The most important thing about pipes is that , even when they are going great guns , they are still hard to play .
Agreed Tom, but what does "Aw7zcbre mean?
Czech for abracadabra?
Dionys
new to computors,
[ This Message was edited by: tok on 2003-01-05 23:37 ]
Darn…I thought maybe I could start editing your posts, maybe change things around a little, maybe create some chaos for the piper, but nay!
naah , impossible 
. Aw7czrbre = see zebra.. lol naahh. tok.
We pipers , and pipemakers, do the impossible every day .
n all , .
[ This Message was edited by: tok on 2003-01-06 02:22 ]
On 2003-01-05 20:39, tok wrote:
The most important thing about pipes is that , even when they are going great guns , they are still hard to play .
Don’t know exactly what you are getting at but don’t agree, when the pipes are going well they are a breeze to play.
I have been playing for 9 months and rarely play any tune without flaw but nonetheless I am feeling real comfort with my playing. Peter… at what point can I expect the pipes to be a breeze to play??
P.S. Dont tell me 21 years… just curious as to your personal experience …let us limit the experience to mastery of the chanter alone.
I don’t know, are you ever there I wonder. I was just thinking I was playing tunes last night and the only effort I had to put in was ignoring the bouzouki player who joined uninvited and tuensd a quarter of a tone sharp from the pipes. Lovely.
I don’t know what the original statement exactly wanted to say, but first you should assume driving the instrument should be no effort, getting the sound and the airflow going should not take up any energy at all, so you can concentrate on the music. Then the playing itself, you’ll have to get comfortable with your music at teh level you are at. Takes different people longer or shorter. Mastery of the chanter, well you can do that on different levels too but you play the pipes so you need the whole lot going. Not just the chanter otherwise you may as well change to the flute.
Peter , I think I was trying to express that , It can be easy to take a good thing for granted , in that yes , the pipes can , and should be , a breeze to play , but often they are not .
I heard Brian McNamara make a telling comment when he was adjudicating the All-Ireland Adult piping competition (no less!) a few years ago: “At this level you shouldn’t still be fighting against the pipes, you should have complete control of them”.
Now pardon me while I scoot off home and put on my judoka gear and see what this week’s weather has done to my chanter reed.
I’m not sure about all this pipes being easy to play stuff. I read an interview with Ronan Browne once and he also said he found them very easy to play. I think it’s a bit patronising! There are different levels, pipes can be for instance easy to blow but that does not necessarily make them easy or desirable to play. Some pipers are lucky to have good pipes , others not. I also disagree with Peters view that if you haven’t got everything going you might as well swap to the flute! I have heard many pipers with everything going, no mistakes, triplets all nice, tasteful regs, drones ect, but no music. Ive heard pipers just with a chanter produce more inspirational stuff than many well known “pipers”! As for the All Ireland, it’s a complete load of tosh! I entered twice. The first time Brian MacNammarra beat me. Fair play to him! The second time I had him beaten up by a couple of likely lads just before and I won! But seriously, it’s useless, the format, at least in my day, was play a jig, a reel, a hornpipe and a slow air. The trouble is there is no room for musical dynamics because you can only play each tune once. Thus, everyone plays the same really long tunes like the freize britches, the groves hornpipe and colonel frazer , just to be up there long enough. Also, the result is simply ONE persons opinion, and how valid a judgement can that really be?
Well said. Competitions to judge who does what best! Bag O’ Sh**e!!!
I don’t think much of competitions myself, but I think that the valid point that Brian was making was that you won’t be able to get much expression out of them if you’re struggling with them rather than using them like a voice as an extension of yourself.
On 2003-01-07 16:32, brendan ring wrote:
I’m not sure about all this pipes being easy to play stuff. I read an interview with Ronan Browne once and he also said he found them very easy to play. I think it’s a bit patronising! […]
I have heard many pipers with everything going, no mistakes, triplets all nice, tasteful regs, drones ect, but no music. Ive heard pipers just with a chanter produce more inspirational stuff than many well known “pipers”!
Breandan, you ARE bit cranky.
I don’t think it’s patronising, the pipes are like any other instrument, once you learn to play them properly. All that mystique about the pipes being the most complex and difficulat instrumet you can pick is rubbish.
Personally I find the fiddle much harder to play.
I can fully agree with your second point but the point I was trying to make initially was that once you take up the pipes, you learn to play the chanter, the drones with it and then there’s the reg to deal with, they come in the package and there’s always a challenge to be met after you have the one thing going, if you don’t intend to bother with the rest of the set you may as well not get it. To me one of the main attractions of the pipes is the mix of drones and chanter [and maybe a bit of regs thrown in for good measure]wasn’t that why they were the ‘Union’ pipes.
Yes Peter
I DID sound a bit cranky! Sorry. Although having had a couple of bad sets in my time I still think that the instrument makes a difference, but I take your point. I agree that the whole instrument should be played and I think that this is evidenced by any recordings I have made, some might even think I play too much of the whole instrument! I think what I was trying to say is that so much piping that is put up there as being good is, to my ears, mechanical, formulaic and totally predictable. On a musical level I would rather hear something musical and interesting on a solo chanter than a competent dirge on a full set. A properly tuned full set is a joyful sound ,but that sound needs to be manipulated with the creative artistic integrity it deserves. Once again, my apologies for my earlier cranky ranting but who else can I rant to except you guys!
Brendan
Everything is relative especially pipes and piping…
I think we fully agree Breandan, I listen to very few pipers these days and we’re back to my initial point, i.e. that playing the pipes should be fun and it should not be hindered by the struggle with the instrument so many have to put up with.
For the sake of debate, a wee spanner to throw in here is that some sets are designed to play with easy pressure, while some are at their best when the reeds are quite a hard squeeze.
Living in Scotland as I do at the present time, I bump into many Highland pipers, even some who play uilleann pipes. They really like to play with things set up hard. I’ve picked up their instruments and had a go and found it a struggle, but that’s because of what I’m used to…and they are used to something needing a bit more ooomph.
And I’ve noticed that some makers produce an instrument whose reeds need a bit more air to get the best from them.
I’d agree with Peter’s comments in the past that lots of effort pumping air detracts from the player’s musicality, but that doesn’t mean to say it can’t be done. One of these Highland pipers has played with Paddy Keenan in the past and said that paddy’s set-up was also a hard enough squeeze.
Just depends how you want to approach it!
Boyd
Back in the late 80’s, Tim Britton once told me that Jerry O’Sullivan played with such hard bag pressure and such stiff reeds, that Jerry’s face would turn red from such strenuous effort, and that his reeds looked like a couple of shingles tied together. He said that Jerry preferred the greater resistance. I certainly wouldn’t, but I may not know what the better pipers need it for…they may have their own good reasons.