Agreed Dave… but I’m still trying to find someone talk about a ‘wide bore’ flat pitched chanter. How would they play ??
They are scaled down concert pitch chanters which have all the bad characteristics of hte concert chanter but lack all the good things of a flat chanter. Some pipemakers that didn’t get the point make them.
YEAH MAN…!!!
Peter.. I knew you had the background to shed light on this subject… THANK YOU!!
Let’s get back to narrow bore. Why are there so few narrow bore D pipemakers then??
Thanks for the replies, once again this had cleared up a lot of head-scratching I’ve been doing.
On 2002-02-01 02:38, Dave Parkhurst wrote:
…imagine a cello versus a trumpet… that’s a flat pitch/narrow bore chanter versus a concert pitch (wide bore) chanter. Flat pitch chanters are sexy sounding, calm and very warm in tone.
Dave, this is what I’ve been wanting, the sweetness and expressiveness of Monet, but I’ve been painting (to run with the metaphor) with Warhol’s pallet.
I’ve found it quite frustrating to be limited to ungentle sounds, but it sounds from what you all have said that a flat chanter may well be the way to go. It feels like the set I’ve got has an on/off switch; the note is either sounding or it’s not, there’s not much room for the swooping and calling I can hear in my head and in the CDs I’ve been listening to.
Now, where can I find a flat set chanter that won’t take 10 years to get to me? (ye gods, 10 years!) I’ve a practice set already, if the only thing I need to switch is the chanter… well and the reeds… and my ears… argh, who let me start playing these things anyway?
Mark,
do not jump on that bandwagon too quickly. Whether you and your pipes sound good is to a GREAT extent up to you. And it is very likely that you will never be completely satisfied with how you play. Switching chanters at an early stage (I presume you have not been playing the pipes for too long) might well leave you in frustration.
I would encourage you to keep on practicing, listening to good players and exchange opinions with fellow pipers. Time will come when you know exactly what you want and where your preferences lie. Piping is what the Irishman had in mind when he invented the proverb “When God made time, He made a lot of it”
Christian
On the other hand, if you have an image of the sound yoy like, why struggle on on a unsatisfactory concert set if you can make life easy by finding a good (and there’s there problem you will have to solve) flat chanter. Musical instrument versus foghorn in my opinion. Make sure you make an informed desicion though, not because we are saying this here.
Geoff Wooff made a narrow bore D as an experiment around 1985. A few makers have followed the example. I have seen and played a narrow bore D Alian Froment made to Dave Hegarty’s specifications based on (I believe) an old instrument owned by Breandan Breathnach.
The truth of the matter is that the narrow D chanter has never really caught on and remains a bit of a hybrid, it’s OK but still lacks the appeal of a lower pitched instrument.
Peter Laban wrote: Geoff Wooff made a narrow bore D as an experiment around 1985. A few makers have followed the example…
The truth of the matter is that the narrow D chanter has never really caught on and remains a bit of a hybrid, it’s OK but still lacks the appeal of a lower pitched instrument.
Peter Laban wrote: Geoff Wooff made a narrow bore D as an experiment around 1985. A few makers have followed the example…
The truth of the matter is that the narrow D chanter has never really caught on and remains a bit of a hybrid, it’s OK but still lacks the appeal of a lower pitched instrument.
But why?? aren’t most session tunes in D??
Well, a lot of PIPE tunes are in D, but if you spend any time in sessions, you’ll learn that a variety of keys are used. D major, Dminor, G major, A minor, A major, B minor, and E minor are the most common.
Why aren’t narrow bore chanters more common? I think Peter did answer the question, but here it is again: they’re a hybrid. Being pitched in D, they don’t sound as good as a lower-pitched instrument and they’re too quiet to play with more than one or two other melody instruments at any time. Most pipers figure that if you’re going to end up playing it solo anyway, you may as well get the most appealing instrument you can afford. For most pipers, this is a C or a B instrument.
Likewise, if you’re going to be playing in groups of three or more, then it makes sense that you should be able to hear yourself. Wide D chanters can be made to behave themselves, but it takes a lot of work, fine adjustments, listening, and most of all playing.
Consider the intentions behind the two designs: Narrow bore chanters developed during a period of time when the piper played solo and often in small spaces, where volume was trivial but sweetness of tone wasn’t. Wide bore D chanters were a response to a new environment: big theaters and dance halls in 19th century America, where a piper needed volume to be heard.
“Wide bore D chanters were a response to a new environment: big theaters and dance halls in 19th century America, where a piper needed volume to be heard”
Perfectly clear Pat… thanks for the clarification.
Peter, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that concert D chanters started catching on with the ones made by Rowsome, in a time when essentially noone was making pipes anymore. If you’re the only one making something, the way you make it is probably assumed to be the only way/most popular way. I agree with Peter on some things: narrow bore chanters are a treat to the ear, won’t make the dogs dysfunctional, and are a bit less fussy than wide bore ones…but not of much use in a sessiun. However, most beginners if wise won’t try to drag out their pipes in a sessiun for several years unless there’s a very sympathetic audience.
I thought I’d throw in my bit and mention that Seth Gallagher(who seems to be a reputable maker) sells sets in B and C. The description on the website (http://www.uilleann.com)
says they are flat-pitched, but it doesn’t say say narrow-bored. The description of the chanters also uses very similiar wording to what has been used on this discussion. So to come to the point: Are Seth Gallaghers B and C chanters the sort of chanter you are all talking about, and are these particular ones reputable?
Nate
[ This Message was edited by: energy on 2002-02-06 01:13 ]
Ditto… Gallagher uses what I’d call a ‘generous’ narrow bore. Still has the characteristic timbre of a narrow bore, but has a bit of a punch on the bell note. Great chanter, I have a 1/2 C set of his and like it.
Seth is making some of the finest pipes you can get anywhere, as far as I’m concerned. I played his B set at a Tionol in Chicago and liked it instantly; the chanter had a good singing voice, the drones were terrific, the regulators were solidly built with superb action, and everything was nicely in tune and balanced quite well. A young piper friend of mine grabbed them soon after and you couldn’t get him away from them. I could get used to that set very quickly.