Hey there,
I had a few questions about accordions. Does anyone know where you can find a D/C# box? Cost, etc? Also, is there much of a playing difference between a D/C# and a C#/D?
I’m somewhat interested in learning the box, and as I play the harmonica I thought it might be fun to play the D/C# box. Also, I terribly admire the music of Joe Cooley.
Any suggestions?
You sound like a Pom, if so you’d quickly find something suitable in the ‘Irish Post’, certainly Hob Goblin - on the internet would have something, as well.
In the USA try ‘the squeezebox’ .
i don’t think there are many Poms in South Bend…
Jim Coogan plays D/C# and he’d probably be most helpful. His website is
http://members.aol.com/jimattheboxofc/
I’m sure he’d be glad to talk about the differences and sell you a box if you wanted one.
Actually I think Jim Coogan plays a C#/D - the difference is important. (The outer row is the first of the pair.)
The advantage of having the main row on the outside is, I am told, that the outer row is generally slightly more powerful. The disadvantage would be finding a box in D/C#. I think you’d have to order a new one custom-built, or trust your luck in the search for a 2nd-hand box, which might take a long time.
C#/Ds are much more plentiful, as you probably know, even if they’re not so plentiful as B/Cs, which, with all the arrogance of a total beginner, I consider a perverse system (* ducks to avoid missiles thrown by Chris Laughlin and TeriK *).
If it’s a question of the sound, consider the Saltarelle Irish Bouëbe. According to info. at the www.buttonbox.com, it has “innovative features: the inside row operates the upper row of pads for a bigger sound” - plus (incredibly useful) a stop on the bass side to remove the thirds from chords, thereby allowing you to play basses against minor melodies.
If it’s a question of duplicating Cooley’s playing style exactly, well that’s another question. I thought he played a C#/D, but your question makes me think otherwise. Do you know for sure?
I can’t really tell you about the differences in playing between the 2 systems. If you’re playing on the outer row, I think that playing rolls might be a lot trickier. Mind you I also think that rolls usually sound pretty ghastly on the box - Cooley’s being a notable exception.
At any event I think contacting Jim Coogan is a good idea. You might also post your question to the irishbox group on yahoo ( http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/irishbox/ ) where there are people who know a lot more about the subject than me (I’m in the C#/D kindergarten at the moment).
Good luck
Steve
I’m pretty sure you’re incorrect here… Jim learnt to play in the days when D/C# was the preferred tuning stateside. He’s mentioned that he’s tried to switch to the more popular C#/D but he’s set in his ways. He’s also mentioned C#/D is easier on the wrist than D/C#.
anyway, ask him, he’ll be happy to tell you i’m sure.
I think Joe Derrane might play a D/C#.
what’s a pom??
A disparaging term for a British citizen.
Correct but Joe also played a D/D# Paulo customised box. You’d learn a great deal from reading about Tony Mc Mahon.
Actualy as a cold beginner to ‘Cooley style’ Irtrad squeeze box the place to start IS NOT the chromatic box but the Melodian since that is how Joe started. And if you think that kind of thing out of style then go listen to the recordings of Quinn, Connoly and Gannon etc ..
No it ain’t! Originating in Australia the term reffered to new arrivals from the UK who’s culinary customs included the humble spud which as you probably don’t know is not as common in the hot hot hot climate of Australia as it is in the cool/cold climate of western Europe.
So nowadays its like calling a US person a ‘Yank’.
Jim Coogan plays D/C# as does Joe Derrane. However, the more usual tuning currently popular is C#/D.
Cooley played a C#/D (or the Eb equivalent: D/D#).
The way ornaments are played on box is done differently depending on if your D row is on the inside or outside, especially rolls.
Playing a D/C# is like playing a one-row melodeon in D with an extra row to grab accidentals from. Playing a C#/D you’re more likely to integrate both rows into your playing.
If you’re looking for a stock, off the shelf, box you may have trouble finding a D/C#. If you’re ordering one to be built from scratch then most places will be happy to make you a D/C# (Castagnari, etc…).
-Brett
Absolutely correct about the word’s Australian origins. It’s still a disparaging term for a UK citizen, though, so I don’t see your disagreement. I myself don’t take much offence at being called a “Yank”, also a disparaging term (I level it at myself from time to time in good humor), but I do make note of its use and who’s using it.
just came across a french webside, http://perso.club-internet.fr/lgendrot/musiciens/musiciens.htm
if i liked to play a D/Cs box, wich is very rare these days, i’d need a teacher nearby in the first place, rather then trying to copy someone’s style. there’s video’s available on Cs/D and B/C boxes aswell, but i believe there’s non in the odd keys. once you’ve decided on a box, it’s hard to switch to another combination.
I went through this awhile back and ended up with a Hayden-style duet concertina instead.
However, in the process I learned about a guy named Billy McComisky that sells a fairly good (by all reports) entry-level box. He has them in B/C or D/C#.
I don’t have any contact info anymore.
Seems like they were about $450.
Have fun,
Doc
Here’s the old link with Billy’s contact info.
http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=16121&highlight=billy+mccomisky
Best,
Doc
However, in the process I learned about a guy named Billy McComisky that sells a fairly good (by all reports) entry-level box. He has them in B/C or D/C#.
This would be the Learner brand. They’re made in China to Billy’s specs and IMHO they’re the best value going in a student box, easily the equal of the entry-level Hohners or Weltmeisters (which cost twice as much). Two reeds per note (tuned wettish), 23 buttons, no thirds in the bass chords, thumbwheel-adjustable bass strap, finished in black (B/C) or red pearloid (C#/D). I started out on a B/C one and currently am playing one in C#/D. They aren’t available in D/C#, but I suppose you could go in and switch the reedblocks around if you really wanted to.
Here is a link I have never played (not that I play) on one but the prices are good http://www.irishdancemaster.com/accordion.html. 
You’re right about ‘pom’ being an Australian terms ofr recent arrivals from England. You’re also right about it being a very mild slang term with no serious derogatory overtones.
You’re probably not right about where it comes from. Early European migrants were overwhelmingly from England, Ireland and Scotland and all brought with them a love for the potato which has been an Australian staple since very early days. It’s only recently that pasta and rice have joined poatoes as major hot meal sources of starch. Slang terms for potatoes are spuds and murphys. Potaoes do pretty well in Australia. Australians adopted the recipes of their neighbours and relatives so the Scottish, Irish and Jewish parts of my extended family all ate much the same food and swapped recipes freely and often without much knowledge of where they came from originally. All branches were descended from 19th century immigrants so thoroughly assimilated.
Pom seems to be derived by rhyming slang from immigrant via pomegranite. Not exactly cuttingly insulting is it?
-I checked with Ivo Baldoni about the Baldoni four-voice Irish model configured D/C# and was quoted around 2400 USD. The inquiry was inspired by Joe Derrane’s astounding music on a D/C# instrument.
-Moving on, however, I like the B/C better and better and have developed an unhealthy yen for a Connemara III like John Williams’ box. A person has to dream.
Brian
Or possibly Prisoner of (His/Her) Majesty.
It’s only insulting to me if it’s intended to be.
I’ve never heard that suggestion. It looked quite plausible for a minute or two until I reflected on who would have used it originally? In convict days, almost everybody arrived from Britain.
Here is a possibility though. Perhaps the first few generations of Australian-born free men and women referred to new arrivals this way. The problem here is that, after a couple of decades, quite a few new arrivals would not have been convicts. Still, the meaning could easily have morphed into it’s current shape over the last two centuries.
It’s not a term I’d use often, if at all, but it’s not a term I’d avoid because of insulting overtones. I might use it in ‘quotes’ when mocking xenophobic Australians.