I’m considering buying a sweetheart 10-hole or keyed whistle, but am having trouble finding reviews or sound files for them. I used to play flute, but now since I’m working, I’ve found I don’t have the time to keep up my embouchure and now I’m more of a flute collector instead of a flute player. If I buy a whistle, I’d like it to be chromatic or at least mostly, as it can be challenging playing hymns when your primarily converting to keys G or D. I’m also curious if there are other sellers out there that market partial to fully chromatic whistles, that are recommended. Thanks for the help.
I would suggest getting a set of Freeman tweaked Generations. Chromatic whistles are not really as useful as you might think. They have to make more compromises and they become cluttered, making them less usable.
All whistles are ‘partial to fully chromatic’. Partially for everyone, and fully (if not necessarily particularly usefully!) for the more advanced player. So, yes, whistle sets may well be a more practical solution. Or perhaps a couple of recorders, which are more usefully chromatic but don’t play like whistles. Would I go for a 10-hole design or think it any more a substitute for standard whistles than a recorder? Personally no, because you’re messing with the fundamental fingering layout in a counter-intuitive way, but guess I might just consider a simple-system keyed version if I really felt the need…
Kind of ironic, really, vis a vis the keywork and whistle chromaticity angle, that he’s playing that whistolo left-hand-down. He won’t be able access the G# or D# keys at all without some very awkward hand movement and the trill keys ordinarily for the right hand will be difficult to reach with the left. And it’s these keys that are the whole point of buying a piccolo and having a maker fashion a whistle head for the thing in the first place!
After looking around, I’m thinking of going the multiple whistle route, but would ideally want just 2 whistles, possibly 3 being the max. However, I’m wondering which keys would compliment each other as I know some notes can be cross fingered, I’m ignoring the possibility of half-holing for this comparison. I like the low whistles more than the high whistles, I was thinking low D & Eb would cover most things, but curious on your guys thoughts as I’m used to playing a keyed flute. Thanks again for the input, really appreciate it.
Whistles are for all intents and purposes a diatonic instrument. I’d advise forgetting about cross-fingerings and start building your whistle collection. That’s what I’m in the process of doing. My church plays in lots of keys and I’ve got a long list…
Surprisingly few, because whistles generally don’t respond well to forked fingerings. You’ve really just got C nat and some trial-and-error second-octave notes, with some whistles also producing a decent first-octave Bb…
I’m ignoring the possibility of half-holing for this comparison.
In which case you’re going to be disappointed!
This is the second thread this week conjecturing about ‘chromatic’ whistles, ‘extra holes’ etc. I used to play a bit of clarinet (still have one somewhere) and briefly dabbled with soprano sax, tons of keys, holes, fully chromatic etc etc. But the thing I love about the whistle is the basic simplicity and purity of it’s design, it’s a pipe with six holes in it, yet in the right hands it can produce incredibly beautiful and expressive music.
Surprisingly few, because whistles generally don’t respond well to forked fingerings
True up to a point but it depends on the design of the whistle in question. I have a number of 19th century French conical whistles that that seem to have been designed to achieve a full complement of chromatic notes using forked fingering.
I have a few French Conical whistles which are good and a few that are the same company
(Atlas) that are terrible.
My favourite ones are in C#/b ie. Seamus Ennis pitch.
If I were looking for a conical keyed whistle I would consider a piccolo (antique simple system) and ask a maker to make a fipple mouthpiece.
May not be easy to find the right maker but I have seen that Roy McManus made such a fipple for a Bb band flute.
After taking a look at my options/price, I’m thinking of getting a tenor recorder, however, I have no idea which one to get, I’m thinking the yahama YRT-304B ii might be a good place to start. In the past I wouldn’t even consider a recorder, since all that comes to mind are the cheap devices given to grade schools. I’m curious if anyone has any experience in this and would have any advice for someone new to the recorder market, thanks for the input so far guys, really appreciate it.
If the recorder is the way you want to go then, IMO, the Yamaha YRT-304B is a good place to start. ( I have a few of them, both the older YRT-302 model and the more recent 304 versions, sitting around the house here.) Many players these days might also finish with the Yamaha tenor as well. It’s really a decent recorder. The Yamaha tenor is a well designed instrument. It is moderately priced overall and a bargain compared to a decent wooden tenor. It plays nicely. It sounds nice as well. It never needs re-voicing. And it is rugged enough for most players. The keys are the only iffy bit. Still the keys work well enough and they are replaceable should they ever break. I am not a serious recorder player - more of a casual folk player really. I do have a decent assortment of recorders accumulated over the years but I play the Yamaha 300 recorders most frequently. The tenor is probably my favorite of the whole Yamaha line. Other recorder players here will have their own opinions and experience to share I am sure.
But if the voice, the dynamics and the crispness of a whistle is what you want then the advice already offered to build up a set of whistles in various keys is the way to go. Recorders have their well established place in music but they just don’t play like whistles. Which whistles you would choose is up to you. That’s a personal choice. Some, like myself, prefer to stick with whistles from a single maker. Others might favor a different maker for each key. There’s probably no need to get a large number of keys right at the start. You can start with a couple whistles and add additional keys as you see the need for them. Which keys you start with and which keys you add over time is strictly dependent on the repertoire you are playing. A lot of us have traveled down that road. We’ve got the bags full of whistles to show for it as well. Which keys we use most may or be germane to what you will require on your own journey.
In the interest of full disclosure I have also looked into the 10 hole whistle design too. The 10 hole layout is workable in the sense that you will get good solid notes across the scale from the dedicated holes - the C natural is still half-holed or cross fingered on the layout I use. The difficult part is the position of the additional four holes. Keeping those holes covered while playing can be a challenge. The first 10 hole instrument I acquired was a Bb fife and that fingering works well enough for my hands in that pitch. But I guess I don’t easily think about music in terms revolving around a Bb scale. So I then made a few whistle bodies in other pitches to see how the hole scheme worked out ergonomically. A and G bodies worked out OK. Anything higher pitched than the Bb seemed too cramped. Anything pitched lower than F was too spread out for my hands - the pinkie holes were the hard part. So while I do think a chromatic whistle has possibilities, the execution of building one may present some difficulties. Incorporating a whistle head on a piccolo body works better I think if you don’t mind the machinery of the keys.
Enjoy the music.
Feadoggie
It’s surprising what a good player can overcome. I saw Cathal McConnell playing a rather chromatic tune on an ordinary (right-handed) keyed flute. He plays left-handed.
That guy gets a pretty darn good whistle sound out of that hybrid piccolo-thing!
Since Ralph Sweet started out as a fife maker, I’m guessing that this 10-hole whistle has the same hole layout as a 10-hole fife.
I have a nice 10-hole fife on loan now. It’s very strange having to use both thumbs and both little fingers!
Thumbs: F natural and B flat
Little fingers: D sharp and G sharp
There’s more than one fingering schema for chromatic fifes. There are two basic designs in my experience. Both have been used in various whistle offerings.
The schema promoted in Skip Healy’s 10 hole fifes leaves the C natural note to be half-holed (in D whistle scale terms). All other notes get a dedicated hole. That sounds like the layout you have there. Healy even makes D flutes with this layout. It is a fairly intuitive layout IMO. I like that layout personally. Each note sounds clear and strong. If you can keep the thumbs and pinkies in place the instrument can be played like a regular 6 hole diatonic instrument. I think this layout grew out of refinement of the McDonagh chromatic fifes from the 1960’s.
The other layout you’ll run into is the Joseph Mourneault (?) layout which uses double holes (like the lower holes on a recorder) at the TH3 position to free up the thumb for a C natural hole. This is sometimes called the “French Fife” layout I believe. That is what I’ve seen used on un-keyed Sweetheart chromatic whistles. Other makers have promoted it as well. I think it has an advantage in that the thumb of the upper hand falls in a more natural position on the back of the tube. You will also sometimes see the double hole treatment used with the lower hand for the Fnat/F# notes. It’s a subjective call whether the double holes allow playing with the “normal” whistle style and ornaments.
Variations beyond those are sometimes seen but would be more obscure I think. Early McDonagh/Seaman fifes come to mind. And of course the baroque recorder is a 10 hole layout as well.
Some of the pieces I have heard played by fifers (Skip Healy included) on these chromatic instruments can be just stunning.
Feadoggie
More natural than for Bb, perhaps, but still not necessarily ‘natural’ (which, for me on an end-blown instrument, means above T1)?
And of course the baroque recorder is a 10 hole layout as well.
Depends whether you’re talking baroque as a historical period or a fingering system. Most original (historical) baroque recorders had single holes for B3 and B4, though there are some with double B3, B4 and even T3, negating Carl Dolmetsch’s belief that he’d invented them! (See Edgar Hunt, The Recorder and its Music, p138 in my 1977 revised edition.)
Yes! The fife I was loaned is a Skip Healy 10-hole fife.
The Healy site has a fingering chart for their 10-hole fifes which shows the thumbs staying on except when needed (analogous to closed keys on a flute).
The lower-hand little finger is up until you get to G.
Seems that the upper-hand little finger has to be kept open most of the time.
http://www.skiphealy.com/files/10-Hole%20Flute%20Fingering%20Chart.pdf
That’s one cracker of a little tooter, isn’t it? 
I had several of them in Bb, consecutive serial numbers even, at one point. The fife line never materialized. 
Sold most of them. But I still have one. I’ve got a number of fifes, mostly traditional designs, but the Healy is my favorite player.
Yeah, I do remember what the fingering chart describes. And it makes sense for sure. However … Experiment a little and you might find that you can cheat a bit. The venting with just the six holes for the diatonic scale is pretty good. But … I recall that Healy offered three designs using different hole sizes. Mine has the bigger holes. So I guess one should stick to the fingering chart otherwise.
It is a fun instrument. 
One thing that struck me when I first received the Healys was how similar the construction is to an Abell whistle. I wondered if an Abell whistle head could be fit to the Healy body. Alas, I have not been Abell to try that myself. I don’t own one. Anybody else tried that Frankenstein combination?
Feadoggie