Here’s the latest in the Groovewhistle project… Soprano D with a copper tuning slide. Man is this little thing loud!
I used a new technique (for me) and put a wooden shim in the top of the windway. This makes the whistle require very little air to play and gives a nice backpressure feel. In places where I’d be running out of air on the Waltons D I still have a half a lung full on this one and it’s half again louder than the Waltons to boot
I’m too tired tonight to run it through its paces, but I can’t wait to set up a mike and try it on a real, live whistle.
I continue to be impressed with how generous the whistle builders on this board are with knowledge that, as business people, you could justify keeping to yourselves.
Best wishes,
Jerry
P.S. If you’ve been reading my posts, you probably see that understanding and tweaking the way a whistle plays fascinates me. I’m not ready to make my own whistles, and with so many established and up-and-coming makers out there, I may never feel the need to make a whole whistle, but it’s nice to know I could if I wanted to.
Thank you very much Serpent! That should help out greatly! Tuning is a big thing with me and so far I’ve only been using the measurements that the flutomat spits out at me and then only adjusting if something sounds way off to me. I could tell the little blue guy was off a bit, but hadn’t played it enough to figure out where. This will pinpoint it… Thanks again!!!
You’re absolutely right Jerry! It is awesome to have builders that are willing to share such information… completely awesome in fact!
I’ve been thinking about your shim, back pressure, volume as reported in your first post in this string.
Something you might try is, instead of a shim at the top of the windway, try making the bottom of the windway curved to match your cutting edge and experiment with how far above the windway floor your cutter is, trying to keep the size of the windway about the same as before to maintain the desirable back pressure you’ve created.
Some sources say you want the windcutter edge about 45% of the way up from the windway floor, but not all whistles are built like that, and I’ve been noticing that with the cutter edge lower you get less breathiness and more music for the air you put into each note.
Just a remark to Jerry and Mike - and you’re both very welcome! There are quite enough poorly-tuned whistles out there!
I share stuff in the hopes that others will share with me, when they find things that make my whistles better, or my life in the shop easier. As you both know, building a good whistle is by no means as easy as it looks. Building and tuning a thousand identically-good whistles mostly by hand, is a major undertaking, even using machine tools for some of the “grunt work”, and requires a level of dedication to the task that is less than desirable for those who want a few cool whistles of their own to play. Most folks who make 'em onesies and twosies, do so to get a key they can’t afford, or just to get the personal satisfaction of playing something they made with their own hands. That’s actually how it began with me.
Getting to the point: I, Paul, Stacey, etc., don’t feel threatened by other people making whistles. It’s a big world out there, and the output from a hand-making shop is very limited. Plenty of potential customers for all of us, and more growing up every day. If you want to join us, welcome to the block!
Cheers,
serpent
Yes, there are too many poorly tuned instruments already! I put my Gen and my waltons up against your tuner proggie and they were both pretty dissapointing. I’m going to do some tuning on the little blue guy this evening and I’ll repost the clip when I get it done (if I don’t screw it up horribly and have to start over. )
Thanks for the welcome! I hope to get there one day. It seems the more I build the more I find that I could be doing better. This is not a bad thing or ever discouraging. It’s a time of fascinating discoveries and input from other builders is greatly appreciated! I’m glad you and the other builders don’t feel threatened by new builders. I’m sure that if I ever reach the same point that I will feel the same. It’s all about the whistles anyhoo right!
Ok, news for tonight is that I redesigned the mouthpiece. It’s much more comfy now!
The bad news is that the tuning was far enough off that I’m going to have to make a new body for it. So since my son has been asking me for a whistle, I painted it red and I’m giving it to him. I’ll build a new one for myself and spend a little more time getting the tuning down… I did manage to get it really close to being in tune with itself, but the entire whistle is a bit on the sharp side…
I didn’t notice its being out of tune on the first clip, but the second clip sounds better. It may be a combination of being better in tune and I like that melody better. Did you do anything else that could have affected the sound of the whistle? It just sounds really good. Very nice voice, not noticeably breathy, excellent matching of the registers. Really good.
I didn’t change anything other than tuning and the shape of the mouthpiece. The fipple plug didn’t move when I cut the mouthpiece so I really don’t think that would affect sound.
I did have a few hours playing time on the whistle though and have started to figure out what it wants out of me as a player. The upper register likes to be pushed a bit. Not overly, just a bit
As Inspector Gadget would say… Wowsers! I really love the sound on the second clip. That’s exactly the kind of tone that I adore. If you ever get around to making some to sell, even just to us Chiffers, I’d be really interested.
Awesome job! I’m sure your son will love it (especially the color).
As you continue prototyping, I would like to suggest that you start looking for another fipple material. The traditional material is cedar, because cedar is both moisture and mold/mildew resistant. If you use another wood, you will likely run into problems over time as the wood degrades due to moisture.
I wouldn’t be inclined to use a coating on the wood to try to solve that issue. “Every interface is a potential breakdown,” and a finish on the wood adds one more component that could eventually deteriorate.
I would be more inclined to look for a polymer (Delrin/acetyl would be the logical candidate) that wouldn’t need to be protected. It’s not hard to find sources on the Internet using Ask.com or another search engine.
Whenever I design something I build (I’m a cabinetmaker/woodworker/general craftsman), I look for ways to eliminate every possible component that isn’t essential to the performance of the piece. There’s an efficiency and elegance that’s achieved when a design has been distilled to the point that every detail is there because it contributes to the calculated result, and no detail is superfluous.
What I’m thinking about here, is whether it’s going to be necessary, as you make more of these, to paint every whistle, or if the materials you use might be beautiful by themselves. Also, the fumes from finishes are quite toxic, and I’m concerned about the exposure you and your family would be subjected to.
The painting/powdercoating option may be an important marketing consideration. Look at how excited people get about the different color choices on the Elfsong whistles.
My inclination would be to see how beautiful they could be without having to invest the time/effort/money/dead brain and liver cells it would take to add a finish to the whistles. If the demand is already for more whistles than you can make, there’s no need to worry about paint/powdercoating. However, if you find that you need to boost demand, and offering colors actually does boost demand, then you would want to look for the least toxic, most cost/time efficient way to get it done.
I’ve seen how they look unpainted after a couple of days. The pvc tends to collect dirt very quickly and in only a couple of days of playing they look horrible…
I’m painting with a laquer paint that is supposedly safe for use on childrens toys and I do all the painting outdoors and they dry in the shed…
Yeah, I liked the blue better too, but my boy is nuts for the color red. I really liked the blue after I oversprayed it with black giving it a mist effect… I think my next one will be the same.
Oh, and I already have a lead on acetal rods for the fipple plug. I’ve put in an inquiry to see if the cost will be greatly different if they are already the size I need or I should just get the next size up and turn them down myself… I will eventually be using the stuff though. The wood is just too unstable.
I’ve seen how they look unpainted after a couple of days. The pvc tends to collect dirt very quickly and in only a couple of days of playing they look horrible…
I’m painting with a laquer paint that is supposedly safe for use on childrens toys and I do all the painting outdoors and they dry in the shed…
Yeah, I liked the blue better too, but my boy is nuts for the color red. I really liked the blue after I oversprayed it with black giving it a mist effect… I think my next one will be the same.
Oh, now that I realize that the whistle is PVC and not all copper, I guess you wouldn’t be able to powdercoat it anyway. I think that you can only powdercoat metal because it is put on the metal by way of magnetization (is that a word?) and then the item has to be baked at in an oven. The PVC would probably melt! What a mess that would be.
It sounds like you are being careful with the process you are using so, We will allow you to keep doing it. Ha Ha
The over spray of black sounds really neat. If you do one please post a pic.
Most folks who make 'em onesies and twosies, do so to get a key they can’t afford, or just to get the personal satisfaction of playing something they made with their own hands. That’s actually how it began with me.
