Let’s talk jigs, and metronomes first. Is is one click of the metronome per bar? Two? I’m used to talking about so many beats per minute, but I find that I’m not really sure what tempo I play at. I set my clicker to about 110, but I play two beats to the measure. So am I really playing at 110 or at 55?
Now reels get more interesting, because I play them 1 beat to the measure, and on tunes I know I get to about 95. So am I playing at 95 or 190?
NOW…lets normalize and just say that I set the metronome on jigs so that I’m at one beat per measure…55. I’m playing 6 notes for every click, and I feel as if I’m really pushing my limit. but I’m doing the reels twice as fast, 8 notes each… why am I so much slower on the jigs?
Maybe because there is a lilt, a yaaa-di-da yaaa-di-da to jigs. You can do that with reels, too (and should imho) but the faster you go the straighter reels are going to get: I think that’s because the lilt slows you down (not a bad thing).
But I am a bit puzzled by how you count reels: I do two beats per bar for both jigs (three eigth-notes each) and reels (four eigth-notes each).
In music notation, it’s not one beat per measure. The time determines what kind of note gets one beat. In 6/8 time, it’s three notes per beat, two beats per measure; 9/8 time gets three notes per beat, three beats per measure. In 4/4 time, it’s 4 beats per measure (for reels, that’s 8 eighth notes per measure) So, if you have been doing reels at 95, with one beat per measure, you have actually been playing at 380 beats per minute, not 95. Since it’s impossible to tap your foot that fast, most people convert it to two beats per measure (cut time, if it’s not already marked that way–looks like a “cents” sign) with 4 eighth notes per beat, effectively 190 bpm. If your jigs are 55 beats per minute, one beat per measure, your real time is 110 beats per minute. So you’ve been playing faster than you have been giving yourself credit for!
The time of reels seems to be an everlasting source of confusion. Some people claim they are in 4/4 and some claim that there are only two beats per measure. It depends. I prefer to think of them with two beats. Listen to an accompanist who accompanies reels with a four-to-the-bar accompaniment. Two that come to mind are Shetland’s Willie Johnson and the late Tich Richardson of Boys of the Lough. Both give the impression of swing guitar playing ala Freddie Green. Willie Johnson uses swing chords. A boom-chuck type of accompaniment used by a guitar or piano usually has four chords or notes per measre - two booms and two chucks but the overall feeling is two because the booms are heavier than the chucks. At any rate, if you play one count per measure and set your metronome at 95, you are playing way beyond any speed that I’m capable of or that most people would play even in a fast session.
For those who may not be familiar with 4/4 swing backup of reels, try listening to Paul Kelly’s Dresden Set at the Mandolin Cafe MP3 site. The backup for the set of three reels has a four-to-the-bar feel to it. Quite different from what you might get with a guitar player like Daithi Sproule. The Dresden set is close to the bottom of the page. You could compare that with some swing playing like Crazy Rhythm.
Well, THAT doesn’t sound like me, and I don’t keep up with most reels in session (and it is very fast, occasionally slipping over to too fast and on some nights moving to way too fast, ). So something weird is going on.
Lets back up…set the clicker at 110 and play a jig set at 2 beats per measure, we can call that playing at 110 bpm, right? This sounds okay to me, as I can manage to keep up at a slightly higher tempo on jigs I know well. I’ve read that most reels and jigs are played at between 120 and 140, so I have a sort of goal. But this leaves me wondering about the reels. If I set the clicker to 120 and play at 2 beats per measure I’m really dawdling. Maybe I should record and post a clip.
I put on Mary Bergin playing Mrs Crehan’s ( a reel). I’d say that’s fast playing. I can’t do it. Not on that tune anyway. I tried to get the tempo with my metronome. I’d say it’s in the low-mid 130s at two clicks per measure. Maybe someone else will also check it and see if I’m right.
I have played banjo with old time fiddlers who accused me of playing too fast. I tried playing a tune as fast as I could on the banjo and I can play fast. I couldn’t manage much above 130. Again, two clicks per measure.
Playing reels at 130 beats per minute is way, way, way too fast. 113 is what dancers look for. 120 is a good quarter-past-midnight small-session advanced-player tempo. Any faster than that, and it starts to get stupid.
It’s all about groove, not tempo. You can play blazingly fast, but if you’re not making people tap their feet, nod their heads, move their bodies around, you’re doing it wrong.
Tyghress, I think there must be some kind of misunderstanding going on here. 120 beats per minute is two beats per second. A reel measure is 8 eighth notes, so with two beats per measure, you’re playing 8 eighth notes every second. Doesn’t that sound reasonably fast?
Do you remember the “fruit explanation” of dance tune rhythms? Basically, sing(/say) “WAtermelon WAtermelon” to sing a measure of a reel (each watermelon is the equivalent of 4 eight notes), sing “PINEapple PINEapple” to do the same for a jig.
So, with two clicks per second, you’re basically playing:
WAtermelon WAtermelon WAtermelon WAtermelon
with each click being half a second from the previous one. A reasonable reel speed in my book, but not slow by any means…
There’s never been a metronome built that keeps a steady beat. They all speed up at the hard parts of a tune. I don’t know how they know to do that. They also change tempo the minute you start playing.
Yes, but my question was about bpm, not tapping feet or nodding heads, or even groove or swing. In order to practice with other people you have to have a shared understanding of what you’re talking about.
I’m something of a hack, of course, so don’t rely on this but I think 95 to 98 bpm is a great speed to aim for in reels. It sounds lovely, is satisfying to listen to, it compliments the tune rather than the skill of the player. When I’ll be able to really nail the rolls and keep the beat steady and the groove smooth, then I’ll try pick up the speed a bit when keeping up with a session.
Yes, but my question was about bpm, not tapping feet or nodding heads, or even groove or swing. In order to practice with other people you have to have a shared understanding of what you’re talking about.
Right, sorry, I was responding to SteveK not being able to manage much about 130 beats per minute. Should have quoted.
Hey that’s not fair! It’s been bugging me too. Or is it one of those “you really don’t want to know” kinda things? Like when you asked your mom what was in the stew.
