Copley, Hamilton, Ormiston.

Irish Flute
1

Hi Folks,
can anyone offer advice on the above flutes. I’m new to flutes, I’ve only been playing since early July on what I assume, given the price, is a Pakistani flute. It seems fine, I can get all the notes up to high B and it is’nt noticeably out of tune, the only real problem I’m having is running out of air on fast tunes but I expected that. I’ve been in contact with Hammy Hamilton and George Ormiston and I’ve tried to contact Dave Copley, so far without sucess but I’ll keep trying. If anyone can give me any comparisons on the above flutes bearing in mind I’m beginner I’d be grateful.

Thanks in advance, Mac.

[ This Message was edited by: MacEachain on 2002-08-15 20:16 ]

2

Wow, that’s odd that you haven’t been able to get a hold of Dave Copley, he’s usually Mr. Punctual. How long have you been trying to contact him?

As far as your question is concerned, I don’t want to sound like a broken record, so rather than give my opinions again, I’ll suggest you use the search function to comb the archives for past discussions on the same topic. Try searching just “Hamilton”, “Copley”, and “Ormiston” you ought to find plenty of feedback and some comparisons on these flutes.

Have fun.

Loren

3

I’ve just had word that Dave Copley is out of town for a couple of weeks, not sure if he’ll have access to the internet and or phone, so this would explain why he hasn’t gotten back to you I should think.

Having dealt with Dave on numerous occasions over the last year, I can assure you that under normal circustances he is extremely good about returning e-mail and phone calls promptly, so I’m quite sure he’ll be in contact as soon as he is able.

Loren

4

Hi Loren,

thanks for the reply, I’d already searched the forum,it seems like Hamilton - good but takes a lot of air, Ormiston - good but quiet and Copley - good ? I was hoping to hear from someone who had owned all three. I thought Dave Copley might be on vacation or somthing. I’m not having much luck in that respect, I was trying to get in touch with Phil Hardy but he’s on vacation at the moment. You might consider that lucky though!!

Cheers, Mac

5

On 2002-08-16 17:34, MacEachain wrote:
I’m not having much luck in that respect, I was trying to get in touch with Phil Hardy but he’s on vacation at the moment. You might consider that lucky though!!

Cheers, Mac

LOL!!! Yeah, you got that right!!

As far as the flutes are concerned: I owned a Copley (hated to give it up, but I had to sacrifice for the Olwell), and I’ve played a Hamilton. I found the Copley much easier to lip and easier to fill - in fact it was the easiest flute I’ve ever played, and with excellent volume as well.

I think for someone without a really strong embouchure, the Copley would be very difficult to beat: It sounds great, is very easy to play, has a good flexibility of tone, is competitively priced, and is very well made.

Hammy’s flutes are louder and capable of an even more agressive tone, but you’ve got to have a better embouchure to get the best out them, and they certainly require more wind to really keep 'em going. Hammy’s flutes are very handsome - particularly masculine looking flutes if you ask me, and I count that as a good thing.

Both flutes are well balanced, however personally I prefer the two-piece Rudall Style body section on the Copley, rather than the single Pratten style body section that is Hammy’s standard. I just find it’s way more comfortable to be able to rotate the top and bottom sections in different directions, but then I have some shoulder problems, so that factors in for me.

Honestly, I’d consider the climate a where you live and where the maker lives. I hate to say it, but I’ve experienced problems with wooden whistles that were manufactured in a climate with significantly higher humidity than I have. I’ve heard similar things from flute owners, so at the very least, I’d check with the maker and find out what RH he seasons his wood to, and at least consider that in your decision.

Good luck!

Loren

6

Loren,

I’d noticed on some of the post’s, problems with flutes made in Ireland cracking when sent to the USA.It might not be such a problem with flutes coming the other way.
I may still be tempted to go for a Copley, in the meantime it’s looking like an Ormiston. Have you any idea of Dave Copley’s waiting list and what the deposit is likley to be or do you pay full price up front? these 2 point’s would affect my decision, particularily the payment.

Thanks Again, much appreciated, Mac.

7

I think you’re right, going from wet to dry would more likely cause major problems than the other way around.

I really don’t want to speak for Dave regarding waiting times or payment arrangements…Perhaps someone who’s ordered from him recently could tell you what Dave told them regarding those issues. seems to me everytime I’ve spoken with Dave his waiting list was fairly short, MUCH less than a year.

Can anyone help Mac out here with some recent info?

Loren

8

On 2002-08-16 19:23, MacEachain wrote:
Loren,

I’d noticed on some of the post’s, problems with flutes made in Ireland cracking when sent to the USA.It might not be such a problem with flutes coming the other way.

I’ve sent a number of flutes from China to the US, and have sent four to the US from China. Never had a problem with cracking. Just wrap and seal the flute pieces in a ziplock and make sure the flute is well padded in the box. Should be absolutely no problem, based on my humble experience.

9

On 2002-08-16 19:23, MacEachain wrote:
… Have you any idea of Dave Copley’s waiting list and what the deposit is likley to be or do you pay full price up front? these 2 point’s would affect my decision, particularily the payment…

Don’t know about Dave’s current waiting list, but when I ordered from him roughly a year ago, I gave him my Visa number at the time I placed the order. However, he did not process the charge until a day or two before he shipped the flute. Hope this helps.

10

We’re not talking about cracking during transit G., we’re talking about cracks occurring after the flute arrives - weeks, months, a year later - as the wood loses moisture and contracts.

Loren

11

Hi Folks,

thanks for your information, I appreciate it,Loren, you were right about Dave Copley being out of town,I got an e-mail from him as soon as he got home, he said that there should’nt be a problem sending a flute as regards temperature/humidity but that he normally advises UK customers to get a flute locally as there’s customs duty to pay, and also the cost of shipping should the instrument be sent back for repairs etc. I’m probably going to go for an Ormiston although Sam Murray is only 40 miles away and I might call with him, I’m aware of the likley problems with Sam though. I’ll let you know when I decide.

Thanks again, Mac

12

I called Mr. Copley a couple of months ago, and at that time the waiting list was 6 months.

Heather

13

I put my name on the copley waiting list about a month ago. He said I should have my keyless blackwood d by christmas. It will be my first flute. (I play low D whistle.) Can some people reassure me that this is probably the best choice for a beginner fluteist who knows FOR SURE that he will keep with it and play? I’m going to avoid going the polymer route.(I dont want to hear any suggestions about getting other flutes, I would just like your opinion about Copleys.) Has anybody had any bad experiences with them? Thanks, William

[ This Message was edited by: theweirdscotsman on 2002-09-07 20:48 ]

14

Based on my passion for Irish trad music, having studied my way through many Flute Forum readings, added together with the fact that I do have some experience playing concert flutes, I took the plunge and purchased a highly recommended Copley flute from a board member. I have to say that for me, this was a life-altering experience. To me, this flute is sublime ~ it gives me everything I ask of it, and more. It is extremely easy to play, expressive as anyone could possibly wish ~ I have literally brought myself to tears playing An Ghaoth Aneas and Cait Ni Dhuibhir ~ and NOT out of frustration! :slight_smile: I’ve had no problems with the hole sizes or spacing, and find the emboucher just right for me.
Anyway, that’s my review. I’ve not played any other keyless flutes, but as satisfied as I am with my Copley, why should I? I have my Haynes silver flute, and the Copley, so I save my acquisition disorder for my whistles!!! ha

15

Today I was playing my Copley Blackwood with silver tuning slide out in our garden while I watched my kids playing. I only know a handful of tunes and have been playing over a year. Today I slowed it down a pace. I was closing my eyes, really trying to focus on creating as nice a tone as I can. Let me say I was truly amazed at the beauty of my Copley’s tone and have remained as impressed as the day I received it at it’s amazing range of tonal colors. I can make it sharp and barking to soft and pure. It is an amazing flute and I think you made a great choice.

Since I have received the Flute Obsession CD, I have been dreaming of getting a keyed flute. I am having a hard time trying to justify another purchase knowing Copley has a great deal on adding keys. I believe this is truly all the flute I will ever need. I am planning on playing the rest of my life and getting as good as possible. The only way I can justify a different maker for a keyed flute is for the sake of variety and that is about it. I would like to try to get a hold of a large holed Rudall and Rose with 6 or 8 keys. Right now it’s down to Olwell or Noy. It’s at least another year off before I even make the order.

Learning the flute is a big commitment and very challenging. I must admit that several times when I picked up the Copley I could not get a decent note out of it. Other times It has played beautifully. Since the flute didn’t change at all between these times I know it was 100% me.

It can be so frustrating at times and you may want to blame your flute. I know I blamed my Olwell Bamboo (first flute) when I first started. I actually stashed it away. I didn’t even want to offer it for sale because I thought it was so bad. If anyone is interested I can expound on the flight characteristics of an Olwell bamboo. Believe me I have first hand experience. I never posted my true opinions about it knowing that the Olwell worshipers on the board would have flamed me to death. Recently I picked it up and it played great! I played an entire tune without losing the tone once, something I could never do before.

The moral to this story is that if the Copley is your first flute you have a rocky road ahead but it’s worth it. It’s like a marriage.

Honeymoon…
Wow I can’t believe how beautiful she is…I must be the luckiest guy on the planet.

Honeymoon is over…
Man this is tuff…I wonder if a different one would be easier.

Honeymoon is way over…
Where in the @#&%*! did this rash come from! (if your Loren) :roll:

Your commitment starts paying off…
Once in a while you gain insight into how great it can be.

Over the hump…
This is wonderful…and too think there were times I was going to give up.

From what I have heard every flute has a break in period but nothing like your very first flute. If you find (as I have) that you are constantly improving and you start liking your flute more and more…than you have made the right choice. I think you made the right choice. I have started to become a little annoyed with people referring to the Copley as a beginner flute. I obviously feel it is much more than that. But those who have played more flutes than I say it is easy to play…so be it. The range of expression I have witnessed on this flute as well as the volume makes me think it’s a flute for the long haul.

nuff said,

Good luck,

  • Craig