening in that phrase (I’m not familiar with the tune…will have to find it played online somewhere)?
thanks for your thoughts folks. My concert pitch chanter has no Fnat key, the C chanter does, so I try to work both as if there was no key so don’t get confused. Sometimes, like the third part of Flogging Reel, just a lift with a bit of half hole is more than enough for the effect. Not so with this tune. Another jig I’ve just added has the Fnat as a passing note and I just blow thorough it just fine as F#.
I also play concertina, and that, of course, has an easy Fnat and that really makes this tune very interesting. I dug deeper and found the O’Neil’s version and they do indeed use the F#. On concertina I did my imitation ‘roll or cran’ of the F natural through the phrase and I think it will be useable, once I learn how to apply that on the chanter.
You are so right about just working out the hard parts, repetition after repetition. I’ve been working most of the year on upper hand triplets, particularly a tight abc. Again because I’ve played concertina for ten years more than the pipes, I tend to hear piping in a tight way, so a tune like The Groves Hornpipe with this passage:
Gd (3Bcd Gd (3Bcd | Fc (3ABc Fc (3ABc | Gd (3Bcd GdBc
becomes an even bigger challenge, it just sounds wrong to me to play it open on the pipes. At the moment, I hit it correct close to half the time. Same thing with Luck Penny, having heard the Fnat, it just sounds better.
I agree, it would be handy to have some specific challenges demonstrated in video.
I tried a few things this morning, and was surprised to discover that the cranned (or maybe “shake” is a better description) F I talked about above followed by an A roll is actually pretty easy, and even kind of nice.
I ended up with something like:
|:dBG GFG|dBG dBG|cA=F ~F3|~A3 cBA|
I don’t think I’d do it every time, though … and of course, I have a nice user-friendly F key. I’m holding it open. Alternatively I tried just tapping out three A’s which wasn’t awful, but wasn’t great either. I’d love to be able to do (3AcA c cBA there, but that’s way beyond me at this point.
Thanks for these ideas! Can’t wait to work on them.
Try this for the tricky bars: |cBG =F2A|D3 cBA|. Lift chanter off the knee while seeking the Fnat and hold the note longer than indicated. D3 as a cran. Sounds good and sits nicely.
In many tunes where a fiddler would roll F natural, he would put in an “E” first and then do a bend up to a note that’s not quite F natural, not quite F sharp. It worked for him!
That sequence G F G is essentially a place where one could do a G roll, no?
And the long F either the WC thing or as described use the index/middle semi-cran thing while holding open the F key. My chanter has the Long F key and it’s usually fairly easy to put Fs in tunes even in somewhat awkward places, but the ‘old guys’ would usually restructure the melody in such a way as to not require the F key.
I’m thinking of for example the reel that starts
DGGG DFFF (rolls on G, then F natural, on the fiddle)
where Matt Molloy on the flute plays
DGGG DEFG
using the flute’s short F key and avoiding doing a roll (or roll equivalent) on F natural.
) ]