Air requirement question

Whistle
1

As many of you know, I am fairly new to the whistle, so I’m still figuring our the terminology. I’ve read about some whistles having a high air requirement. I guess I read that as meaning that it requires you to blow hard and use more air. I own a Dixon sop. D, a Clarke Sweetone sop. D and Sweetone sop. C which all seem to require hardly any air. Maybe these have low air requirements, so I probably don’t know what a high air requirement whistle is really like. I play clarinet sometimes, so when I switch to these whistles, I have to take a minute to reaccustom myself to such small air requirements.

Or is the term describing the air requirement to jump to the higher octave. I guess that it makes sense that some people would want less air to make the jump.

Does the air requirement contribute to the breathiness of instrument? I love the Sweetones’ breathiness in the low octave but it may be a bit much in the higher. The Dixon sounds breathy enough in the upper octave for my tastes but a little to pure in the lower octave. Does anyone have a recommendation for a quality high d for less than $300 that has a breathy sound (but not as much breathiness as the Sweetone)?

Thanks for the help and recommentations! :slight_smile:

picardy

2

To me, saying a whistle requires lots of air means you have resist the urge to just blow hard, you have to control your breathing and ‘budget’ the air that comes out. You can’t just blow freely or you will literally run out of air. Some people like that, some people don’t. Clarke originals and shaws come to mind…

Does anyone have a recommendation for a quality high d for less than $300 that has a breathy sound (but not as much breathiness as the Sweetone)?

Clarke original. Great whistle. And you can send the other $290 to me. I won’t mind one bit.

3

Hey Cran!

I’m used to playing an instrument that only improves the more money you pay for it! Is the Clarke original similar in sound to the Sweetone? The reason I quoted $300 is in case there is a really fine breathy instrument out there. I’ve got a cd with Abell on it and it seems to have a nice breathy tone. Some people may think I shouldn’t be getting an expensive instrument yet, but my clarinet background has helped me pick up the whistle fairly quickly. (Plus, the Sweetone kind of looks like a toy. Non-whistle players see it and kind of give that “Awe, how cute” look.) Speaking of clarinet, someone was playing my Dixon at session the other day, and from the other room it sounded like a clarinet in the lower register. Maybe my ear for the Dixon has not been refined yet!

Should I make the check out to Mrs. Cranberry? :slight_smile:

picardy

4

I’m used to playing an instrument that only improves the more money you pay for it!

A lot of what you pay for in higher-end whistles is the wood, or the artistic craftmanship. There are some good $300 whistles out there. Don’t let anybody lie to you. But there are also some good $50 whistles out there. And $25 whistles out there. Keep in mind, I only own 2 whistles ‘worth’ more than fifty dollars, though. And everything I say should always be taken with a box of salt.

Is the Clarke original similar in sound to the Sweetone?

I would say no. The fipple parts are entirely differenent. The Sweetone is made of plastic (obviously) and has a sort of ‘buzzy’ sound, which I don’t really like. It has a single blade (ramp) that produces the sound. The Clarke Original has a combination wood/metal mouthpiece, which gives a better tone IMHO. And the ramp is bent down the middle, which actually produces sound in 2 places. I like the original Clarke better than the Sweetone. Last time I checked, they had unpainted Clarke originals on sale at the whistle shop. You can also get them tweaked by Thom Larson which I hear makes a really good whistle, but I don’t have one…yet.

The reason I quoted $300 is in case there is a really fine breathy instrument out there. I’ve got a cd with Abell on it and it seems to have a nice breathy tone. Some people may think I shouldn’t be getting an expensive instrument yet, but my clarinet background has helped me pick up the whistle fairly quickly.

I think it’s official that everybody who plays whistle also plays clarinet, LOL.

(Plus, the Sweetone kind of looks like a toy. Non-whistle players see it and kind of give that “Awe, how cute” look.)

They have black and natural (silver) Sweetones, which aren’t nearly as toy-ish. I still very much want a bright yellow one, though.

Should I make the check out to Mrs. Cranberry?

Please do that. Or Anastasia Beaverhousen. Whichever you prefer. I bet I’d have a helluva hard time getting it cashed, though. :stuck_out_tongue:

P.S. Sorry I dissected your post in so many places. I didn’t notice it until I hit preview.

5

Mack Hoovers whistles are some that I would classify as having low air requirements. Whenever I go over there he has me try out different whistles. Most of his Whistes take very little air. And at least for me, it is hard to control them… I often overblow the 3rd octave without trying.

My usual whistle, (one I can control) the “Thing that should not be” has a Susato Top (low whistle type). I would say that it takes nearly as much air as my Highland Pipes. (once I finaly make my own Mouthpiece, I plan for it to take AS much air as my pipes, and be as loud as unhumanly possible) Actually, I would attribute my jump in reed strength on the pipes to a bit more gut busting strength… to all the practice I get in playing my “thing” whistle.

6

picardy,

this might need some getting used to, but in the whistle world more expensive doesn’t mean better. I admit that high-end whistles have a certain shine to them that makes me want to own, to caress, and to collect them, but I make music with cheapos just as well.

If someone thinks they are toys, get Mary Bergin’s Feadoga Stain and ask them if this sounds like toys.

I don’t like the Sweetone, though. Maybe you should spend $50 and get a fair sample of low-end whistles (Clarke Natural, Feadog, Walton LBW, Walton Mellow and some non-D Generations in both brass and nickel, just to name the ones I know. Oaks are recommended frequently as well) to get a feel for the variation possible, and find out what you like. You’ll get a nice high-end whistle for the remaining $250 later if you still want to.

Sonja

7

That sounds like a great idea!

8

WHoA claims another victim! :laughing:

Seriously though, this does sound like a very good idea. Different whistles can have very different sounds. Breathiness is just one component of the sound of a whistle. Getting several different cheapies can help you get a feel for the factors that make up the overall sound. Also, listen to the tunes at Tin Whistle Tunes (aka Clips ‘n’ Snips) at http://www.tinwhistletunes.com/clipssnip to get an idea of what many of the whistles sound like.

Once you have a feel for what you like, talk to the craftsmen of the higher end whistles and tell them what you are after. Most of them are very willing to work with you to produce a whistle you will like. Talking to the maker and being able to articulate what you want is very important.

As an example, Mike Copeland makes what is considered by many to be a very fine whistle. However, if you don’t talk to him and just place your order, your resulting whistle may be very breathy, very pure or somewhere in between. If you do a search here for Copeland you will find widely differing descriptions of these whistles. If you talk to Mike and tell him what you want though, you can wind up with an outstanding whistle that sounds the way you want it to.

9

I took the advice and purchased two more whistles. I ordered (all sop D’s) a Feadóg and a Clarke original. The Feadóg on my cd sounds sort of breathy so I thought I’d try it. I love the breathiness of the whistles. That is why I think if I just bought a Overton or Copeland, I might be disappointed. They sound kind of pure on the cd - not so breathy.

I feel the WhOA slowly creeping up my leg and into my chest. It burns! Is there some sort of cure?!? :slight_smile:

10

Wow, if your idea of pure is an Overton or Copeland, I shudder to think how you’d feel about a Rose or Susato. :slight_smile:

I think you’ll be happy with your Feadog and Clarke.

11

There is no cure! WhOA is a chronic condition, the pain of which can only be temporarily alleviated by the acquisition of a new whistle! :wink:

I second the advice given here. One of the beauties of the whistle is that you don’t need to spend a bundle to get a really nice instrument, and some of the very best players prefer cheapies. You CAN spend a bundle, if you love playing an instrument that is also a beautiful example of the craftsman’s art, but even then, it’s best to play a lot of different types of inexpensive whistles first, to get a good feel for what you really want in an instrument. One thing that may surprise you is you may find your opinion of various whistles changing the more you play. I have a couple that I really didn’t like much when I first bought them, but when I picked them up again a year or so later, I found that “they’d” improved remarkably (what had really improved, of course, was my ability to adapt to their particular characteristics).

I’m afraid you’ll always run into that “it’s a toy” attitude, especially if you hang out with classical musicians (no matter how expensive an instrument you favor). Heck, just the other day I was talking about our Morris troupe with some members of my choir, and the music director asked me what instrument I played. They were polite about it, but you could tell they were decidedly underwhelmed when I said I played the pennywhistle! No skin off my nose…I know the joys and challenges of my instrument, and if they can’t appreciate it, it’s their loss :wink: . I have been known, however, when someone is being particularly obnoxious, to casually hand them one of my more sensitive whistles and say “here…it’s so simple, you give it a try!” After a few false starts and unmusical squawks, I take it back and, just as casually, reel off a few measures of a jig or polka and say “see? nothing to it!” (mean, aren’t I?).

Redwolf

12

Well, my terminology may be a little off. I use the word pure meaning very little breathiness and full. This is why I don’t care for the Dixon. (Actually, I like it; it just depends on what I’m playing). I guess to me pure is more “flute-like” or as I said earlier “clarinet-like”. The few recordings I have of Overtons and Copelands sound pure. But on that same recording, the Susato sounds even moreso. Maybe they would sound different if I heard them live. Even though I am playing the whistle doesn’t mean my ear has learned what great tone for a whistle. In my younger days, I thought Taylor guitars had the best sound, but over the years, my ears have matured. I’m sure the same will happen with whistle.

picardy

13

I like breathy whistles for slower pieces, and pure whistles for faster tunes…today. Tomorrow I’ll probably change my mind again.

I would rate Dixons, Clarke’s Originals and Shaws as at the breathy end of the scale, Oaks, Feadogs and Susatos at the purer end. Generations & Clares somewhere in the middle. I forget where Waltons, Sweetones and Megs go, I don’t play mine very often. I really must get scientific on this, try them all in turn, and note their characteristics down.

There’s only one cure - buy more whistles. :smiley:

I thought I was cured last year, having at that time about 30 different whistles of various makes & keys, though only one that is rated as high-end (An Overton in low F). But already this year I’ve added 2 Shaws, 3 Dixons, a Nabi bamboo whistle, and a Susato VSB to my collection, plus dibs on 2 more Susatos in A and low G that Bloomfield is selling me. Mostly in non-D keys now, and in some cases looking for whistles for a particular piece or style of playing. I certainly have more whistles than tunes I can play :astonished:

14

I think WhOA is a better, or a cheaper disease than GAS (guitar acquisition syndrome).

It is a shame this little instrument isn’t more respected. It is so simple yet so complex. Andrés Segovia spent his life getting the guitar back in the concert halls and earning the respect of classical musicians with this “bar room instrument”. He was a little extreme, though. I guess the whistle doesn’t need to be a concert instrument, just a little acknowlegment that it is a real instrument and can be very difficult when played by a master.

15

The example I use with my fellow choristers is plainchant. Ostensibly, it’s very simple music, much of it on a single reciting tone. Compared to the Rennaissance music that is our specialty, it appears, to the uninitiated, to be almost childish in its simplicity. Little do most people realize it’s considerably more difficult to sing WELL. We can learn a Palestrina anthem in an hour, but spend weeks getting a chanted Psalm just right. Done poorly, chant is rather dull to listen to,done properly, it’s ethereal. Anyone who can read music can reproduce the notes in a chant, but it takes lots of practice and skill to make it something worth listening to.

The whistle is kind of the same idea. Most musicians (and even many non-musicians) can learn to get a scale out of one almost immediately and play a simple tune or two within an hour…but it will be a while before anyone will care to listen to what they play, and one can spend a lifetime learning the nuances of the instrument. That’s one of the things I like best about it :slight_smile:

Redwolf

16

I think you’re probably on the right track thinking of the Abell, although a Grinter is also a good breathy sounding whistle and may be a bit cheaper.

Abells do varry in how breathy they sound. I’ve had two and one was very breathy while the other was much less so. You can also varry this to some extent (more than other whistles I’ve played) depending on how you blow them.

Both are what I would consider medium in the air requirement category.

-Brett