Before the age of RyanAir and Computers many Irish school kids had to pass the ‘Leaving Cert’, similar to the High School Diploma or the A Levels - but many never got that chance; instead they got a one ticket to London’s building sites, or similar.
Some of the Dubliners songs describe the life of these ‘fusileers’.
Those lucky enough to get to the real exam would be ‘set up’ for ‘aizy street’ at home, but often they became the recipients of cash sent home by their less well educated brothers and sisters.
The cream of that generation today are Ireland’s Enron all running away with the money from BOI and the rest.
Perhaps the Leaving Certificate means a great deal more than we could have guessed?
I’m curious about all of this. Are you saying the cream of the crop is making money in Ireland (working in Ireland) and then leaving? To do what? Are they going for better jobs elsewhere? I’m picturing Ireland and the rest of Europe as becoming homogenized due to the ‘global economy.’ I wonder if any country will retain a national identity outside of tourist memorabilia (made in China). I mean everyone plays Irish music nowadays.
We left Dublin in the 60’s due to no job prospects for my dad. Went to Toronto, then, California. (No idea if he had a leaving cert or not.) Things worked out well, here. He had steady work as a truck driver and I went to college (at my own expense). A handful of my first cousins (all brothers and sisters) went to Australia. I heard that their mother said she despised Australia because it took her children from her. I don’t know what they do there. They flew back to Ireland when she was seriously ill, and then soon again for her funeral. Most of my cousins living in Dublin are doing fairly well; not all of them went to college. One bunch from my mother’s side spend half their time living in New York and half in Dublin.
Is it regretable that countries are less provincial or insular? That they’re losing some sense of differentness? I suppose some things will be lost that can never be regained, but I’m thinking it’s inevitable. (Of course, when you talk with the oul fella’s, they’ll tell you ‘good riddance’ to the poverty and all the rest. My dad used to go on about how poor people were and how “you just wouldn’t believe the rain,” when you asked him if he’d ever like to move back.
Tony
Some questions for Toasty:
How old are you?
Did you get your leaving cert?
What’s BOI?
Why did you make this post?
Feel free not to answer, if you so choose.
I read that twice Tony. About the Irish thing, they used make kids learn Gaelic by making it conditional for passing the Leaving Certificate, IOW fail Gaelic and you fail the exam.
My point is that most Irish people got the shaft while those at home sucked the life out of the corrupt system there, so reading the Irish Times report that the cream of the crock of that generation had taken the money ( BOI etc ) and ran was no surprise to me. Did you ever read about the BOI scandal back east? Anyway having hired a Russian to manage their foreign ops BOI were screwed to the wall for billions.
California may have been a welcoming place for your folks but when I went out there in the 80’s the place was crawling with ex Ukers who seemed to me to be all illegal AND very anti Irish. But OC that was years ago.
BTW I had my stuff stolen in LA at the time and I suspect the gang that took did it were all Poms … so nowadays we call the place Wallyhood…lol
2 The Leaving Certificate was not required outside of Ireland where we lived but I understand your concern; maybe if you moved over there and learnt Gaelic you’d get a nice ‘gig’ paid by the State to play the Pipes drink Guinness and talk ‘Irish’ to the natives?
3 Bank Of Ireland
4 This month is Leaving Certificate time for Irish kids and the same bullshit is going on today - ie the kids with real talent leave .
BTW if you don’t believe me you should go read about hundreds of Irish emigrants who made a lots of money in Oz and the UK during the post war years.
Uh…from what I can ascertain, Irish students STILL have to pass the LC, and Irish is still a part of the test. It’s also a part of the regular school curriculum.
Well that is not exactly correct Redwolf, they have to PASS the Gaelic in order to pass the rest of the exam; IOW fail Gaelic and they fail the entire exam.
So what’s the problem? They STUDY Irish in school, for heaven’s sake! I don’t see a problem in requiring a basic proficiency exam for a required subject. This is beginning to sound like the complaints parents are making here about algebra being required on the California high school exit tests.
This is in no way representative, but, I spent a year in the Dublin public school system when I was 8yrs old. That was coming from Toronto. I was dropped into the middle of Gaelic lessons given by the Christian Brothers. The only thing I learned was fear of the Brothers. The other boys didn’t seem to have much over me in the way of fluency and we certainly weren’t influenced toward enthusiastic learning. It was straight memorization of spelling the words without any insight into what letter combinations formed what sounds. And, it was done by intimidation. 3 wrong answers on your spelling test, 3 whacks with a cane or leather strap on your hand. That was back in 1963. (But, you know, there was no anger in the teachers, it just seemed like a business relationship.)
Tony
The problem is that less than 1 percent of the Irish people speak or use Gaelic and like all minority languages, outside of it’s locale, is absolutely useless; added to that, not having the Leaving Certificate in the UK for example can restrict job opportunities.
Thats like you having to learn a dialect of Cherokee and pass an exam in it, to get your US highschool diploma.