Baritone drone reed

Hey can anyone help me with this: I can get my drones tuned up wonderfully; but when I squeeze a little harder to reach the upper octive, the baritone reed goes a little wacky. I tried getting David Daye synthetic reeds, but it is still going out of tune in the upper octive. I tried adding some blue tac - but still nothing… Any ideas ???

Thanks!

Make sure you’re drone tongues are facing downwards. You could also mess with the bridle position and blue-tack ration. Getting the drones set to the right pressure always takes a bit of work but once you get them set you can pretty much ignore them. I have Childress synthetic reeds in my B set and I haven’t touched them in about two years but it did take some effort to get that balance to the right place. I have cane/brass reeds in my D set and they are getting there, but still need a bit of tweaking. Make sure your chanter reed isn’t too stiff. I had that problem for awhile.

Thanks for the tip - can’t wait to try it once I get done with work! :thumbsup:

Even the best drone reed, no matter how it’s constructed, must be adjusted / matched to the acoustic length and desired frequency of the note you want it to sound.

For the sake of argument let’s say the reed is basically OK, properly made, and not excessively stiff/weak/open/closed/leaky etc. - those are all other issues to be dealt with. My experience is that the reed/drone combination tends to seek the resonant frequency of the bore, determined by what I call the ‘acoustic length’, as pressure increases. At lower pressures the drone quill’s resonance behavior seems stronger, at higher pressures the influence of the reed lessens with respect to the acoustic column. Since reed and bore are a coupled system, the resulting pitch depends on both. Thus you can sharpen a drone either by pushing in the drone slide, or by sharpening the crow of the quill (within limits, of course).

Thus if the drone is drifting sharp under pressure, it suggests that the ‘natural’ note for that drone position is indeed sharp of your desired pitch, and the drone quill is dragging the coupled system flat. Sharpening the quill frequency by moving the bridle upwards or removing weight, and pulling the drone slide out a bit, may match the two resonances better and stabilize the drone.

Sometimes the drone sinks a bit under pressure - usually shutting off soon afterwards. This indicates that the acoustic column would prefer to be flatter - in this case lowering the crow of the quill and pushing the drone slide in a bit may do the trick.

Ideally the drones should be sounding clearly at a range of pitch from E1 (typically the lowest pressure note on a chanter) to A2 and above, and ideally you should be able to ‘flick’ the individual drones on and off with your fingertips while sounding the chanter. Getting the quills pressure balanced involves adjusting the bridles, tongue elevation, tongue weight, and stiffness of the base of the tongue - there are lots of variables so getting it right can take a bit of time.

A quill can be sharpened in pitch by: raising the bridle; scraping the top of the tongue or removing wax; heat-setting the tongue a little lower to the body of the quill. It can be lowered in pitch by lowering the bridle, adding wax, springing the tongue outwards a little, or scraping the bottom of the tongue near the bridle. Loose bridles can cause a quill to flatten and misbehave, so check and tighten your bridles if necessary when starting to diagnose things. All of these principles apply to composite reeds with plastic, wooden, or cane tongues, as well as traditional cane or elder quills. Sometimes a reed seems to defy logic and resist the principles above - usually this indicates some other mismatch, a leak, or a quill that is so seriously too flat or sharp that secondary effects are dominating, in which case you need to get things “close to sane” before fine-tuning the stability.

It may interest you to know that the baritone drone seems to be the one that is hardest to get stable on many sets.

Hope that helps someone…

Bill

As usual Bill, it’s a pleasure reading your comments !!! :smiley:

Great info Bill! That’s the kind of stuff that makes C&F an invaluable resource.

The one option billh does not mention to sharpen a reed’s pitch is to exchange it for a slightly smaller diameter reed. Some drone designs can be fussy. A slightly smaller or larger diameter reed may more optimally match the needs a drone better than the one which is problematic. You can also somewhat aid the overall balance of all three drones by changing a too loud a drone reed with one smaller in diameter. There is an optimal reed diameter for each drone. A slightly smaller or larger diameter reed can be made to work in a particular pipe but they can have problems due to the mismatch. A reed of optimal diameter for a particular pipe will need less fussing with to work well, than a size a bit too large or small in diameter.

Ted and Bill,

Is it a general rule of thumb that the id of the drone reed should not exceed the diameter of the drone bore?

If it is, it’s not one that I personally find useful. In fact most drone quills on flat sets seem to be slightly larger in inner diameter than the first joint of the drone, in my experience. Ted may have different insights on that - no doubt it depends on the design.

Ted’s point about trying different quill diameters is a good one though, glad you brought it up Ted!

Bill

I agree with Bill. In general the i.d. should be close to the dia. of the first joint of the drone’s bore. I have found some drones, particularly in flat sets, that like a slightly larger i.d. in the reed than the drone’s i.d.. The best way to find out is to try out different diameter reeds in a particular pipe and see what works best. I have several dozen cane drone reeds of different diameters and lengths, that I use when trying to fit a reed to a particular drone. For me, it is best to have the drones in hand when fitting a set of drone reeds. I can balance the overall drone sound, as well as finding an optimal reed for each drone. A well set up set of cane drone reeds will need almost no adjustment after a couple of weeks of “break in” time, and many find that they are as rock-solid as the composite reeds. They certainly work in a much wider humidity and temperature enviroments than cane double beating reeds. They can have trouble in very low humidity. They take no more or less time to adjust than the composite reeds. The real advantage is the richer tone of a well set up drones with cane or elder. The manufactured reeds may produce a desired note, but often without the richness available from the old fashioned cane or elder. I re-reeded Joey Abarta’s drones with cane a few months ago and the difference in tone was remarkable. Many pipe maker’s don’t even offer cane drone reeds as an option. Some have never tried to make cane reeds. There is a myth around that cane reeds require more set-up time and are more touchy to keep going than composites. I find this not to be true at all. Brad Angus just told me that he reciently re-reeded a few Rogge sets with cane reeds and the owners were very pleased. The synthetic reeds he replaced lacked the rich drone sound he got with cane reeds.
I have never seen or tried goose feather quills, hence the name quills applied to drone reeds. Anyone with experience with them?

Thanks Bill and Ted! Just when you think you’re starting to understand something, the more you realize you don’t! :confused: